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**CANTE CHALLENGE ENTRIES**
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JasonMcGuire
Posts: 1141
Joined: Apr. 10 2007
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 RE: **CANTE CHALLENGE ENTRIES** (in reply to Florian)
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Perca --------------------------
Score: 22
Comments------
Intro : A safe and unobtrusive way to start..... That can work in your favor or against you when accompanying. It can be an opportunity to really inspire the singer or at least try to. This intro says, I am here to serve you sir and not get in your way. It gets the job done. One comment here on technique.... rasgueados need work. It seems like maybe the up stroke in the pattern you are using is a bit weak or hesitant. I would recommend doing lots of slow grunt work with a metronome to clear it up. The remate to call the cante for the salida wasn't strong enough for my tastes. The chromatic descending chords are typically done with a triplet type of rasgueado instead of just down strokes. I think thats what I am missing.
Salida: Once again it got the job done and the compas was steady and easy enough to follow. There are 3 places, that I would have changed the harmony in some way to move with the melody felix is giving us. First... at 0:38 (after the initial "ayyyyyy") you return to the A chord when Felix has not resolved it to A. It would have been better to stay on the Bb chord and wait to resolve at the end of the next compas. You have to get used to letting the cante dictate your moves more. I know why you resolved there. You let up for moment in the relentless tracking of the melody that is necessary even to pull off a traditional performance. Its not that what you chose was wrong, but it could have been more WITH the cante. Next point...
Felix is VERY clearly emphasizing a C note and it really commands the guitar to respond in some way. A C major chord or a C7 would have been great to hear there. Other choices could be "Amin7" or "C phrygian" AKA "Cmaj(b9)". The Amin7 choice wouldn't really work here because of the intensity in which Felix gives the C note warrants the use of something a bit "harder" sounding. Last point for the Salida.... Felix hints at an Ab (this is of course Ab adjusted for the capo, not concert Ab). He doesn't give this note very strong, but its there and it would have benefitted from you in the very least adding an Ab to your Bb chord to make it a Bb7 chord. Typical accompaniments would make use of a Bb with an Ab in the bass AKA "Bb/Ab" When my performance is posted you will see how I decided to treat this situation... ;)
Oooppps... one last nit picky comment... You gave a really cool remate here BUT YOU DIDN"T STOP. After that succession of downbeat chords which sounded great, you really needed to resolve the A chord and stop or just let it ring out until Felix started the letra. Give your singer space to do his thing. When you do that it lets him come in relaxed and makes the beginning of his letra more special and more intimate.
1st Letra: You got the chords right. Thats great. Now learn to give a LOT more Aire up for the cause.... The C chord for the "Cambio" is a little funny sounding. You repeat that voicing so I am guessing you have a fondness for it. It works but other voicings may work better here. Sometimes a voicing like that can sound better even if moved over a half a beat in either direction. In accompaniment "timing is everything". The F chord in the second "Cambio" is early. Felix delays the resolution and the guitar needs to do it as well. If Felix had sung this "normal" you would have been right, but Felix chose to be a bit fancy and its your job to accommodate him when he chooses to do things like that. This does show that you completely understand the changes for a common Solea por Bulerias letra. Now its time for you to begin to shade and ornament your accompaniments. Keep listening and it will come. You are doing great.
Falseta: Cool. I love it. Nice remate bit once again YOU DIDN"T STOP. Let the guitar ring and do some of your work for you. Stopping at or around 10 and letting the guitar ring is a warm invitation for your singer to come in. Listen to some recordings and check it out and see how many times that is the case. You kept that groove going and its like maybe you needed to keep strumming to keep your place or something. This is a simple way to improve your accompaniment right here. When you want the singer to come in.... give the remate and towards the end look him or her dead in the eye, give a clear chord at or around 10 and let it ring and wait..... come in at 3 of the next compas ....... even if he doesn't come in. If he does you will be GOLDEN and if not you will still be playing dynamically and it will work great.
2nd Letra: Good job holding the A7 out and waiting for Felix. The G minor you played fell with the melody and resolved nicely to D minor right with him. Well done.The response (respiro) really needed that "walking bass line" though. More rasgueado seems like it was an after thought.... You are going to need lots of little "responses" for various different chord resolutions. Start building a library of them. You will be doing more of those than falsetas in most situations. The compas got a little messy in the first Cambio (2:53)... That C chord voicing is nice here though. Fits better than in the first Letra. A nice strong ending.
All in All there is a whole lot that is "right" about this performance. A few little things can really make the difference. You are ready to start making those special moments. Stay focused and never take for granted what the singer is going to do next even if you think you know him well..... especially if you think you know him well... always assume he is going to screw you up with fancy stuff and you will always be on your toes ready for anything he gives you... Once again, GOOD JOB!!!!!
Salmonete-------------------
Score: 25
Comments------
Intro : Killer. The falsetas in this performance are killer. But I fear you gave more importance to them and less to accompanying your singer.... BAD DOG!!! Down boy!
