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NEW CDS YIPPEEE
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John O.
Posts: 1723
Joined: Dec. 16 2005
From: Seeheim-Jugenheim, Germany
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 RE: NEW CDS YIPPEEE (in reply to Stu)
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From Wikipedia:
quote:
In dance, having had no time signature at one time, the rondeña displays a rhythm of wild abandon. Some dancers have used the rhythm of the taranto, which has many similarities but, being rondeña, more open and evocative.
I always thought, though freely played, the time signature is pretty clear. Taranto is 4/4. Rondeña, related to fandangos, is danced 3/4. You can hear the 3/4 in every tremolo por rondeña ever played...
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Oct. 16 2007 14:46:15
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Ricardo
Posts: 14855
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
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RE: NEW CDS YIPPEEE (in reply to John O.)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: John O.
From Wikipedia:
quote:
In dance, having had no time signature at one time, the rondeña displays a rhythm of wild abandon. Some dancers have used the rhythm of the taranto, which has many similarities but, being rondeña, more open and evocative.
I always thought, though freely played, the time signature is pretty clear. Taranto is 4/4. Rondeña, related to fandangos, is danced 3/4. You can hear the 3/4 in every tremolo por rondeña ever played...
Rondeña cante is very close to Malagueña/Verdiales type stuff. Hard to tell the difference if you dont' know that melody. Guitar accomp is same like Verdiales etc, in E phrygrian.
But the Rondeña on Ramon Montoya's album tuned as menioned, became a standard that guitar solo variations are based, but has NOTHING to do with the cante equivalent. It really is free so the rhythmic parts are sometimes 3, sometimes 2 or 4, etc, it is very open. The unwritten rule of tremolos in free palos are supposed to be in 3 is standard, a way to remember Fandangos which most of the free forms are bases on. But really there is no rule so a tremolo in 2 or 4 would not make any aficionados say "wrong". Taranto is a free fandango type melody, but when danced in 2 or 4, the compas is important, and no one says that it is "wrong" do dance that in 4.
Granainas is often loosely based in 3 too, another fandangos type form. I had to play a bit of Granaina for baile. It was not meant to be real rhythmical. I added a tremolo in that key that was in 4, and no one was the wiser (meaning the dancers nor the singers), and it fit real nice to what they were doing. In another concert I played for a gypsy singer, his solo was granaina. I did that tremolo in 4 and he had no probs with it, so I never thought much about it. Last year a friend was in Manolo Sanlucar's workshop and said some guy played granaina super free and Manolo said "no it is all wrong, you have to make Granaina feel like 3". So there you go. But his Rondeña tremolo is certainly not in 3. Nunez has a great tremolo in 3 that he leaves a beat pause so it feels like 4 for sure.
Oh also, I just remembered a weird "rondeña" on Carmen amaya's record that she sings but it is in 4 and certainly not like the Verdiales melody. I will listen again to see what was going on there.
Ricardo
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Oct. 16 2007 15:51:12
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Adam
Posts: 1156
Joined: Dec. 6 2006
From: Hamilton, ON
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RE: NEW CDS YIPPEEE (in reply to Ailsa)
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quote:
Me too. I'm so jealous of Kate and Harold, and Pimientito. One of my dance teachers really loves Sevilla - she says it's her favourite city - but I didn't feel as comfortable there as I do in Granada. Perhaps because it's a smaller city? Dunno, it just felt 'right'.
You got plans to go again Adam?
Oooh, I'd like to someday, but it's not as easy to get from the U.S.A. to Spain as it is from England to Spain...I actually flew through London each way so basically it's a trip from NYC to London on top!  We'll see, though, I might be working in Europe this summer (hopefully) so who knows? Can you make it down there often, since the flight's so short?
My choice for the past summer was between Granada and Sevilla, and having been to both now (although Sevilla only for a weekend) I'm so glad I chose Granada! Yeah, Sevilla's too hot in the summer, no mountains, seems less personal...Granada is just quite comfortable, I think :)
The Ochando looks interesting!!
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Date Oct. 17 2007 18:25:36
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glad to hear it. 
just that right now London flamenco scene needs you ! 
