Foro Flamenco


Posts Since Last Visit | Advanced Search | Home | Register | Login

Today's Posts | Inbox | Profile | Our Rules | Contact Admin | Log Out



Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.

This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva, Tom Blackshear and Sean O'Brien who went ahead of us.

We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.

Update cookies preferences




Montoya’s baritone Flamenca?   You are logged in as Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >>Discussions >>Lutherie >> Page: [1]
Login
Message<< Newer Topic  Older Topic >>
 
D.A.

Posts: 44
Joined: Feb. 9 2025
 

Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? 

I think he’s playing a baritone Flamenca in this video. The strings are tuned down to B standard here. There is no way you can tune down that low on a standard scale instrument and the strings would stay in tune. He brings it up to D standard when he places a capo on the third fret.

Thoughts?

Is it a custom made Ramirez baritone guitar?

https://youtu.be/NEq5ZINEN9I
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2026 16:51:29
 
rombsix

Posts: 8319
Joined: Jan. 11 2006
From: Beirut, Lebanon

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to D.A.

I think it's a combination of the capo and high tension strings that feel floppy because of being tuned down. It's not a baritone guitar.

_____________________________

Ramzi

http://www.youtube.com/rombsix
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2026 18:33:55
 
Echi

 

Posts: 1279
Joined: Jan. 11 2013
 

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to D.A.

It's an Arcangel Fernandez, probably tuned lower than 440 today's standard
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2026 20:21:20
 
Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3550
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to Echi

According to this https://www.londonguitarstudio.com/s/arcangel-fernandez-luthier
Arcangel Fernandez was born in 1932, so he would have been only 17 or18 when Montoya died in 1949.

The reference also reports that Fernandez apprenticed to Marcelo Barbero in 1954, but I believe he didn't put his name on labels until after Barbero died in 1959.

RNJ
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2026 20:55:54
 
ernandez R

Posts: 889
Joined: Mar. 25 2019
From: Alaska USA

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to D.A.

I don’t know guys… looks like strings 2-6 are metal wound?

Was a good listen this morning though as I watch the snow falling.

HR

_____________________________

I prefer my flamenco guitar spicy,
doesn't have to be fast,
should have some meat on the bones,
can be raw or well done,
as long as it doesn't sound like it's turning green on an elevator floor.

www.instagram.com/threeriversguitars
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2026 21:03:51
 
constructordeguitarras

Posts: 1772
Joined: Jan. 29 2012
From: Seattle, Washington, USA

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to D.A.

I agree with Ramzi.

Gosh, that playing almost makes me appreciate Manitas de Plata more.

_____________________________

Ethan Deutsch
www.edluthier.com
www.facebook.com/ethandeutschguitars
www.youtube.com/marioamayaflamenco
I always have flamenco guitars available for sale.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2026 21:19:27
 
Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3550
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to Richard Jernigan

Oh...Carlos Montoya? Sorry. I was thinking about flamenco.

Carlos is said to have played flamenco at one time, but the solo stuff...?

RNJ
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 31 2026 0:57:52
 
Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3550
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to ernandez R

quote:

ORIGINAL: ernandez R

I don’t know guys… looks like strings 2-6 are metal wound?

HR


Savarez used to make--maybe still does--2nd and 3rd strings with a solid nylon core, wound with nylon. I vaguely recollect they may have made a metal wound third with a multi-filament nylon core like ordinary 4th through 6th. I used the nylon wound 3rd on my first guitar, a $24 job from Paracho. It had a 690mm scale (not a typo). I tuned it down a step and capoed at the 2nd fret. It was loud, but not particularly flamenco sounding.

RNJ
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 31 2026 1:06:13
 
kitarist

Posts: 1812
Joined: Dec. 4 2012
 

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to Richard Jernigan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Jernigan

Oh...Carlos Montoya? Sorry. I was thinking about flamenco.

Carlos is said to have played flamenco at one time, but the solo stuff...?

RNJ




_____________________________

Konstantin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 31 2026 4:24:47
 
orsonw

Posts: 2231
Joined: Jul. 4 2009
From: London

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to kitarist

Not sure about B standard tuning (or Carlos Montoya), but tuning low E down to B is no problem on a standard scale guitar.
You can see Cano Roto, Nunez, Roman Vicenti etc.. and many others using a low B. E.g. playing bulerias, seguiriyas etc.. por granaina with a low B.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 31 2026 9:37:00
 
Ricardo

Posts: 16331
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to Richard Jernigan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Jernigan

Oh...Carlos Montoya? Sorry. I was thinking about flamenco.

Carlos is said to have played flamenco at one time, but the solo stuff...?

RNJ


This whole scenario is a joke we have discussed in the past. Rubber band strings so the left hand can go widdly widdly widdly and impress non guitar players and novices to the genre. It is quite embarrassing.

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 31 2026 14:03:11
 
D.A.

Posts: 44
Joined: Feb. 9 2025
 

RE: Montoya’s baritone Flamenca? (in reply to Ricardo

Haha we know. But the guy did sell millions of records.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 31 2026 16:42:00
Page:   [1]
All Forums >>Discussions >>Lutherie >> Page: [1]
Jump to:

New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software powered by ASP Playground Advanced Edition 2.0.5
Copyright © 2000 - 2003 ASPPlayground.NET

6.347656E-02 secs.