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This is why I dont want to travel to Paracho   You are logged in as Guest
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daffeey

Posts: 115
Joined: May 20 2012
 

This is why I dont want to travel to... 

http://www.cnn.com/2013/03/27/world/americas/mexico-violence/index.html?hpt=hp_t2



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from the city of angels
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 28 2013 14:26:52
 
Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3436
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

The five decapitated heads incident occurred a couple of months after I was there the last time. The Bar Sol y Sombra was, probably still is, a nice place in the western part of downtown Uruapan. A guy came in with a brown sisal bag and dumped five human heads on the dance floor. He said, "Maybe this will teach you cabrones to play on both sides of the fence."

The bartender was quoted in the New York Times as saying, "It pretty much ruined the whole evening."

To me, the dangerous thing is this: Mexico is much more prosperous than it was when I first started spending time there almost 60 years ago. It cheers me up to see people so much better off. And people are still as warm and friendly as ever. But in a lot of places, Michoacan being one of them, the sh1t can hit the fan at any moment.

It breaks my heart. I really love Mexico, but I certainly wouldn't ask my young good-looking blonde friend to go there with me--and I don't think she would go if I asked her.

RNJ
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 28 2013 17:08:24
 
mark74

Posts: 690
Joined: Jan. 26 2011
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

Mexico is almost getting as bad as Chicago
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 29 2013 3:19:19
 
Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

It's a shame, a lot of people are not willing to visit their family down there, really ****ty for the people stuck there in the middle of it.

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\m/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 29 2013 4:05:54
 
daffeey

Posts: 115
Joined: May 20 2012
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

I have been wanting to take my dad now for like five years now. Seems every year it gets worse in Uruapan, which is the closest city to Paracho.

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from the city of angels
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 29 2013 4:57:39
 
Grisha

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

Yes, it's a great shame. I will perform in Monterrey in April and it's not safe at all there either.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 29 2013 5:05:02
 
daffeey

Posts: 115
Joined: May 20 2012
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to Richard Jernigan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Jernigan

The five decapitated heads incident occurred a couple of months after I was there the last time. The Bar Sol y Sombra was, probably still is, a nice place in the western part of downtown Uruapan. A guy came in with a brown sisal bag and dumped five human heads on the dance floor. He said, "Maybe this will teach you cabrones to play on both sides of the fence."

The bartender was quoted in the New York Times as saying, "It pretty much ruined the whole evening."

To me, the dangerous thing is this: Mexico is much more prosperous than it was when I first started spending time there almost 60 years ago. It cheers me up to see people so much better off. And people are still as warm and friendly as ever. But in a lot of places, Michoacan being one of them, the sh1t can hit the fan at any moment.

It breaks my heart. I really love Mexico, but I certainly wouldn't ask my young good-looking blonde friend to go there with me--and I don't think she would go if I asked her.

RNJ




That's crazy - and my 6ft 2 pocho butt would stick out like a sore thumb as well.

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from the city of angels
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 29 2013 5:06:13
 
Ricardo

Posts: 15039
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

Look, none of the decapitated were gringos looking to buy guitars. Just take a gun and a machete and you will be fine. guey

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 29 2013 5:52:39
 
JuanDaBomb

Posts: 189
Joined: May 18 2011
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to Ricardo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricardo

guey


LoL!

Personally, I wouldn't want go, not worth it. But if I did, I'd stay 2 days max, then get the hell outta there. The assumption being that they will notice outsiders, and they will assume you are carrying a roll of cash to pay for your new guitar. They'll learn what hotel you're staying at after the first night. The second night they'll break into your room and go stab-happy on your delicate sleeping figure in the bed. Only after you've been dispatched will they begin to look for your fat stacks. Come to think of it, it's probably safer to sleep in the closet and put some pillows under the blankets to make it seem like you're still in bed. That way you can peep through the keyhole and witness the type of death you will endure, while you wait to be found in the closet.