Remember this... its better to find this out here than in a more important situation. That said I love the sound of your guitar and the falsetas are super flamenca. One critique is the way you hop the bass notes around in the remate before the salida. You do that in other places in the performances as well and it bugs me a little every time. Its like you are trying TOO HARD to be unique.
Salida: you didn't get the C chord (0:50) or the Ab (0:56) either.... see the above comments on Perca's Salida. Its not wrong but its also not quite "tuned in" enough for my tastes. Sharpen up that radar!Also your choppy remate (0:58) at the end of the salida was a bit in the way of what Felix was doing. Its played well, but its not the best thing to have played in this particular moment. It would have sat better in the following compas after the Salida was completely finished. And also there is that hop around Bb, G, Bb , A thing again...(1:04) don't like it sorry. Connecting those notes with ligados around the Bb note would work great though... maybe just a pull off to A in between the first Bb and G there... just an idea.
1st Letra: Yes! you held your ground and stuck to that A chord. Good Dog!...It really works here. You could have dipped into G minor for a bit (1:17) at the end of that elongated first line, but the persistent A chord works good too. Glad you knew to stay there. Ouch.... (1:31) a Bb chord when he resolved to A. You gave him the opposite resolution than the one he gave you. Bad Dog!... First "cambio" was great, a nice decending walk down to the F chord.....classic... but the problem..... you did it again in the next cambio...... Bad Dog!... Its too repetitive. Too calculated. Practice 15 different ways to resolve a C7 to F cambio. The "cambio" is about bringing the idea of the letra to an apex. Repetition doesn't push that sentiment across very powerfully. If you "FEED" your singer here, he will give you some pleasant surprises in return. Still its a good job, but I didn't like that "choked" A chord at the end of the letra either.. (1:50)
Falseta: Killer. You are a jerk.:) That was cool. I'm stealing it, but when I do it... I am going to GIVE A KNOCK DOWN DRAG OUT SUPER INSPIRED REMATE THAT SOUNDS LIKE PIECES OF WOOD ARE FLYING OFF THE GUITAR... because thats what i like. And also when I do that I am going to STOP and let the guitar ring out or cut it and let the reverb tail whirl around like a duende in the air before the singer comes in... ;) I was taught that a falseta is only as good as its remate. This was a SMOKIN' falseta with a wimpy remate... Bad Dog!
2nd Letra: You could have held strong and firm to that A chord here too and really prolonged the tension before dropping the Dminor Chord. What you did worked though, so I will leave you alone about it... "Cambio"..... hmmmm Bb to F without a C7 chord.... and that same decending walk down as before.... very bad dog! You should know better. You are a player at a level high enough to know not to be that calculated.... right? Well now you know.... Yes!!! A cut and a whirling duende reverb tail... finally (3:01)... but yet again the same descending lick and OUCH, DAMN, SUPER DOOPER OUCH.... out of compas! BAD DOG!!!! (3:07 to the end)
To sum up.... you have a great sound and great material. You need to tighten up the accompaniment a bit and don't rush like you did at the end. I rush a tiny bit in my performance too so you all can bang me over the head with the shortcomings of my performance once its made available. I had to knock off serious points for the out of compas and repetitive cambio thing though.... could have been a home run with just a little more love given to the cante. You are a fine player and I enjoyed listening.
Lubina--------------------------------
Score: 15
Comments------
I can't really get into to the details because this one is a mess. Its all out of rhythm......
However...... you got the harmony correct.... the chords change with Felix even though you are COMPLETELY out of compas.... I don't know how in the world you accomplished that.....bravo!... Still compas is compas..... I gave you 15 points because you got things half right. Get your compas together and you'll be awesome. What the heck is that OTHER knocking sound? Its a mess, but I am amazed at the chords changes being right. Rhythm is a unifying factor and when it is adhered to at even at an elementary level it enables all kinds of analysis as is the case with the above submissions. There are many other benefits too..... like people being able to follow along with you and vice versa.
Normally, I encounter lots of players who can play in compas but can't get the chords right with a singer. This is the opposite... All you have to do is fall into time.... go with the flow... technique and everything else thrives in a rhythmically accurate environment. I would recommend you take some sort of percussion lessons... learn to hit stuff in time with music and then things will start to fall in rhythm better on the guitar. Its as if you aren't hearing the rhythm of what's there and because of that there is no unity between the different elements...... except for the harmony that is..... but thats just one part of your job. I think you can overcome this, but I tell you..... its going to take a lot of hard work and perseverance. I'm rooting for you.
You may feel like you are taking huge steps backwards to do something as elementary as beat on percussion instruments in time, but believe me it won't be taking steps backwards. It will be filling in some blanks that for some reason were not established earlier in your musical education. Get a metronome and just tap your finger exactly with the beats at 100bpm. Now set it to 200bpm and do the same thing. Go back to 100bpm and play what you played at 200bpm.... those are "eighth notes".... they move at twice the speed EXACTLY of "Quarter notes" which is what you were tapping at 100bpm.
