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RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green label worth restoring?   You are logged in as Guest
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orsonw

Posts: 1967
Joined: Jul. 4 2009
From: London

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to Stu

quote:

count 7 crosses back from the fret board. theres a double up on one row of tiles.


Yes I see it. So much for my "more precise and better made" !
Still I think it's better than the Atocha!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2024 15:55:38
 
silddx

Posts: 629
Joined: May 8 2012
From: London

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to orsonw

quote:

Yes I see it.


And yet the castellations are even.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2024 16:40:10
 
Echi

 

Posts: 1140
Joined: Jan. 11 2013
 

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to orsonw

Nice guitar, thanks for the pictures.
That rosette, inspired to a Simplicio, basically was not made anymore after 76 as Faustino started outsourcing the rosettes. It was proposed again in 1989 by the Felipe V shop but then definitely abandoned.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 8 2024 23:36:19
 
Ricardo

Posts: 15028
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to Echi

quote:

ORIGINAL: Echi

Nice guitar, thanks for the pictures.
That rosette, inspired to a Simplicio, basically was not made anymore after 76 as Faustino started outsourcing the rosettes. It was proposed again in 1989 by the Felipe V shop but then definitely abandoned.


The thing I never understood about old Condes is that they would often, but not all the time, allow finish to cover the Rosette, essentially ruining whatever color scheme had been chosen. If it was standard procedure to cover all the rosettes, I would never have known this. But it is the ones that they kept blocked from color finish, only clear coat, that pop out.

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 9 2024 11:12:40
 
orsonw

Posts: 1967
Joined: Jul. 4 2009
From: London

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to Ricardo

quote:

The thing I never understood about old Condes is that they would often, but not all the time, allow finish to cover the Rosette, essentially ruining whatever color scheme had been chosen.


The orange finish often ruined the whole guitar not just the rosette

Here's a 1990 Felipe V. Looks like they chose to leave the rosette alone and just ruin the guitar!



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 9 2024 11:52:07
 
orsonw

Posts: 1967
Joined: Jul. 4 2009
From: London

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to Echi

Thanks for the reference to a Simplicio rosette, I didn't know that.
Here's a 1931 Simplicio:



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 9 2024 12:08:32
 
Echi

 

Posts: 1140
Joined: Jan. 11 2013
 

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to orsonw

@OrsonW:
It's a lovely pattern: later on it was used few occasions by Fleta and then again by Niguel Rodriguez in the sixties.

@Ricardo
The problem here is the strong orange: the stronger the colour the higher and unnatural will be the contrast with a plain rosette colour pattern: now we got accustomed to the effect but in the early seventies it should have been a ne flavour.
Things changed a little in the end of the seventies when the Conde started to outsource many rosettes in Germany (Karin Rost still sells some rosettes with old Conde patterns): some new rosettes reflected a certain middle-european taste for not stained wood or black and white patterns, with the result that you could apply the orange finish with less concern and without the need of using sealing tape on the rosette in some spray sessions. I like some of them.
FeliPe Conde later on rediscover the old Conde and Esteso motifsand offered them in the guitars sold in Calle Felipe V, while the guitars made in Gravina after 1990 made use of pre-made rosettes.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 9 2024 12:13:03
 
orsonw

Posts: 1967
Joined: Jul. 4 2009
From: London

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to Echi

I wonder if the Gravina 7 Conde tie block inlay not reaching the ends of the block was also inspired by Simplicio? Here's Simplicio, I have also seen this on Fleta.



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 9 2024 12:15:12
 
Echi

 

Posts: 1140
Joined: Jan. 11 2013
 

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to orsonw

quote:

OPostReply.

I'd say The school of Barcelona: Enrique Garcia, Francisco Simplicio and Fleta

BTW: That rosette pattern was at first made by Enrique Garcia, the teacher of Simplicio and imho a guitar builder at the same level of Santos:

https://www.siccasguitars.com/shop/guitar/enrique-garcia-1920/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 9 2024 12:20:31
 
orsonw

Posts: 1967
Joined: Jul. 4 2009
From: London

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to Echi

quote:

I'd say The school of Barcelona: Enrique Garcia, Francisco Simplicio and Fleta

BTW: That rosette pattern was at first made by Enrique Garcia, the teacher of Simplicio and imho a guitar builder at the same level of Santos:


Thanks. I see the Conde mosaic is a direct copy of this 1920 Enrique Garcia:



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 9 2024 13:37:15
 
Firefrets

 

Posts: 115
Joined: Mar. 22 2023
 

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to silddx

The action looks higher than 3.25mm in the pictures to me, and there isn't much break angle behind what's left of the saddle, so she might need a bit of help. I like the tuners actually. Do you know what they are?
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 15 2024 19:05:35
 
silddx

Posts: 629
Joined: May 8 2012
From: London

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to Firefrets

Hello, no idea what the tuners are, but they are listed as replacements.

I didn't bid, seemed to risky without being able to inspect it first.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 15 2024 19:45:18
 
JasonM

Posts: 2084
Joined: Dec. 8 2005
From: Baltimore

RE: Is this 1964 Conde Hnos green la... (in reply to silddx

I’m late to this , but going back to the Conde that already sold, those bridge wings looked really, really thin.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 15 2024 21:11:33
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