My 2 cents.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 29 2013 6:22:06
 
Ricardo

Posts: 15039
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to JuanDaBomb

quote:

They'll learn what hotel you're staying at after the first night. The second night they'll break into your room and


and get a double barrel sawed off shotgun in the chest and a machete carved spleen removal. Assuming i forgot to hang my sign on the hotel room door..."do NOT disturb- drug dealer killing cannibal vampire tired from long day of guitar hunting in paracho guey...".

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CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 29 2013 7:24:03
 
Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3436
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to Ricardo

This is a young Dutch guy we met in Patzcuaro, a few miles from Uruapan. We were sitting in the outdoor part of a restaurant on the main square for the mid day meal. He was at the next table. We struck up a conversation, invited him to sit with us. As usual, Larisa broke the ice, and soon had him talking.

The next day I was feeling poorly. He and Larisa went on a tour around the lake. She reported he was friendly, respectful, intelligent, they had a good time.

He was doing everything right. He dressed unobtrusively, stayed at inexpensive lodgings and traveled on public transportation.

A couple of months later we had an email from his parents in Holland. His body had been found in southern Mexico. His passport was on his body, but no money. At first the Mexican police reported that there were drugs in his body, then it transpired that there had been no tests.

The parents were frustrated by the lack of information and constantly changing story from the cops. I gave them an intro to some well connected people in Mexico City, but nothing ever came of it.

I have travelled many, many times by myself in Mexico since I was 17 years old, 58 years ago. I never heard stories like this until the last few years.

RNJ



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 29 2013 16:37:24
 
BarkellWH

Posts: 3462
Joined: Jul. 12 2009
From: Washington, DC

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to Richard Jernigan

My family's roots go deep into Mexico. My grandfather was superintendent of the Santa Fe railway in Northern Mexico during the revolution beginning in 1910. I have his photos of the revolution, from armored trains with troops to corpses hanging from telegraph poles. I, myself, have traveled to and within Mexico from the time I was 18. That was 52 years ago. I have traveled by train, plane, car, often to Mazatlan and the Pacific coast, but elsewhere along the Sea of Cortez to places such as Puerto Penasco. I now would travel by plane to well-traveled destinations, and I might travel by train to some spots. But I surely would not travel by auto anywhere in Mexico.

Mexico has not changed that much in terms of official transactions. It was always, and still is, corrupt to the core. From the highest officials to the petty clerks, everyone gets "la Mordida" (the bite) (backsheesh, bribes) if anything is to get done. The Federales are among the most corrupt, the army less so. The only thing that has changed is the rise of the narcotrafficantes. They are the reason for the extreme rise in gruesome murders. The Federales are useless because they are as corrupt as the narcotrafficantes. The army is the only force that has shown some "cojones" in this fight.

In my opinion, the problem is not the Mexican drug growers and producers. In certain respects it is not even the narcotrafficantes. The problem, my friends, lies right here in the United States with our demand for drugs. It is demand that fuels production, not the other way around. We have met the enemy, and it is us. Problem is, we want to blame everyone else: Mexico, Colombia, Afghanistan. We don't want to face up to the fact that we are the primary cause of the drug trade with our insatiable demand.

Cheers,

Bill

_____________________________

And the end of the fight is a tombstone white,
With the name of the late deceased,
And the epitaph drear, "A fool lies here,
Who tried to hustle the East."

--Rudyard Kipling
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 29 2013 17:49:58
 
Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3436
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to BarkellWH

The "corruption" in Mexico has been the normal order of business throughout my lifetime, and according to stories I have heard, it was during the lifetimes of my father and grandfather. As far as I know, it has been the normal order of business all the way back to colonial times, when it was the order of business in Spain as well.

Being a firmly embedded element of culture, it seemed to me not to be a serious impediment. Its added cost was probably offset by tax evasion, etc.

In 1961 two friends and I spent the summer camping out in Mexico. Out in the country we went well armed. This was normal in those days. No one took offense. It probably saved us some trouble on one or two occasions.

