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Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

Jose Cuesta 

This video was posted on youtube last year, but i couldn't find any link on foro , using the search function, so i thought i would post this.

this is probably the best Tomatito "copy" i have ever seen on youtube:

also check out his other videos, where he plays Paco falsetas



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 9:34:17
 
rombsix

Posts: 7839
Joined: Jan. 11 2006
From: Beirut, Lebanon

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

You're the YouTube king, Arash.

You must have a fast connection, and unlimited bandwidth.

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Ramzi

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 10:01:49
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to rombsix

yeah Ramzi, i guess without youtube and videos, i would simply die
yes, i have fast and unlimited connection. thanks to germany

here is a Paco video.
this guy is a machine.
but anyway, his technique and style is clearly fully Tomatito influenced ! you can see it clearly in his right hand, compas sets, etc.



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 10:39:41
 
rombsix

Posts: 7839
Joined: Jan. 11 2006
From: Beirut, Lebanon

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

quote:

yes, i have fast and unlimited connection. thanks to germany


You lucky blob!

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Ramzi

http://www.youtube.com/rombsix
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 11:02:21
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to rombsix

quote:

ORIGINAL: rombsix

quote:

yes, i have fast and unlimited connection. thanks to germany


You lucky blob!


yes man, i know.
same in iran.
slow connection, and expensive if you want fast and unlimited.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 11:31:53
 
Elie

Posts: 1837
Joined: Apr. 10 2010
 

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

no comment
he's amazing

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 11:43:57
 
XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005
 

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

OMG hes great. Some cano roto style rasgeos, no?
Hes playing these falsetas like nothing. Too bad hes not more famous. His skillz would definitely justify it.

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Фламенко
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 12:16:25
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to XXX

quote:

ORIGINAL: Deniz

Too bad hes not more famous. His skillz would definitely justify it.


is that something new in flamenco ? no.
how many badass players have we found just on youtube, playing in their bedroom and maybe play in some small gigs?
not to speak of those, who don't even post something on youtube.
i bet i found minimum 50 people during the years.

anyway, at least a small group really appreciate it and know and see what they can

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 12:48:57
 
stratos13

 

Posts: 222
Joined: Apr. 11 2005
From: Αθήνα

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arash

is that something new in flamenco ? no.
how many badass players have we found just on youtube, playing in their bedroom and maybe play in some small gigs?


I think this shows that originality is the main thing.
Having a great technique seems to mean nothing for not guitarists. People want to be moved by something, a nice melody or something.
Perhaps this is also a more mature way of seeing things
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 12:57:23
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to stratos13

quote:

ORIGINAL: stratos13

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arash

is that something new in flamenco ? no.
how many badass players have we found just on youtube, playing in their bedroom and maybe play in some small gigs?


I think this shows that originality is the main thing.
Having a great technique seems to mean nothing for not guitarists. People want to be moved by something, a nice melody or something.
Perhaps this is also a more mature way of seeing things


well, then we have to definde what "nice" means.

for me this shows that most people are moved by crap (which seams to be nice for them).

don't know what should be mature about that.

its exactly the opposite imo.
we live in a quite immature world.
most people just don't get it.
all they get is easy digestible stuff.
give them an A minor chord, and they are "moved".

its also not about technique. i mean we have nicely composed original stuff from unknown people which are also not appreciated at all.
there you have enough "originality". but same result.

but of course, i agree with you that technique is not important at all for not guitarists.

anyway , i don't want to blame people. its what it is. one have to accept it.
i mean 1 billion people are probably "moved" by christina aguilera or snoop doggy dog. but that doesn't mean that you have to adopt yourself to that.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 13:36:43
 
XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005
 

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to stratos13

"Having a great technique seems to mean nothing for not guitarists."

Because they may not even know the difference between a well played falseta and a f***cking amazing level of playing. Doesnt mean that we have to adopt "their" (non-guitarrists) views though. I dont mean this derogatory. It is logic that people dont know what technique means, they dont train their hands and ears for it. Why should they bother??? Likewise, i probably wouldnt know the difference between a well painted picture, and a f***cking amazing level of painting. And it doesnt bother me too. (hence i also dont go out and tell people whats good painting and what is not)

And to originality: I dont care for bad compositions, just because they are an own creation. That doesnt get any extra points from me.