Think of this..... fold a piece of paper perfectly in half.... Now fold the folded paper in half again perfectly...... and again.....etc..... unfold the paper and you will see that you have created a matrix or a grid...... THAT IS WHAT WE DO WITH SOUNDS. If your "folds" aren't perfect the spaces in the grid are all out of whack and the pattern is convoluted. This is the problem with your performance. The folds are way off. Not just a little bit......If you can visualize music like the paper metaphor, you should be able to produce sounds in the same manner. One other quick thing... in music as far as basic rhythmic structure is concerned.... things get "folded" either in half (compound) or on thirds (complex).... in half is "eighth notes".... in thirds is the concept of "triplets"....
It gets much more complex than that but its a start. I think you just need to find a way that the concept CLICKS in your mind... sorry for the pun. Good luck and I truly feel that you can certainly accomplish this.... I have seen students overcome the very same obstacle. Get to work!
Merluza-------------------------
Score: 20
Comments------
Damn! I hat to have to get into this again, but rhythm is really off here... but there are some fantastic things about this performance too. If this person gets their rhythm together everybody needs to look out. There is a great accompanist lurking behind the the veil of bad rhythmic skills here... It sounds like it may be a hair too fast for you, but in the other hand you are doing some VERY classic and wonderful things in your accompaniment. The choices you made were very classy and to be honest.... had they been in rhythm better, I would have given this a near perfect score (intonation was bad at the beginning)and also, one chord in the last "cambio" of the second letra is out of place. I scored you high because of how much I like your sound and your ability to choose the good things to do that sound very flamenco.
Now get the rhythm together get on with the show. Please... You have too much going for you not to fix this one issue. Its a huge issue though. Without conquering this..... you can't get to the next level.
Intro : The guitar is a little out of tune.... Rasgueados aren't crisp enough, Arpeggios are behind... everything is a little behind.... is there a latency problem with your recording device... are you hearing yourself late in the headphones? I wonder if that may be the problem.... Once you get going the arps get better in time (0:13). At (0:32) there is a flubbed ligado, but the thing you are playing there is very nice. The falseta led really nicely into the Salida. It was well thought out.... if it weren't for that shaky rhythm... damn!
Salida: Rhythm is going okay here. The rasgueados are again not controled enough. You need to fold some paper too and examine it and apply what you see to your music. At (0:52) the rhythm falls apart again. Golpes are off a hair in many places. What you did where others missed the C chord that Felix hints at (0:49) your choice is wonderful... the standard old 1,2,3 cadence. It goes SO well with what Felix did.... but its slightly out of time. Damn! Listen VERY CLOSE.. at (0:56) Felix is NOT giving you a G note. Its a G#... one fret higher. Make a G minor 7th chord barred at the 3rd fret. Add your middle finger to the 4th fret 6th string (Ab or G#)... strum it... that is the tone he is giving you... The chord is called Bb/Ab or read out loud in English as Bb over Ab, or Bb with Ab in the bass. Its essentially a Bb7 chord with the 7th in the bass... At the ends of many phrases in flamenco singers give this tone in many different palos. You need to learn to differentiate between that tone and the G that singers sing which would be calling for a G minor chord. The more you KNOW what's going on the better you will make choices...
I am not going to pick on your rhythm anymore for this critique, but you really need to work on it. Its keeping you back, when you could be way ahead of the pack. Not through pyrotechnics, but musical taste and sensitivity. But you really can't have musical taste and sensitivity when your rhythm is a mess. I hear a diamond in the rough here. Please fix your rhythm whoever you are!
1st Letra: Everything is good here harmonically speaking. You also repeated the same lick in the second cambio like I mentioned with Salmonete. Don't do that. Learn 15 other ways to do that change C7 to F. I even like how you stop and let chords ring.... that rhythm though...ruins it. Please Dooood!!! You gotta fix that.
Falseta: It could be a great falseta. I like the chords, and when I hear in my head in rhythm what you attempted to play..... it makes me give you a nice jaleo.... but.... when I listen to what is actually there.... I want to kick you for not spending more time on your rhythm... I know I said I wasn't going to mention it again, but I can't help it. I really want to like this performance, but as important as compas is.... most will not take the extra time to hear the tastefulness that is hidden behind the lack of rhythmic control.
2nd Letra: Good Stuff. I love the little ornament on the A7 chord at(2:46). But at (2:51) you get to the F chord too soon. Felix is falling slowly to the resolution and you brought the ground right up to him and cut him off. What need to happen there was either to play another passing chord or two...Gminor11, Gb7(b5) or just the Gb7(b5) after your C7 chord. The other option would be to STAY on the C7 and wait for Felix to fall onto his A note so that you line up the F chord better with that A note he is singing. The ending break would be SO MUCH MORE powerful with stronger rhythm. Please work on your rhythm. You have something very good going on, but it will be hard for others to get on the same page with you if you don't solidify your rhythm. Its not really compas thats your issue. Its rhythm.... tempo. If you get that your compas will be great. I hope you can understand that there is a difference in the two concepts. You have compas, despite your imperfect rhythm.
