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RE: Ramon Montoya's guitar
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Ricardo
Posts: 14884
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
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RE: Ramon Montoya's guitar (in reply to Doitsujin)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Doitsujin I agree on that. Guitars are no pieces of art... They are just tools. But this Montoya tool, is a historical tool. My grandma is older than that guitar doit...we ain't talking dinosaur bones here! Further, you fail to understand that this guitar IS in a museum...a very specialized one, not a dorky public one. I made a special effort to go there, and perhaps only because I know the person in charge personally I got my hands on that instrument. It is not like people off the street walk in and say "hand over the montoya tool". But I do admit I loved playing it and making people like you upset!!!! To be realistic, the guitar passed hands so its not like a direct connection to Monotya, we don't know what was recorded or not with it, what damage was done by montoya himself vs the successive owners etc. You want to examine it and scrap off some DNA to learn what is montoya on the neck he MIGHT let you if you were a lot nicer So the guy IS special that has this museum for fact he does care for each instrument, he CAN play them, and repair or whatever, he is an expert on guitars WAY beyond you or myself, and honestly nobody except us flamenco nerds even CARE about this guitar. Imagine it in the met next to segovia guitar....nobody would know the difference. Anyway, my experience in there was amazing. From the moment you walk in you smell the wood, and even in the workshop in the back there is no synthetic workshop smell, only wood. They only french polish guitars, no toxic spray etc in there. So the first guitar I played was Richard's son Marshal's guitar. A blanca pieced together from scrap wood. Despite it's looks, the play and sound was equal to about anything else there. I don't think I can remember all the dates because of so many instruments but of the museum collection (vs the guitars for sale or in need of repair work in a different display case), and I had lots going on since then, here are some thoughts. The older guitar was from 1800's I played. The same as in the JS seargant painting "Jaleo", a thin body small sized blanca...but the neck was normal peg head. I was not any weaker in sound than modern guitars, but maybe less bassy. Esteso of Montoya= pretty normal feeling guitar with a good action, not too low. Some damage on the top between tap plate, sound was not much different than other top line sobrinos de esteso conde etc. I had perhaps a bit more bass than my personal blanca, but play and sound not a lot different. The neck was the only uncomfortable thing. It was very thick and round. The fingerboard was worn through with some shiny laquer left behind that looked odd. Brune said Montoya used to have to get the neck finished over and over because of sweaty fingers. The bridge was really nice set up not too low or too high. Santos= I played two (I think from the 30's) , one had an amazing neck very thin and also very low bridge. It had been restored a lot. Sound was great but more the playability was the good point, it was fun and easy. THe action was lower so I could not get the same strong sound out as the esteso. THe other Santos was much more beat up but all original condition. It had a white golpeador. THe easiest to play in the place (but the neck had no finsh left and my thumb couldn't slide fast), but the bridge was super low. Like if you do picados your nails hit the top. And the action was also super low...great for rasgueado but not so great for hard picados etc. I feel that sound wise all three old guitars would be hard to distinguish if the actions were all set up the same way. Barbero= I think I played two, and one of them I think 51, was pretty much perfect guitar. Sound and feel. A bit low action also, but the bridge set up was so good it could be raised and then really be perfect. I had the feeling that guitar was the favorite master piece of both Brune father and son builders, but it was just a feeling. Arcangel= played two I think from 70's. Both were negras and i would say one of the two was just a classical with a tap plate. Very bassy dark tone instruments and both had very high bridges. Playability was good on both except for the high bridges. Ruck= I was already familiar with this guitars but one blanca in there was really special, better than the ones I played in spain some years ago. I think this guitar was late 70's or early 80's...whatever it was, it was not a new guitar. Conde 67- very odd looking guitar. The finish was like orange paint, and you could see the brush strokes very sloppily applied. The other details were exactly like my 73. Despite the odd finish (Brune swears it is original and knew of one other from same era exactly the same deal), I hate to say, the feel and sound pushed this guitar to the top level for me personally. The singer that came with me agreed, at least hearing me play, I could make the most out of that guitar vs all the others. I think it was mainly beacause of the set up was perfect for me so I could push it how I like it and the neck was so nice etc. Brune seemed pretty proud to own that one too. Reyes 70- almost identical to the 71 I got to spend some time with years ago. Same sound. Very loud and clear and clean and great action and response and set up. I would say sound and feel wise this and the Conde were the best. Conde is a bit more quiet and focused sounding and less with the brilliant harmonics as this one, and that is why I prefer the conde. But this was a super amazing instrument. The singer I was with felt this was by far the best sounding guitar in the place, but also a player, like the Santos I described above that was super low action and fun to play. Brune= I played a couple of Brune's guitars which were also fantastic, even a classical guitar I played some bach on, very much in style of the old master guitars (esteso/santos/barbero). Overall a great time and great conversations at lunch about history and wood and Hauser guitars, and he had some great flamenco books out of print too, and got to see some big logs of wood for future guitars etc. Ricardo
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CD's and transcriptions available here: www.ricardomarlow.com
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Feb. 17 2013 18:54:37
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XXX
Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005
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RE: Ramon Montoya's guitar (in reply to Leñador)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Lenador They have those, I used to work at one, it's called a cooking class. Ahahaha, yeah, but im thinking more of an elitist society of men (no women allowed inside the building and within a radius of 200m, no phone calls and or text from girlfriends and its extremely forbidden to talk about girls, unless its a REALLY really funny story), where single living male academics are given the opportunity to honor and learn the art of cooking meat - an activity they have forgotten long ago. A bit like Fight Club, but wihout fighting, and not that "underground", but more exclusive. Summer is coming guys, summer is coming. :)
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Фламенко
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Feb. 18 2013 14:26:27
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