When we planned to spend six weeks in the jungle in Yucatan and Quintana Roo, we visited the U.S. Consul in Merida. He was in his mid to late 30s, a Kennedy "New Frontier" appointee. After a half hour of discussion, he seemed to conclude that we knew what we were doing, and relaxed a bit.

In fact, he relaxed enough to tell us a sad story, and to ask my advice.

They entered Mexico by car at Nuevo Laredo, he, his wife and young children and his Spanish mother-in-law. His diplomatic passport had been sent to the Foreign Ministry in Mexico City. At the time, Mexico did not recognize the Franco government of Spain. Mexican Immigration refused entry for his mother-in-law. Upon presentation, they also seized the passports of his wife and children.
Attempting to return to the USA, they were refused entry, because they had no passports. Stuck on the bridge, they finally realized that their only recourse was to bribe the Mexicans. They probably would have paid a lot less if they had proposed to pay right away without causing trouble, and in the process revealing they could probably afford a nice sum.

They went on to Mexico City. collected his diplomatic passport, and made the drive to Merida, something of an adventure in those days. Promptly upon setting up shop in Merida, the Consul was visited by the head of Immigration for the State of Yucatan. Woefully, he explained to me, he was beng shaken down monthly over the status of his mother-in-law. It wasn'nt a totally unaffordable sum, but it was enough to sting. And he seemed to think it was not in keeping with the dignity of his post. Did I have a suggestion?

My suggestion was that he invite the immigration guy in for a cup of coffee when he came, have his secretary give him the money in an envelope as he departed, and send him a little present at Christmas time.

This was seen as corruption by the Consul, seen by me as the normal course of business to deal with a potentially difficult problem.

What is new to me in the last ten years or so is the greatly increased level of violence against foreigners, and the savagely depraved barbarity of the criminal element. Mexican outlaws used to be lot classier. I think the Colombian narcotraficantes have been a bad influence. Nothing against civilized Colombians, of course.

RNJ
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 0:08:28
 
BarkellWH

Posts: 3462
Joined: Jul. 12 2009
From: Washington, DC

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to Richard Jernigan

quote:

Woefully, he explained to me, he was beng shaken down monthly over the status of his mother-in-law. It wasn'nt a totally unaffordable sum, but it was enough to sting. And he seemed to think it was not in keeping with the dignity of his post. Did I have a suggestion?


Having myself spent a career as a US diplomat, I can only conclude that the American Consul in Merida who spoke to you must have been incredibly naive and uninformed. I can assure you that all he would have had to do was inform our Ambassador in Mexico City and the US Department of State of the attempt by the Yucatan immigration chief to shake him down for "la Mordida." The Ambassador would have taken the issue up with the Foreign Ministry in Mexico City, and the Yucatan immigration official would have been forced to back off by his own government. Foreign governments are acutely aware of reciprocity, and they generally observe diplomatic protocol, as they expect reciprocal treatment by Washington. I cannot believe the American Consul was so dense that he had not brought the issue up with our Embassy in Mexico City. I have seen similar attempts to extract bribes, especially regarding duty-free importation of effects by diplomats, and they are easily resolved by involving high level host government officials by the Embassy. If the American Consul's experience, as related by you, is any indication, I doubt that he had an illustrious career in the Foreign Service.

Cheers,

Bill

_____________________________

And the end of the fight is a tombstone white,
With the name of the late deceased,
And the epitaph drear, "A fool lies here,
Who tried to hustle the East."

--Rudyard Kipling
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 0:44:32
 
Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3436
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to BarkellWH

quote:

ORIGINAL: BarkellWH

quote:

Woefully, he explained to me, he was beng shaken down monthly over the status of his mother-in-law. It wasn'nt a totally unaffordable sum, but it was enough to sting. And he seemed to think it was not in keeping with the dignity of his post. Did I have a suggestion?