Chicharro------------------------
Score: 28
Comments------ Well accompanied, very nice falsetas. A couple of small rhythmic problems, but not huge... you still need to work on rhythm so those things don't happen. At least not on things yu are submitting for critique..... ;)
Intro : Great Falseta and it sets up the Salida well.
Salida: Yes!!! you got the C chord. Congrats... you have "radar"... and I really like the playful trip you did with the Gmin7 chord at (0:52)... and double YES!!! you added an Ab note in the middle (3rd string) to you Bb chord to match up with Felix at the end. GOOD DOG!
1st Letra: You didn't repeat the same lick both times in the "cambio".... Good Dog!
Falseta: Cool falseta (not as cool as the opening one but still nice), nice rasgueados in there, they have "aire" ... I really would have liked to hear a "double" alzapua to finish it though. It sounds like you can do it. It would certainly up the anty if you could whip out the old double alzapua when necessary. Everyone notice the clipped A (2:26) note at the end of this falseta with 2 taps... this is a well delivered invitation for a singer to enter...
A little messy rasgueado at (2:30) you lost a point there.
2nd Letra: Okay here is where you lost the other point..... you didn't hold on to that A7 chord long enough. Felix did NOT give you the Dminor tone. You just jumped to it because you have heard others do it that way. Felix went back UP before resolving and you really need to stay inside the A7 harmony there... or as an alternative given a series of passing chords that fall into D minor gradually. Waiting for the singer to give the tone is a big deal once you have proven that you have compas and ears for the tonos, which you have. You had the "radar" at the begining, but you lost it here. You have to stay focused 100% when a singer is singing to deliver a polished accompaniment. This was very good despite one little rasgueado slip up and the D minor thingy. Also a tiny bit of rushing at (2:56) The ending is sort of uninspired, but almost like an old anthology recording. I don't know about you, but when a singer sings his heart out, it makes me really want to dig in at a place like that as to sort of ask the question to the audience.... did you get that? did you hear what my compadre just said? Its all about support..... right to the last note. Nice Work.
Rodaballo----------------------
Score: 26
Comments------ Alternate tuning... you lost a point for that.... just kidding. It is a nice sound, but too lazy for me. It would have seemed more appropriate to play in that tuning in a more aggressive manner. Its a dark sounding tonality and could have gotten downright spooky had you added some "bells and whistles" I get bored of the alternate tuning trip. But I can also see the attraction. I used them quite a bit 10 years ago. The chord at (0:13) sounds way to "Guns and Roses".... Find another voicing for that puppy. Its the MOST IMPORTANT tone in the flamenco Phrygian harmonic framework. It needs to summon a primal need that can never really be quenched, instead this particular voicing makes me hear Axel Rose..... "Every Rose has its thorn"...... Ouch!!!! Bad Dog! A chord voicing can have a huge effect on things. Change one note in that chord so that it matched the dark mystical vibe the rest of the voicings in the performance have.
Intro : Killing time.... filler.... a falseta would have been nice.. ;) I know filler when I hear it. I am the king of killing time.... you must play for dance a lot..... ;) It becomes necessary to kill time when you play for a lot of different dancers and you need atmospheric stuff that creates a mood but that it adaptable to many changes rhythmically to fit with various dancers styles. When there isn't much of a melody then you don't feel so "put out" by a dancer asking you to change your "beloved heartfelt creation".... these types of things are great for that.... of course when you want to make a dance situation really special, you can't really "phone it in" like that. Oh dear.... I have gone off on a tangent.... must be getting tired.
Salida: Rasgueados need work. (0:50) The note Felix sings deserved special attention, but you just kept chugging along as though it was an every day run of the mill situation. Bad Dog!
1st Letra: Too much strummety strum and not enough detail work. The dissonance at (1:45) is cool. It works for me. This is an exceptionally bright sounding guitar. New Strings? Soundport?
Falseta: Nice Falseta for the most part but you completely lost it at (2:20)
2nd Letra: Very tastefully done chords at the beginning of this letra. You did resolve early like others did but you jumped right back on the Dominant chord and did some nice passing tones here. To take back what I had said on the previous submission (I think)... Felix does resolve, but then goes back around again and that really is why you shouldn't stay on the D minor chord there. I hope that clarifies things for those who may be scratching their heads about my earlier comments about that section. I kind of like the late cambio at (3:05) its a bit unsure, but I think it could have been nice if played with more conviction. This person knows their harmony it seems and knows how to accompany somewhat, but more attention to detail is really what this performance was lacking.
Pirhana-------------------------------------
Score: 25
Comments------ Another wiseguy with alternate tuning... geesh...when will you guys learn. ;)
Intro : Solid good sounding rasgueado. Nice. Still this filler and not a falseta. You must be the other guitarist who plays with the guy above.... ;) Rhythm is a bit shaky throughout. Work on it.
