RE: Is Spanish always better than none Spanish.

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Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: Is Spanish always better than no... (in reply to Florian)

David Bowie...eat your heart out dude...

quote:

nobody else can make music like this

Yeah, to play like that, you've really got to hang around and jam with those sorta Eurovision guys for years and years to get that authentic Euro-vibe....

cheers,

Ron

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 4 2011 15:02:10

Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: Is Spanish always better than no... (in reply to Guest)

quote:

Take Ricardo for example....How the X&@%$ could you tell the difference between his playing and someone from Spain?

Agreed, rumbaking,

But Ricardo works on a practically daily basis with Spanish Flamencos, as well as going to Andalucia every year.

Which is a lot different to just sitting in your bedroom listening to CDs and watching videos, although a lot of study with those materials will take you pretty far.
(Remember...not ALL guitarists in Andalucia are good, some are terrible.)

At the end of the day, if someone is happy with what they are doing just as a hobby and what they are doing is competent and good, then IMO there is no reason for them to bust their ass and make themselves frustrated and unhappy trying to get to a level where they are rivalling Tomatito.

cheers,

Ron

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 4 2011 15:06:50

GOLDJACOB

Posts: 1
Joined: Dec. 5 2007
From: LONDON

RE: Is Spanish always better than no... (in reply to Ron.M)

I tink its important to learn from the sourse.....but also know where your own roots are(sometimes its hard to know what they are but i tink our bodys know more than our minds).....only copying somthing is never enoughf.Flamenco is universal.....something in our guts.....
Mybe non andaluce Guitarists would do well to try dancing flamenco a bit....could help get physicly inside the music more?
I really belive flamenco will be a big thing one day out side of spain to....but will probebly have to be reinvented....not by one person but by many who slowly make it there own.(not fusion! like somthing welded together...but from the grass roots...with respect for compass etc)
Forget trying to be spanish if your not!
When the hell is somone going to grab the bull by the horn and sing some down to earth...salt of the earth flemenco in english?

for eg.
I love Spanish flamenco.....I study spanish flamenco.....but ultimutly I try to let flamenco flow through me from were I am coming from......easyer said than done though :D

I think the rock n roll comparison is interesting....english blues became somthing new eventuly...heavey rock etc... it tranformed and blosemed into somthing new.....not better but different.
Flamenco will grow into differant cultures(it all ready has...sort of) when thing grow they change shape dont they?

Can a non spanish play like a spanish? I sure some people can...but the question is Why? what for when you can chanel it through who you are.

chears...

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 4 2011 18:02:22

mark74

Posts: 690
Joined: Jan. 26 2011

RE: Is Spanish always better than no... (in reply to Guest)

Great post

I think language is part of it too though. We are focusing on guitar in this forum, but 21st century flamenco culture is totally integrated with 21st century Iberian culture and the Spanish language...lyrics and contemporary cultural and political issues are all tied together

I find American players, no matter how good they are, are generally either focused on Paco-style flamenco-jazz fusion or they get hung up and fascinated with the roots and culture of the old world gypsies......its a very limited and dated perspective

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 5 2011 18:27:02

mark74

Posts: 690
Joined: Jan. 26 2011

RE: Is Spanish always better than no... (in reply to GOLDJACOB)

Thats an interesting thought but I think it would be difficult to adapt flamenco to English

I could be wrong though....a thread on this forum proved it could be adapted to Arabic and Turkish rather easily and the best flamenco singer Ive ever heard in the States is Cuban-American raised in Miami

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 5 2011 18:34:13

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: Is Spanish always better than no... (in reply to Ron.M)

Whatever. But while discussing if a non spanish can play as a spanish...keep in mind that spanish also have to work hard to be able to play good. 'There are tons of spanish players who suck. And in relation how many spanish people play in comparison to all spanish people who exist, Im pretty sure we foreigners of spain are ahead with good players per own inhabitant.

Problem solved. Close the thread.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Feb. 5 2011 20:04:39

Paul Magnussen

Posts: 1805
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)

RE: Is Spanish always better than no... (in reply to Ron.M)

quote:

Juan Martin says he was born in Malaga....(same as Tomatito)

Sorry to be so late with a reply, I’ve been digging through the old posts.

This archived Discussion post from Wikipedia may be relevant:

quote:

Hi All I was very interested in that blanked discussion of Juan Martin's nationality. I was at school with him 1959-61, we were both boarders at The Grammar School, Midhurst, West Sussex, England. Ukbn2 had a couple of points wrong, but his basic assertion was correct. Juan's name then was John Newman not John Martin and he came from Shoreham in Sussex not Brighton. When I knew him he had no trace of a Spanish accent. I do not know where he was born and so cannot rule out some Spanish ancestry: but if there was some I was not aware of it. John Newman was frequently in trouble for going without permission to the nearby town of Chichester in order to take flamenco guitar lessons. Another ex-schoolmate, Jerry Fox, used to go with him. John's main aim at the time was to get to Spain in order to learn flamenco guitar properly, and this he evidently did after he left Midhurst at the age of about 16. Ukbn2 is right that Juan Martin's Sussex background is common knowledge in that part of the world. A number of people have mentioned it to me. None of this detracts in any way from the fact that he is a very fine guitarist.Vennfam 04:43, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Here's the URL:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Juan_Mart%C3%ADn&oldid=131222520

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 2 2011 17:07:27

Kate

Posts: 1827
Joined: Jul. 8 2003
From: Living in Granada, Andalucía

RE: Is Spanish always better than no... (in reply to Paul Magnussen)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Paul Magnussen

quote:

Juan Martin says he was born in Malaga....(same as Tomatito)

Tomatito was born in Almería.

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Emilio Maya Temple
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 3 2011 12:45:08

Paul Magnussen

Posts: 1805
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)

RE: Is Spanish always better than no... (in reply to Kate)

Don’t blame me, I was quoting Ron M. on Feb. 3

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 3 2011 17:00:08

Estevan

Posts: 1936
Joined: Dec. 20 2006
From: Torontolucía

RE: Is Spanish always better than no... (in reply to Kate)

quote:

quote:

[ORIGINAL: Paul Magnussen]

quote:

Juan Martin says he was born in Malaga....(same as Tomatito)

[REPLY: Kate]

Tomatito was born in Almería.