Having myself spent a career as a US diplomat, I can only conclude that the American Consul in Merida who spoke to you must have been incredibly naive and uninformed. .


The Consul didn't strike me as exactly, shall we say, a man of the world.

I had (still have) no experience of the world of diplomacy. Stiil, the Yucatecan Immigration guy did have on his side of the scales the PRI's (the party that unilaterally ruled Mexico for 73 years) vehement opposition to the Franco regime. Could he not have parlayed this into the deportation of the Spanish mother-in-law, who entered the country illegally in the first place? Could the U.S. Ambassador have prevented the deportation of an illegal alien? If he could have, how would this have played out in Merida? How would the people the Consul dealt with every day have reacted to a guy whose illegal mother-in-law was kept in the country by a Yanqui power play?

Perhaps the Consul could have been seen as a generous husband, keeping his mother-in-law in the country to please his wfe. I have to admit, an alternate interpretaion occurred to me, and I was careful to keep a straight face. Maybe the Mexicans would have thought he was pussy-whipped, and as a result exploited by the Immigration guy. Probably some Mexicans looked at it one way, some looked at it the other.

Maybe the Immigration guy was screwing the Consul. But maybe he was just handling a problem by his own discretion, in a way honored by centuries of custom. After all, the Immigration guy wasn't paid a decent wage. He had to make enough money somehow to keep his family in decent circumstances, and he had to pay his boss to keep his job. Irregularities in immigration status put bread into the mouths of his children. Maybe it never occurred to the Immigration guy that the money was coming out of the Consul's own pocket. Surely in a budget for a fancy office, a spiffy staff, electric typewriters, heavyweight stationery and all that stuff, there was a little slack for incidental expenses?

In any case, it looked to me like the Immigration guy had the Consul by the short hairs. The mother-in-law was illegal, no matter how you sliced it. The Consul had bribed her way into Mexico. She never would be legal in Mexico as long as she was a Spanish citizen, and she refused to quit being one. Might as well man up and pay like a gentleman. You paid the night watchman, or the burglars would get into your house. You gave the traffic cop his Christmas present, or your chauffeur woud get arrested on his way to pick you up. You bought the maid's daughter's school uniforms, because the maid couldn't afford them on what you paid her...a gentleman was expected to fulfill his obligations. If he took on an illegal mother-in-law of his own accord....

My advice, meditated upon for no more than 15 seconds, came from life long exposure to Mexican customs as a member of a Border family, and a total of three years' experience doing business in Mexico for my grandfather, starting at age 21.

RNJ
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 3:59:51
 
BarkellWH

Posts: 3462
Joined: Jul. 12 2009
From: Washington, DC

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to Richard Jernigan

quote:

My advice, meditated upon for no more than 15 seconds, came from life long exposure to Mexican customs as a member of a Border family, and a total of three years' experience doing business in Mexico for my grandfather, starting at age 21.


There was certainly nothing wrong with your advice, Richard. It was the Consul who made all the wrong moves, first by entering Mexico without his diplomatic passport (He's on a diplomatic assignment and he enters the country to which he's assigned without his diplomatic passport! What was it doing in Mexico City?!), second by bringing his mother-in-law into Mexico illegally, and third by not rectifying the situation via our Embassy in Mexico City. I don't think the Mexican Government would have denied the Spanish mother-in-law of a US diplomat entry, had it been done correctly. My first thought is, how did this character ever gain entry into the US Foreign Service? My second thought is, Merida may have been his first and only assignment, after which (one hopes) he was selected out of the Service.

Cheers,

Bill

_____________________________

And the end of the fight is a tombstone white,
With the name of the late deceased,
And the epitaph drear, "A fool lies here,
Who tried to hustle the East."