Salida: You missed the "special tone" Felix gave. (0:50) Bad Dog! You also missed the other "special tone" at the end of the salida (0:49)...
1st Letra: all pretty good. You munched the alzapua a bit at (1:24) The cambio didn't work out too well here... (1:32) You essentially did the same lick twice for the cambio, even though its not really a lick... you need to vary those pretty much always. Make it a rule. I like the Bootsy Collins, Parlament/Funkadelic ending (1:49).... "Free Your Mind and Yo Ass will Follow"... ;)
Falseta: the Bootsy lick is back.... "stick it on the goodfoot" You need to develop this material more. Take a good bit more care when choosing material when its going to be reviewed by your peers. Take more pride in your work. Thats my advice..... You know what to do and when to do it for the most part, but you need to find a real purpose and let it show that you are 100% invested in what you are doing. These alternate tunings can scare the holy crap out of people when they are done right and with real dedication.
2nd Letra: Bad Dog!!! you went right to the D minor or equivalent chord..... ouch. Dude..... you have to take her out to dinner first. You just unwrapped the surprise like it was a pack of smokes..... Bad Dog!
Besugo----------------------------------------
Score: 20
Comments------
Intro : None.... you did it like me... right off the original non-extended version ;)
Salida: You got the C chord.... good ears... rhythm not as solid as I like it to be... and you missed the Ab that Felix sang at (0:28).. even if they are a bit pitchy, you have to learn what they are going for... go to a piano and play a Gmin6 (G,Bb,D,E).... now put an Ab on top of it. It should sound fairly crappy. That is what happened in your part. I know probably most people don't get so "Type A" about stuff, but the great players do even if they play it off like "its nothin'"
You were paying real close attention, got the C chord trick and dropped the ball on the Ab note that Felix sang..... Bad Dog!
1st Letra: Going good, going good, nice rasgueado, nice rasgueado, nice rasgueado, nice rasgueado, nice rasgueado,..... what's up with all of that rasgueado business. The first one (1:00) I though cool, and then a wrong chord (1:02) and then more and more and more rolling rasgueados.
Cambios are fine... good enough I suppose...
Falseta: Punched in, edited falseta without even the decency to use crossfades and level/eq matching to cover your tracks..... minus 10 points... ;) I thought I hear another edit earlier in this recording but I dismissed it as my being completely exhausted by repeating myself over and over again. ;) I love you guys and you will all get your turns to tear me apart when Ailsa puts my VIDEO up. ;) Edits and puch-ins aren't really acceptable in a competition like this you know.... Busted. BAD DOG!
Picado needs some work... F melodic minor, All modes, All the way up the neck, in 4 note sequences, with a metronome at 16th notes at least 120bpm to start.... Don't stop... all the way up the neck until the first pattern repeats and you are over the 12th fret... your fingers will feel like they are going to fall off....... but if you resist and relax, you will gain endurance and your picados won't fizzle out as much..... (1:46)
For a puched-in falseta it could have been nicer. Seems like you worried more about the picado than making a nice falseta to inspire your singer to rip his guts out and leave them on the stage. I don't want to seem like I am picking on you for your use of picado. It can be and EXTREMELY effective tool to express emotion, but here it was the subject instead of the punch line. Another bad punch-in or edit at (1:50)... I bet what was there before the punch was cooler.... I betcha it was.... and you wouldn't have been docked 10 points for it. ;)
Okay enough of that...... lets finish this one..... I am tired.... perhaps overly grumpy.... apologies if it seems that way.
Ooopps, more gratuitous rolling rasgueados.... (1:53) I am glad you are getting them together and they sound good. Now learn not to abuse them and you will be golden.
2nd Letra: One of the very coolest thing happens here.... of all the submissions, including my own... no one used this much open space..... you stayed clear of Felix and turned his elongated melisma-fest into a real event. A dancer would have loved you for this one... a redemption perhaps.... GOOD DOG! (1:55) Hats off to you for that one. I am giving you 5 points back for that. But then you go right back to the rolling rasgueados again.... oh dear.... Well, I have to give it to you Besugo, at least you made the last submission fun. I would now like to hear you accompany the whole track with no picado and no rasgueados..... you should take me up on the offer... you will learn a tremendous amount by doing so.
To sum things up....... I am very pleased that all of you learned the right chords for the most part. The details that I mentioned here and there are really the next step to becoming a better accompanist. Still, I think this was a great challenge and I wish all of you the very best, because despite the fact that I got after a few of you about some things, one fact remains... You ALL took the time to take part in this challenge proving that cante is important to you. You all did some investigation to find out what the changes were if you didn't already know them. All of you are winners. Congrats and a HUGE thanks to Felix de Lola for singing for us and inspiring to learn, Florian for misspelling lots of words and last but not least Ailsa for being the keeper and uploader of files.
My video will be posted soon for critique and examination.... also... Nigel (PacodeGarcia) has transcribed it for those who may want to learn from it. A .pdf file will be made available sometime very soon. Its already finished, so I imagine it will be offered as soon as the video is up.
