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Real Men
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Morante
Posts: 2230
Joined: Nov. 21 2010
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 RE: Real Men (in reply to rombsix)
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quote:
I'm sure that they can play with just the same level of soniquete and earthy feel as Paco del Gastor
Really? Just listened to Manuel Valencia accompanying Jesús Mendez, sobrino de La Paquera in Jueves Flamenco and it was horrible. Endless silly falsetas which had nothing to do with the cante. A guitarrist has to know how to accompany el cante, antes de todo.
How many times have you heard cante en directo with a variety of tocaores? The majority want to be concertistas and play long falsetas while the cantaor goes to sleep.
Last night, I went to see Ye Ye de Cádiz, accompanied by El Niño de la Leo. Usually, when Joaquín plays I do not go, because I cannot bear his long and horrible falsetas.
But Ye Ye is a real cantaor, de Cádiz but formed in the tablaos de Madrid. He knows that the cantaor should dominate the tocaor if there is no mutual feeling. So Joaquín abandonded his stupid falsetas and played only rhythm, apart from his trademake alzapúa.
A great night, thanks to a gran cantaor, who knew how to dominate a mediocre tocaor.
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Date Aug. 25 2016 14:59:56
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Piwin
Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
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RE: Real Men (in reply to Morante)
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About a month ago, during a juerga, I was filling in on the cajon when one of the singers literally pushed me off the instrument, grunting "tu no sabe", and started playing himself. The guitarist and singer, who had asked me to play, both stopped mid bulerias, and a heated argument ensued between pretty much everyone there, while I went out for some fresh air not wanting to have to deal with that sadly too common aspect of flamenco. It's sadly an offshoot of this "real men" mentality. Some stupid need to dominate, to show you have big balls or whatever.
I have made more than my share of mistakes accompanying, and still do. All of them the result of ignorance or just plain misunderstanding on the cues I'm getting (or not) from the singer. I'm always grateful to those who try to lead by cooperation, who will nudge you in the right direction if they feel you're doing something wrong. At least with them I learn something, and I'm sure not to repeat the same mistake next time. Then again, I can't imagine what it's like to sing and have a guitarist willingly not following your lead. If he can't take a hint, maybe sometimes they really do have to cut in and there's probably some truth to what Morante was saying, about "lionising of guitarists". But then again, I've far too often been on the other side of that, where a simple glance would have done the trick, I would've got the point and adapted accordingly, but no, the singer had to go batshit crazy...
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Date Aug. 27 2016 18:27:04
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BarkellWH
Posts: 3464
Joined: Jul. 12 2009
From: Washington, DC
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RE: Real Men (in reply to Piwin)
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quote:
It's sadly an offshoot of this "real men" mentality. Some stupid need to dominate, to show you have big balls or whatever.
Not to derail this thread from flamenco, but a variation of this "real men" mentality are those jerks who show up at Donald Trump rallies with automatic weapons hanging down over their butts to show that "real men" carry guns to defend against the "Guv'ment," which to them is the enemy. Likewise the idiots who practice "survival" training in preparation for the showdown with the Guv'ment, the UN, or whoever the "enemy du Jour" happens to be. Real Men indeed.
Bill
_____________________________
And the end of the fight is a tombstone white,
With the name of the late deceased,
And the epitaph drear, "A fool lies here,
Who tried to hustle the East."
--Rudyard Kipling
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Aug. 27 2016 19:09:24
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Knowing that we have fantastic tocaoras like Laura Gonzalez, you still pull rubbish like this? 