--Rudyard Kipling
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 10:13:00
 
BarkellWH

Posts: 3462
Joined: Jul. 12 2009
From: Washington, DC

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to BarkellWH

In discussing the traditional (and continuing) high level of corruption in Mexico, and the extreme danger of traveling in much of Mexico due to the viciousness of the narcotrafficantes, I mentioned in a previous post above, that the Mexican army has shown "cojones" in the fight against the drug cartels, and that the army has gained the respect of many observers. This is in stark contrast to the Federales, who are as corrupt as the cartels and are hopeless in the fight.

I would like to pay homage to another group of professionals in Mexico who have shown "cojones" as well. I am referring to a certain group of journalists who have demonstrated real courage in unmasking both the drug cartels and the official corruption that often supports them. Traditionally, Mexican journalists have been as corrupt as the Federales and other government officials. They were journalists in name only, being paid by the PRI or some other faction to write glowing stories (or to write derogatory stories about the opposition). But in the last ten to fifteen years, a select group of journalists has demonstrated real integrity and courage, and many have paid with their lives, being assassinated by cartel hit-men. these journalists are true heroes.

And I reiterate, the Mexican producers of drugs, and even the narcotraficantes and drug cartels, are not the main problem in either the United States or Mexico. The main problem is our insatiable demand for drugs. Those who use drugs in the United States and create the demand should go to bed at night reflecting on their complicity in the thousands of deaths in Mexico that result from that demand.

Cheers,

Bill

_____________________________

And the end of the fight is a tombstone white,
With the name of the late deceased,
And the epitaph drear, "A fool lies here,
Who tried to hustle the East."

--Rudyard Kipling
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 12:08:54
 
Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to BarkellWH

Bill, I don't have knowledge of this issue, but if the illegal drugs were made legal with a stroke of the pen, would the criminal activity and strife continue?

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 14:26:17
 
FredGuitarraOle

Posts: 898
Joined: Dec. 6 2012
From: Lisboa, Portugal

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to BarkellWH

quote:

ORIGINAL: BarkellWH

In my opinion, the problem is not the Mexican drug growers and producers. In certain respects it is not even the narcotrafficantes. The problem, my friends, lies right here in the United States with our demand for drugs. It is demand that fuels production, not the other way around. We have met the enemy, and it is us. Problem is, we want to blame everyone else: Mexico, Colombia, Afghanistan. We don't want to face up to the fact that we are the primary cause of the drug trade with our insatiable demand.

quote:

And I reiterate, the Mexican producers of drugs, and even the narcotraficantes and drug cartels, are not the main problem in either the United States or Mexico. The main problem is our insatiable demand for drugs. Those who use drugs in the United States and create the demand should go to bed at night reflecting on their complicity in the thousands of deaths in Mexico that result from that demand.

Right on.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 16:23:16
 
Ricardo

Posts: 15039
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to BarkellWH

quote:

In my opinion, the problem is not the Mexican drug growers and producers. In certain respects it is not even the narcotrafficantes. The problem, my friends, lies right here in the United States with our demand for drugs.


I am with you bill on most social and eco and governmental and historic points... but this idea is totally twisted. Americans, especially young people are preyed upon by dealers and the "demand" is created by THEM. Don't make it sound like yet again greedy glutenous Americans are the root of all evil. Organized thugs are gonna be around regardless what they peddle or do to rise from the gutter and try to feel empowered. Just so happens this drugs business is easy for them because it's cheap and safe (grows in South America etc) and young people can get hooked so damn easy. Just say no....trace it backwards and you end up in colombia. Maybe even Bolivia if you talking cocaine. "No you can't have our coca, it's important to us and you have bad intentions for it's use " simple as that if you looking for the root of the problem. But thugs will be thugs period. Which brings me to this:

quote:

Bill, I don't have knowledge of this issue, but if the illegal drugs were made legal with a stroke of the pen, would the criminal activity and strife continue?


Well think of it this way...did legalizing alcohol dismantle organized crime rings? No, of course it shakes things up, but as I said, thugs will be thugs it's that simple, and no need to point fingers at the wrong things.