Cheers,
J
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Oct. 8 2009 1:34:26
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NormanKliman
Posts: 1143
Joined: Sep. 1 2007
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RE: **CANTE CHALLENGE ENTRIES** (in reply to Ailsa)
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I see Jason’s the first to post scores, and has included lengthy comments which I’ll read now, after posting. Excellent job by all!
I evaluated two factors: technique (0-10) and accompaniment (0-20). Technique is just right- and left-hand skills: precise fingering, correct chord voicing, developed articulation, etc. Accompaniment involves a few things: chords used, projection and juxtaposition of guitar, rhythmic underpinning of cante, empathic dynamics (flowing with singer), etc. Please remember that this is entirely subjective for me (based on my preferences), and I'm more interested in how you interact with the singer. So, having perfect technique or using all possible chords do NOT necessarily increase scores, and playing out of step with the singer IN ANY WAY lowers scores. You've had weeks to learn every note and nuance of this performance, so I value seamless unison with the cante. Alternate tunings did nothing to increase scores (although they impressed the hell out of me on a personal level!)
Just about everyone seems to have overlooked the ayeo de entrada (the initial vocalization, or "ay-ay" stuff before the actual verse). This is a really important part of the performance. There are two interesting opportunities for chords: an E(7) at 0:48-0:49 and a G minor at 0:56-0:57 (passing to barred Bb7 (A flat on sixth string) and resolving to A on 1-2-3, for example). I heard only some of you dealing with the G minor.
Perca - Solid ideas, but could include gaps of silence. You followed the first cante correctly, although at 1:29-1:30 beats 7-8 are rushed. It's a small but important detail because it kills the aire, and it's not the only time that you get slightly ahead of the rhythm (and you’re not the only one to do this now or in past challenges). In the cambios of both cantes (1:33 in the first cante, for example), I don't like the chords you're using. It sounds like there might be dissonant open strings in there or something. Second cante well accompanied, but technique could be a bit more polished. Good solid approach to supportive accompaniment with well-structured ideas. Technique 6, accompaniment 12, TOTAL 18.
Salmonete - Andy? Strong skills, varied rasgueados and other right-hand inflections. Lots of notes that might not make much sense without the palmas. The descending bass line in the cambio is a bit repetitive, and I recommend working out a few variations. The accompaniment is a little too busy for my taste, as it seems to be competing with the cante rather than unobtrusively supporting it. The syncopation at 1:08-1:09 could easily distract the singer as it's just before the first sung line. It's really important not to upset moods that are being created. Also, the sixth-string F at 1:30, although it fits harmonically, is a bit of a distraction because there are going to be changes in just a few seconds (in the cambio), and the attention is on the singer at this point. Similarly, in the last few syllables at 1:49-1:50, you ought to let the singer finish before adding those kinds of details. The listeners are hanging on the final syllables, and you don't want to upset that intense focus. Second cante is very well accompanied, particularly the gap of silence at 3:00-3:01. I don't care for the closing detail at 3:07-3:08. Sometimes this idea works at this point, especially for the last cante of a series, but it gets ahead of the cante in this case. Again, it's the last bit of singing, and I'd rather hear you give the singer the space to finish properly without anticipating the rhythmic/harmonic resolution. Technique 8, accompaniment 13, TOTAL 21.
Lubina - Underdeveloped skills, poor fretting, shaky rhythm. Not in synch. First part of second cante should go to D minor. Technique 3, accompaniment 5, TOTAL 8.
Merluza - Not always in synch. Is the audio file edited? Second cante well accompanied, especially the silence at 2:34, but the silence at 2:39-2:41 lets the tension of the cante fall flat, and the chord change at 2:51 is a bit too early. Technique 7, accompaniment 10, TOTAL 17.
Chicharro - Solid skills. Good falseta in the intro and good accompaniment of ayeo. Interesting cambio in second cante, but you anticipate beats 7-8 at 2:55-2:57. Technique 8, accompaniment 14, TOTAL 22.
Rodaballo - Although it sounds like the rasgueados could be developed a bit more (strength and precision), you choose some very interesting chords and your touch produces lush tone (despite the low-fi audio). But the guitar sounds like a second voice running parallel to the singing, rather than forming a solid rhythmic base under the singing. You're distracting from the singing, not because of poor musicianship or failure to relate to the cante (quite the contrary: you've obviously put some time into understanding the melody of the singing and have the skills/knowledge to produce some very interesting music) but because you're not using your right hand in a way that provides a solid rhythmic base UNDER the singing. IMO, this is the main problem with alternate tunings, and it's just now occurring to me that you may have been intentionally avoiding strong rasgueados because of the detuned bass strings. In any case, I like your version a lot, and I'm not criticizing your effort because of the altered tuning (it doesn't sound too "weird" to me). The problem, according to my preferences, is that the guitar is juxtaposed with the cante in a way that doesn't really give the singer a solid platform. Technique 7, accompaniment 9, TOTAL 16.
