Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.
This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva and Tom Blackshear who went ahead of us.
We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.
RE: Flamenco is dangerous!! (in reply to Graham_B)
quote:
Now the organisers have asked for:
1. A detailed written risk assessment 2. Public liability insurance 3. Electrical test certificate if he wants to use his amp
I thought it was some sort of misunderstanding, and asked for clarification, but no.
Maybe there are some aspects of Lancashire I don't quite understand (and I say that as someone who "lived" in England for four months, or so, as an exchange student). But, Jesus Christ, what a pain in the ass. And they won't even bother to clarify? I'd cancel. The time spent writing up a "risk assessment" (not to mention figuring out how to write one, in the first place) and providing "public liability insurance" (who has that?!) is time better spent practicing and enjoying the art of flamenco guitar.
I'm all for "bringing flamenco to the masses", but that just sounds ridiculous.
Posts: 482
Joined: May 6 2009
From: Iran (living in London)
RE: Flamenco is dangerous!! (in reply to Graham_B)
It's like anything else in the UK. You want to fart, you'll have to have a Risk Assessment, Indemnity Insurance, Method Statement, Local Authority and English Heritage Consents, and the list goes forever. I work in the Rail industry; imagine the amount of bureaucracy we have to go through to put a nail on a wall; mind blowing!
RE: Flamenco is dangerous!! (in reply to Graham_B)
Certain branches must be put under societal supervision.
The irony is that out of all branches that should be conducted by superordinate aims instead have become leading in out-of-hand margins / radical profiteering. Those being medical supply and care, educational institutions and their fees and late policies, banking, real estate brokering / speculation and insurances.
Someone here remember the times when insurance fees used to be not too far from reasonable still, and when their lobbying hadn´t yet forced through insurance obligations to yet the last niche?
First they raised their fees to far above financial necessity of covering / reasonable budgeting and bureaucratic maintenance; but the affluence must have not been enough yet. Next, in the prinicpal way like of national manufacturers who went and engaged officials to introduce and raise import duties against competition, the insurance cartells instigated obligatory insuring in about any kind of professional conductment.
And with that hit two flies with one strike: For one the enforcement of overcharging insuring dues all over the place, and the escape of warranty in the same time.
So what things ended up with are totally overpriced fees and manifold ways for insurances to not pay, the minute the insurance taker has not fulfilled any of the countless preconditions of slick contracting.
Just as Hippocrates oath is dead long since, remaining ethical standards in concern of education and warranting have become exotic artifacts too. The insurcance branch, the pharmaceutical / medical supply branches and banking before all others are squeezing the living crap out of the people unchecked.
Their profits must be supervised and limited by law to have them go off people´s neck. Needless to say that above named branches together with the food branch are pragmatically due to official control and tame by the nature of their initial task. The latter in fact being the only one under official supervision, and even that being a farce as we know too well.
Anyway, to hell with insurance cartells pestilence.
RE: Flamenco is dangerous!! (in reply to Graham_B)
quote:
"For your own Risk Assessment you will just need to think about any potential hazard to other people due to the guitar case or guitar itself"
It's that phrase 'any potential' --as opposed to 'likely', 'probable', 'realistic', etc.-- that generates all of the extra work. And then, just to add insult to injury, they throw 'just' into the mix. ****ers.
RE: Flamenco is dangerous!! (in reply to Graham_B)
quote:
"For your own Risk Assessment you will just need to think about any potential hazard to other people due to the guitar case or guitar itself"
I would be inclined to send the following reply
1. The guitar is made of wood - potentially flammable 2. The guitar produces sound at various frequency and volume - public may require ear protection. 3. Guitar case is rigid and trauma proof - Public should not attempt to punch it, break into it with their bare hands or use it as a life preserver. 4. Guitarist will be sitting on a chair that may not have been inspected by health and safety inspector 5. Guitarist may recieve unfavorable audience reaction that threatens personal safety. 6. Music may cause emotional reponses in the public such as enjoyment, elevated or lowered blood pressure, relaxation or weeping - advise public with any kind of medical history at all not to listen. 7. Guitarist may get clasp of his watch strap tangled in the strings (that has happened ) 8. Guitarist may well use polish on his shoes that increases the risk of slipping over on stage. 9. Amplifier may well have a live electric current flowing through its circuitry if switched on. 10 Guitar case could potentially trap fingers of an elderly person inside, and potentially cause lower back or pelvic injury if it was mistaken as a potty.
11. Insurance assesor may well recieve a guitar related injury requiring services of a proctologist
RE: Flamenco is dangerous!! (in reply to Graham_B)
quote:
an equally "dangerous" classical guitarist
You cant trust those classical musicians. The news is full of carnage and meyhem that they leave in their wake.
On a serious note ( and bearing in mind I havnt been to the UK for a while now), are you saying that to do a gig somewhere you have to present a certificate of liability these days or is this just because its an elderly persons home?
Posts: 283
Joined: Jul. 10 2007
From: Leigh, Lancashire, UK
RE: Flamenco is dangerous!! (in reply to Graham_B)
quote:
are you saying that to do a gig somewhere you have to present a certificate of liability these days or is this just because its an elderly persons home?
The requirement for public liability insurance, risk assessments and electrical testing was imposed on the organisers by Wigan council who own the civic hall venue.
Having spoken to a couple of part-time performers I know, these requirements are often asked for by venues
RE: Flamenco is dangerous!! (in reply to Graham_B)
nice playing by Louis ole you know I hate to play in places like this such as restaurants because people dont pay attention and as they stop paying attention I usually start not caring of what i play whether I play paco or the easiest things on guitar , it will be the same for audience ... it totally sux
Printable Version
whether I play paco or the easiest things on guitar , it will be the same for audience ... it totally sux 
New Messages
No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages
Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages
Locked w/o New Messages
Post New Thread