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 16:34:55
 
clevblue

 

Posts: 120
Joined: Jun. 29 2012
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

I can only speak for the UK, but drugs here become a bigger problem year on year. Legalise so-called soft drugs like weed, but hard drugs aren't going to be affected by legislation, that would only encourage the development of different drugs and use would become more widespread resulting in more deaths. Just my opinion of course.

Education and the eradication of poverty and hopelessness. That's a world-wide problem that has to be tackled first, drugs would then become less attractive
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 16:41:19
 
Grisha

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

Ricardo, don't make these young people look like victims. It was their choice to do drugs. Nobody forced drugs upon them. See, even if offered, I would just say no. People must be bored in this country...

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 16:46:08
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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 16:50:27
 
Ricardo

Posts: 15039
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to Grisha

quote:

ORIGINAL: Grisha

Ricardo, don't make these young people look like victims. It was their choice to do drugs. See, even if offered, I would just say no. People must be bored in this country...



That is in fact the only useful fight strategy they have since Nancy Reagan here in US. It's not so EASY to just say "no" as it sounds, trust me I have seen it all my life. It is a challenge for young people and is not made to show people as weak. After all lets say values that parenting can produce to a child, we all know of SOMEONE that even had something slipped into a drink at a party or was otherwise forced to get involved. Getting addicted to drugs is NOBODY's choice that i have ever met. I consider myself LUCKY to not be involved, not that the rest are all weak. Anyway, they will make a point to say rich party people are driving the economy of drug trafficking... sure THAT looks bad but look how many of em end up DEAD after all. THat was never the intent of even the rich. "Gee i got money so I better spend it on weed coke and speed etc" ....no man, they are easy targets too. Especially young artist/actor/athlete types. Boo hoo they have a choice right? Not always so simple.

Ricardo

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 16:53:41
 
Grisha

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

It's not easy to make the right choice, and I feel for the fullishly addicted, but the choice is still there. And you know, a lot of these youngsters try new things like drugs out of boredom, and yet another group is simply afraid to seem uncool around their smoking friends. That's BS.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 17:01:15
 
kikkoman

 

Posts: 108
Joined: Nov. 19 2009
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

there are those who have been dealt such a ****ty hand in life (eg inner city schools in detroit in chicago), that there will be a high tendency to become involved with drugs in order to escape their problems.

listen to this episode of this american life featuring harper high school.

a lot of young people simply cannot avoid gangster culture simply because it so ingrained into the status quo.

its very possible that you may have been able to resist but seeing the screwed up nature of certain parts of the world, its easy to empathize with those less fortunate than us.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 17:17:21
 
azamuner

 

Posts: 44
Joined: Jan. 22 2013
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to kikkoman

Using drugs is just an excuse for people who can't handle reality.

There is no real legitimate, non-medical, reason to use drugs.

Today's "me" generation is all about instant gratification and general aimlessness in life. It's a sad state of affairs.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 17:44:17
 
mark indigo

 

Posts: 3625
Joined: Dec. 5 2007
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to Miguel de Maria

quote:

if the illegal drugs were made legal with a stroke of the pen, would the criminal activity and strife continue?


check it out,

http://www.tdpf.org.uk/

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 17:51:52
 
mark indigo

 

Posts: 3625
Joined: Dec. 5 2007
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to azamuner

quote:

Using drugs is just an excuse for people who can't handle reality.


some people's "reality" is so sh1tty that numbing out on anything seems like a good idea at the time.

one study I read about found that something like 90% of heroin addicts living on the streets had been seriously physically and/or sexually abused as children.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 17:59:29
 
Grisha

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005
 

RE: This is why I dont want to trave... (in reply to daffeey

If one generation doesn't put an end to this vicious cycle, the problems will be perpetuated. These poor abused in their childhood people that turned to drugs, degrade and will now themselves have children and abuse them. It can's stop without THEM making a choice for themselves. And bringing back good family values and all that. Difficult. But can be done.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Mar. 30 2013 18:37:29
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