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What happen to Thomas Whiteley
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Mark2
Posts: 1872
Joined: Jul. 12 2004
From: San Francisco
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 RE: What happen to Thomas Whiteley (in reply to DavidT)
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The crazy thing about flamenco is that your chops have little to do with your knowledge or even experience in flamenco. Today's players and students are playing and studying stuff that guys in the 60's didn't know. That doesn't invalidate those older guys' experiences. Tom wrote that he played for Rosa Montoya, Ciro, etc, and given that we are from the same area, and that I also played for Rosa a bit, and knew many of the same people that Tom does, I have no doubt about his experiences. Many people today may play "better" but will they be able to play for flamencos of that level and have those kind of experiences? Some yes, some no. Finally, I can atest that as you get older, playing the guitar simply may not be as interesting as it was when you were younger, which means that your chops may not be what they were when you were thirty years old when you are fifty or sixty. Live and let live, and have some respect your elders cause your gonna be there sooner than you think! 
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 10 2006 22:02:17
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Ricardo
Posts: 14828
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
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RE: What happen to Thomas Whiteley (in reply to Ron.M)
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Oh, wow, I see what was going on. Shoots! (Where is the emoticon for the face you make when you hear glass breaking?)
Here is the old thread that Romerito dug up recently(necroposter!:  )
http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=35803&p=1&mpage=1&tmode=1&smode=1
If you read down after Thomas Whiteley posted, I pulled quotes on him about his career and things he said about paco being laboratory flamenco or something. (my tunnle vision only saw that, sorry!). I think there was some other business going on between him and Florian maybe or some other guys, but honestly I don't think I was in that one. I just came across these remarks and was pretty impressed by this bio. I guess it sounded like I was challenging him since the guys after me seemed to be challenging him, looking for his uploads.
To be honest I never checked out his upload, never got into any problems or arguements with him before (that I can remembe?), and was generally interested in meeting him in California since I was headed out there. I ended up going to Fresno only, but some guys I have met from the forum know me and met me, should know I am genuinly interested in meeting folks face to face. Even folks I argue with!
So I never noticed since the thread died, he later deleted his remarks I quoted. I guess it seems offensive that I have those "quotes from nowhere" and seems like I was involved in "challenging" the guy with my language, and by what the other guys said and must have had going on with him in some other topic. It looks bad to me anyway.
So for what it is worth if you guys who keep in touch know or think I offended Thomas (he never contacted me and deleted the stuff I quoted), then tell him I am sorry. And if you want, for the sake of the archive I will delete my quotes and stuff I said, no problem, since he did not want it written there anyway.
Ricardo
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Date Nov. 10 2006 23:05:05
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Anders Eliasson
Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006
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RE: What happen to Thomas Whiteley (in reply to DavidT)
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Ok guys
So now the hammering starts again and the same peole start tuting their same story. Dont you ever get tired 
There are a big lack of respect to other people on this forum and could you please change that???????
Thomas is doing well, and has told me that he prefers using his time playing than wasting his time on this forum.
I personally dont think its a waste of time and I still find tons of discussions which are very interesting and helpfull, but sometimes this lack of respect makes me turn of the computer myself, and if I had been through what Thomas and others have been through, I would have quit myself.
With respect of playing style and level of playing, I will only say, that if some of you guys with tons of Tomatito and Vicente Amigo falsetas ever mix with real world flamenco here in Andalucia, (I´m talking about places with dancers and singers, not some group of guitarist!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) You´d be told to get your act together and play something that the rest, the group, can use, and you´d be told to stop showing of, or you might even be told to go to the bar and have drink and not disturb what is going on.
People playing like Thomas, would be respected and invited to join the party.....
You should never forget this.
Its a tough world, but its what we´ve got and if we stop fighting each other about small stupidities it might be that it could be a better world 
_____________________________
Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/
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Date Nov. 11 2006 8:08:48
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XXX
Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005
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RE: What happen to Thomas Whiteley (in reply to DavidT)
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Is "closet player" a respectful term? "Being a critic is easy", well sadly Thomas was a pretty good example of that. And besides, being a critic is NOT easy, being a BAD critic, with a wrong critique is easy ;)
Oh and the question whether I would rather like to be able like Tomatito or rather like an accompanist, is not a big question (to me). One could also argue with the same right, that traditionalist have no respect for guitarists, and that it would be a better world, if they would stop using their experience as a weapon AGAINST guitarists. People disrespect, "because ..." and then you must find out what the reason is, and look if you can solve it. Its like with the analogy, that it doesnt help to ease the symptoms, you have to solve the source of the disease, to cure it.
Why cant you leave it at that we say: traditionalists play what THEY want, and guitarists play what they want. Nothing to do with respect. Just the simple rule: Discuss each other, dont f*ck each other.
_____________________________
Фламенко
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Date Nov. 11 2006 13:07:02
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Ricardo
Posts: 14828
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
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RE: What happen to Thomas Whiteley (in reply to Anders Eliasson)
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quote:
With respect of playing style and level of playing, I will only say, that if some of you guys with tons of Tomatito and Vicente Amigo falsetas ever mix with real world flamenco here in Andalucia, (I´m talking about places with dancers and singers, not some group of guitarist!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) You´d be told to get your act together and play something that the rest, the group, can use, and you´d be told to stop showing of, or you might even be told to go to the bar and have drink and not disturb what is going on.
People playing like Thomas, would be respected and invited to join the party.....
 Well the first time I went to Spain with my "faletas" I had alot to learn and did in an environment with "a group of guitarists". But there were singers and dancers too. I guess it depends who you "mix" with, but I and everyone else was not told to take a hike. We were treated with respect and encouraged by the "Andalucians" there. Perhaps they were told to "be nice"?, but who cares. Your point is well taken, but not clear WHO that posts on this forum, your advice would apply to?
The problem with folks getting upset on here is when general statements are made with negativity, that could apply to anyone but no one specific, so we have to "read" into it unnecessarily.
Ricardo
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Nov. 11 2006 15:25:05
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