Pirhana - The alternate tuning is interesting (what is that, por granaína without capo and sixth string tuned to B?), as it allows for some innovative opportunities (things that can't be done por medio), although it also means that some very basic moves are impossible and you have to rely more on basic strumming during the singing, which sometimes sounds a bit plain, although it's very much in keeping with the highly original atmosphere that you're creating. Tight rhythm and solid skills. The syncopation at 1:28-1:29 is distracting but works at 1:33-1:34. The bit at 1:49-1:50 sounds cool (as a guitarist, I love it) but distracts greatly from the singing (as a cante aficionado, I find it a bit annoying). At the beginning of the second cante, I would have preferred to hear you wait before going to the D minor chord (setting it up with A7), but the rest is really good. Technique 9, accompaniment 13, TOTAL 22.
Besugo - Good dynamics during the ayeo. Sounds generally good and might go over very well in some parts of Spain, but there's too much flash, and the rasgueado at 0:44-0:45 is just plain overkill, as is the one at 2:02. Same story with the falsetas between the cantes. Most of the excess could be moderated by selectively lowering the volume of certain parts in the mix, but that picado is too much (sounds like you're shouting in the middle of a conversation). In general, you're not supporting the singer because you're competing with him and the aire has little to do with the spirit of the cante. Technique 8, accompaniment 7, TOTAL 15.
_____________________________
Be here now.
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Date Oct. 8 2009 3:10:37
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Ricardo
Posts: 14825
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
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RE: **CANTE CHALLENGE ENTRIES** (in reply to Ailsa)
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Sorry been really busy guys!
Perca 20
Good compas, does the job, but too static. Work on dynamics, the ups and downs with the singer. The falseta was good and appropriate I felt.
Salmonte 25
Very good dynamics, but the uniqueness of your style, leaving holes and being soft in spots, and the way you moved tonos in unique ways, I found to distract from the singer. There are some details in rasgueado that need to be there to support the singer a little better but good job. The falseta needs to have a stronger ending to lead the singer in.
Lubina - 0
very very sorry but you were not in compas at all with the singer, and did not change tonos properly either. Thanks for the effort but you really need to work on compas first before you can understand what it means to accompany.
Merluza 15
Good sound and dynamics but you really need to get comfortable with keeping a steady tempo for the singer. I was very distracting and you dont' make it sound at ease because of the tempo changing too much.
Chicharro 27
You sound like you know what you are doing. Just tighten the tempo, and work on a couple rasgueado details that are important to do an exemplary job. So far this is more what I want to hear an accompanist doing for a singer.
Rodaballo 20
Again tempo was not comfy and solid and need to work on those Rasgueados to support the singer properly. Nice dynamics and extra points for the unique tuning which I think works well. Probably you should be sticking with the trad style though to hone the tempo and rasqueados first.
Pirhana 27
Nice work, I prefer a brighter sound, and the rasgueados were just rolling the basses most of the time. But at least you do a good job listening to the singer and supporting with dynmics and details. Nice unique use of key as well. Again some details about rasgueado and tonos (at the end I would have liked the major chord before you resolve, but I guess it was your unique choice??) to be exemplary.
Besugo 25
good job, but sort of the opposite end of the spectrum as Salmonte. You have heavy rasgueados and fill spaces, but again in a UNIQUE way which I find destracting a bit from the singer at important moments. But good tempo and dynamics.
In general great effort from all. General concern is some STANDARD rasgueados and dynamics missing from almost all entries that I am very used to hearing (or maybe just doing myself I don't know) that keep me from giving a 30. Everyone did nice unique falseta interpretations but I did not really care much about that because accompaniment is about making the singer feel comfortable, not to be so unique. 4 guys had pretty good tempo and the rest really really need to focus time on the importance of that. Once you can control the tempo more solidly the rest will fall into place.
I really hope Felix gets a chance to chime in cuz his opinion is important above all IMO.
Ricardo
EDIT after reading comments just my 2 cents. I feel a little different than jason regarding tonos for certain details. For example I really like the modal concept where the voice changes over a static chord. In that case, the guy who just played one chord for the ayeo was pretty cool to me. i feel in these differences can still make some uniqueness for an exemplary accompanist. Even the cambio I have seen treated various different ways by master acccompanists of old, though one version might seem more accademically "correct" than another (Morao and Parrilla would go F-C7 for the cambio for example!!!). For me rhythm and dynamic was always winning out over BEST possible tonos in my experience playing and listening. So just another view point, and of course the details Jason showed us would be exemplary.
_____________________________
CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
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Date Oct. 10 2009 10:55:19
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Guest
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RE: **CANTE CHALLENGE ENTRIES** (in reply to Ailsa)
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I have scored only on accompaniment: obviously there are differences in levels of technique, but I have not had time to assess them and good accompaniment can be achieved with minimal technique. Similarly I have ignored recording quality.