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Фламенко
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 13:45:09
 
ashod

Posts: 227
Joined: Jan. 11 2006
 

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

Wow! impressive. He's not just a copy machine. He's emitting strong vibes too!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 13:49:04
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to ashod

quote:

ORIGINAL: ashod

Wow! impressive. He's not just a copy machine. He's emitting strong vibes too!


yeah, copy was probably a bad word and don't do justice to him.
what i meant is his amazing ability to play tomatito 100% like tomatito

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 13:58:17
 
Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005
 

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

The playing rocks. Nice find!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 14:03:13
 
HolyEvil

Posts: 1240
Joined: Nov. 6 2008
From: Sydney, Australia

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

*note to self* freaking practice more, toilet breaks and time to eat can be shortened.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 15:12:45
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to HolyEvil

quote:

ORIGINAL: HolyEvil

*note to self* freaking practice more, toilet breaks and time to eat can be shortened.


Si, such videos are always amazing and enjoyable,,,, but totally crushing and a kick in the a... at the same time.
I always feel like i am a student of Ottmar Liebert, after watching these videos.
Gladly that feeling changes to motivation after a while.



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 16 2010 15:20:15
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14927
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

quote:

yeah, copy was probably a bad word and don't do justice to him.
what i meant is his amazing ability to play tomatito 100% like tomatito


And along comes Ricardo. My typical stick in the mud shoot down everyone's happy day. He plays really good, good compas and feeling. When I see players at this level little details jump out at me as significant, though they are not apparent to everyone. Just the way I am sorry.

When I had the encuentro vid of Tomatito, it was one of the first I had seen, and maybe only the 3rd flamenco guitarist I had ever SEEN play after having listen to them a lot. I had some classical training at that point. We all know that the "teaching" on those vids is non verbal in most cases, they just play and demonstrate THEIR way. But remember most of those guys are model maestros.

Tomatito, the very first falseta he "teaches" I felt he was speaking directly to me there with that arpegio. And what he was showing me was "when we flamencos do this ami arp opposite the basses, we REST the thumb". It seems very subtle, but to me it was a huge concept. Nest I noticed ALL the maestro that I respected and try to learn from in flamenco, are doing the same thing. And conversely many self taught home grown players DON'T do it, so it means something to me as a student.

Anyway, at 2:48 there he is not doing it. There are other details in his versions of Paco too, but anyway you get the idea. I think he has great potential and should focus on some detail if he is going to copy SO MANY falsetas of the maestros.

Ricardo

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 17 2010 5:58:31
 
Elie

Posts: 1837
Joined: Apr. 10 2010
 

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

amigos does anyone know where can I get the sounds(or similar sounds) of palmas and percussion/Cajón, Jose is using while he's playing .
I mean solo percussion without guitar .
tnx

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 17 2010 6:59:47
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Elie

Good observation Ricardo.
I didn't even notice that.
But even if i had noticed, i guess i wouldn't dare to mention it :)

Dark, in the foro lots of compas loops were posted in the past. Really a lot of good stuff.
Look in the audio area and search function for compas loops and you will find a lot of stuff.

If you want to buy something, then there is this "Solo Compas" Series on CDs for instance

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 17 2010 7:33:41
 
edguerin

Posts: 1590
Joined: Dec. 24 2007
From: Siegburg, Alemania

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

quote:

yes, i have fast and unlimited connection. thanks to germany

Here where I live I've got but 17.6KB/s (so called DSL-light)

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Ed

El aficionado solitario
Alemania
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 17 2010 9:30:22
 
Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005
 

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

You´re right Ricardo he doesn´t copy 100% accurate. But is that a problem? I also don´t copy anything 100% coz of 2 reasons.

1 Many falsetas I just can´t play 100% as the original because I´m lacking i.e. good picado skills. Due to that I simplify with ligados or 3 finger picado.

2 One aspect of flamenco is to play unpredictable, to change anything you like (in respect to the rules of flamenco) and to surprise and maybe get a true jaleo. It´s the opposite of classics where trying to copy 110% is the non pus ultra. I think in flamenco it is even better to have an own version (even if simplified) than to copy 100%.