A couple of general points: it is not easy to record an accompaniment to an existing track, so everyone should be proud of achieving it and having the courage to upload it.. Secondly it does not seem to generally understood that the arpeggio ending on 7,8,9,10 is a cierre (a closure) and should not be played if the cante does not call for it. There is nothing wrong with playing 2 or more compases without cierres.
Chicharro. 20
This was a good attempt. Obviously listening to the cante, leaving spaces. Perhaps some of the falsetas did not bring across the compás very well but overall very pleasant.
Perca. 18
An adequate performance, which seemed to concentrate more on maintaining the compás rather than accompanying the singer. A bit relentlessy continuous, with few spaces. It is neither necessary nor desirable to fill all available space with guitar.2
Merluza. 15
A few inappropriate cierres and slightly woolly compás at times, but seemed to be listening to the cante.3
Salmonete. 10
This gave the impression of not accompanying the cante: too much continuous rasgeo and an inappropriate use of dynamics.4
Pirhana. 10
Once again fairly monotonous compás with few spaces and little connection with the cante. Too many cierres.5
Rodaballo. 8
A strange introduction, which does not clearly state soleá por bulerías. The intro should serve to animate the cantaor. Not so many cierres, but often the emphasis given to the chords seems inappropriate for the cante, instead of complementing it.6
Lubina. 7
Not only did this guitar not follow the cante, at times it seemed to be at odds with the compás.. Fairly messy, especially in the last letra.7
Besugo. 5
Overuse of continuous rasgeo makes this example the least sensitive of all, leaving the cante little room..8
Nor was I very impressed by the singing, especially in the soleá de Frijones, which in turn caused problems for the accompaniment. Both the singer and all of the guitarists would be well advised to listen to this letra of “Recuertate cuando entonces…” sung by Tomás Pavón, accompanied by Melchor.
Sean
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Date Oct. 10 2009 11:00:25
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JasonMcGuire
Posts: 1141
Joined: Apr. 10 2007
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RE: **CANTE CHALLENGE ENTRIES** (in reply to Guest)
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quote:
it does not seem to generally understood that the arpeggio ending on 7,8,9,10 is a cierre (a closure) and should not be played if the cante does not call for it
After the judging is complete perhaps you could go into further detail about this subject. It could benefit the people who are interested in accompaniment here and we have proven that there IS indeed interest in cante on this Foro. i am certian they would all have much gratitude for your time spent to clarify.
quote:
Nor was I very impressed by the singing, especially in the soleá de Frijones, which in turn caused problems for the accompaniment. Both the singer and all of the guitarists would be well advised to listen to this letra of “Recuertate cuando entonces…” sung by Tomás Pavón, accompanied by Melchor.
Any one could benefit from listening to that and Felix has. He studies constantly. He was not particularly fond of the performance either, but agreed that it would serve the purpose of the challenge.
Its not really the job of a singer to sing in a manner that fits the accompaniment. Its the other way around. Guitarists have to learn to deal with what a singer offers them to accompany. I don't want to pick a fight, but I found it important to state my opinion on this point. Please do not let it deter you from doing a follow up on "arpeggiated cierres", really the blessing in this challenge can be fruit that comes about from the discussions that develop.
We are all very busy. Modern society doesn't allow anything less than us all being overly busy most of the time. Thanks to all judges for their contributions.
Lets hope Kate can get her 2 cents in here, but if not we all certainly will understand. If she is having some type of struggle with ANY situation personal, family, professional etc... with all she has contributed to the Foro over the years, I know we all support her and send her good vibes and will remember her in our prayers. I am certain she wouldn't bail out without good reason.
_____________________________
http://www.Flamenco-Lessons.com/
http://www.CaminosFlamencos.com/
http://www.youtube.com/user/Bikhiyal
http://flamenco-lessons.blogspot.com
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Date Oct. 10 2009 13:22:12
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Andy Culpepper
Posts: 3023
Joined: Mar. 30 2009
From: NY, USA
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RE: **CANTE CHALLENGE ENTRIES** (in reply to Ailsa)
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Way to go Henrik, eres una makina!! Yours was totally pro, comfortable, relaxed...Ole! I actually thought yours was someone else because I was still thinking you were the granaina guy.
And Ole for everybody! Especially bursche who like me has only played flamenco for 3 - 3 1/2 years, but is way beyond me...pretty great for no accompaniment experience. Yourswas one that I could definitely recognize, you have a style.
Florian I thought yours had tons of style too and I know you had the skills to pull off a perfect performance, I really liked it, but do what Jason says and cut down on the rasgueado!! But I really liked the falseta.
Thanks again to Felix, Jason and ALL the judges for their constructive comments, which I'm sure will all be taken to heart...I've already started practicing MUCH more with the metronome, even basic techniques.
Thank you Ailsa for another gracious and flawless admin job!
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Date Oct. 11 2009 7:00:16
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- any probs and I'll sort them out first thing in the morning. Well done everyone. 
Next time I'll use a calculator........ 