So I have to defend the player of this video. I think hes awesome and doesn´t need to change anything. Maybe only one thing. Everybody can try 1000 times till you get a falseta correct...to copy paste 10 different falsetas (who knows how many tries) to one video doesn´t surprise me as much as it would have been a one take. One buleria. That would rock the house much more.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 17 2010 9:55:51
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

Ed, do you have Cable there?
Where i live, the normal DSL was very slow (just like yours), but because i had Cable i could choose Unitymedia, so now i have DSL 20.000. But this was the only alternative.


Doit, don't know but i think what Ricardo meant, are really few details which would be no problem for a player of this calibre to alterate. I mean take the rest stroke thing for instance: it is quite easy to just rest the thumb on the next string in that arp. part. it is a habbit thing. but it gives you some overall benefits. correct me if i am wrong Ricardo.

also this rest stroke thing is not so much about copying someone, but copying a good and most effective way.

but i totally agree with you that its best to make everything your own version!
like play different falsetas from different maestros, but with your own distinctive style and version.
so in this part i fully agree with you.

also i have noticed that the more the player is good, the more "picky" Ricardo is, but this is good imo. there is always something little to improve. even Ricardo or anybody else can improve. as an observer from outside, watching somebody else (watching videos like here for instance), you can even see better than that person himself, what still could be improved (maybe some things which he overlooked without intention at the beginning, then just got used to it), yes, even if that person is a much better player than yourself.

the player here is really awesome. one of the best i have ever seen.
but man we are flamenco "freaks" , we always want to go in to detail as much as possible until nothing is left, otherwise we would just post "awesome" and see the next video. would be boring

btw, interesting, my top favourite part of the videos are not so much all the falsetas but this part: 2.37 - 2.47 in the first video awesome,

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 17 2010 10:26:31
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14927
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Doitsujin

quote:

You´re right Ricardo he doesn´t copy 100% accurate. But is that a problem? I also don´t copy anything 100% coz of 2 reasons.


it is no problem. I can only speak for myself. When I realize a musical or technical concept and try to apply it, I learn something. I realized early on that resting the thumb is not so easy, and there are reasons for working on it. To justify not doing it because "it's cool to be unique", well I would say in this case it is NOT being unique, quite the opposite. And to tell myself that is "ok to do my OWN way" thinking my own way was so cool and special, well, in my heart of hearts I know I am just not willing to put in the effort to do what I KNOW is right, or at least COULD BE better for me.

But that is just me. There is no "flamenco police" or rules about it or anything, just pointing out a small detail that I think puts things in perspective. If Tomatito saw this he would probably be impressed and simply say "ole muy bien tio!!" and leave it at that.

Ricardo

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 17 2010 13:48:21
 
HolyEvil

Posts: 1240
Joined: Nov. 6 2008
From: Sydney, Australia

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

Hi there Ricardo, when you say resting, do you mean the bit when he was playing with a free stroke rather than a rest stroke on 2.48?

cheers
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 18 2010 2:01:33
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to HolyEvil

quote:

ORIGINAL: HolyEvil

Hi there Ricardo, when you say resting, do you mean the bit when he was playing with a free stroke rather than a rest stroke on 2.48?

cheers


yes.
look at this video closley at 0.32 (the first few seconds are hidden behind the palmero though).



You see that he always rests his thumb on the next string (i.e. from A string on D string - A string D string,,,,, then from E string on A string, and so on...).

Also if there is no further string to rest on while doing such arps, thumb usually moves back above Bass E strings and rests there (unless there is no time for that )

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 18 2010 3:01:29
 
Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005
 

RE: Jose Cuesta (in reply to Arash

quote:

But that is just me. There is no "flamenco police" or rules about it or anything



You´re right I see it like you Ricardo. Well,.. I didn´t check the part where he doesn´t rest the thumb. So.. I meant it more in general. Yes,..I also always rest a finger if possible and never let the hand completely free coz of the control for spacing. Also for alzapua my ring or/and middle finger always comes back to the tapplate or to to the first string for orientation..So.. I guess you meant something like that.

Thats funny the term flamenco police is also used over here.. But the police are most often some dancers who pick on other dancers behind their backs...
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 18 2010 8:53:05
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