Juan Estruch 1910 (+-)

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Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

Juan Estruch 1910 (+-)

Just bought a beat up old Peg Head Juan Estruch to restore, soon will post some photos.
Maybe a mistake , lets see if the luthier can handle.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 15 2024 11:21:59

Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 11:15:48

Stu

Posts: 2540
Joined: Jan. 30 2007
From: London (the South of it), England

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

My god that's hideous!

sorry.

Maybe it's as gem. I wouldn't know.

Whats with the back strip patch work?!! Why would they do that?
I could understand trying to use less material, but at least glue then straight. Just makes it look sloppy.

Nasty crack too. Good luck with it

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 15:28:38

Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Stu)

which strip ?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 16:12:50

Ricardo

Posts: 14845
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Manitas de Lata

Just bought a beat up old Peg Head Juan Estruch to restore, soon will post some photos.
Maybe a mistake , lets see if the luthier can handle.

Wow. A real vintage Luthier made masterpiece there!!!

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 16:23:44

Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Ricardo)

now its without tits , lets see how it is with new tits

example :

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 17:36:14

ernandez R

Posts: 742
Joined: Mar. 25 2019
From: Alaska USA

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

She is super cool… Rough crowd upthread but pay them no mind.

Would be a sin to mess with that fretboard and perhaps even the frets. Hard to say, that guitar had the **** played out if it for a vary good reason…

Don’t try to gold plate plate the old lady, she never was that kind of tart ;)

HR

_____________________________

I prefer my flamenco guitar spicy,
doesn't have to be fast,
should have some meat on the bones,
can be raw or well done,
as long as it doesn't sound like it's turning green on an elevator floor.

www.instagram.com/threeriversguitars

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 19:48:29

RobF

Posts: 1611
Joined: Aug. 24 2017

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

It actually pains me to imagine what's about to happen to the old thing. As Ernie implies, it's served its purpose and bears the scars of a life hard lived. Not to be a downer, but if you're not well versed in sensitive restoration why not let it retire gracefully as an historical artifact? Sure, it was never a high end instrument and is nothing more than a wall hanging at this point, but that's likely better than what it's about to become.

If it comes to a poll, my vote will always go towards preserving the past. Leave it alone and let it live another day to tell its story to future generations. Find something more recent to use to hone your skills. It's yours to do with as you please, of course, but just remember once you've destroyed a record of the past it cannot be recovered. It's more valuable now in its current dilapidated state than it will ever be after it's been "restored". Which isn't necessarily saying much.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 20:51:11

Stu

Posts: 2540
Joined: Jan. 30 2007
From: London (the South of it), England

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

quote:

which strip ?

Inside the guitar where the two back pieces are joined. There's usually a thin strip of wood that sits over that join.

However here, it seems, they didn't have one. And used a few squares of wood sporadically glued along that join. Some even penetrate the label

Honestly, not meaning to be horrible but yeah it's not a nice thing to look at.
I think Rob and Hernandez give you pleasant advice.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 20:59:46

Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to RobF)

i wrote that a luthier will work on her , im not a luthier.

hes one of the top on the country , if he doesnt want or dont have confidence , theres also others in the area that are very very good.

The goal is to restore with respect to original and i want to play her , if all goes well the final goal is to define if the wood cant take golpe even with a nice translucid golpeador.

This is also for me to learn what it takes to solve some of the issues (if so) , and will help future aquisitions of the "genre"

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 21:43:12

Stu

Posts: 2540
Joined: Jan. 30 2007
From: London (the South of it), England

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

quote:

This is also for me to learn what it takes to solve some of the issues (if so) , and will help future aquisitions of the "genre"

I don't understand this. Learn what? Solve what issues? Issues with restoring old guitars? Do you wish to become s luthier?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 22:02:39

Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Stu)

to evaluate the issues and then the costs

everything that we learn have a cost , in this case the guitar restore evaluation (old /not so old/used or even new)
i can also learn to not to do it again... or do it again with more conscious , lets see what happens

i only know the costs of some setup ups , classic or electric , theres a lot more that i dont

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 16 2024 23:39:42

Ricardo

Posts: 14845
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Stu)

quote:

I don't understand this. Learn what? Solve what issues?

It is called “learning…the HARD way”.

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 18 2024 11:06:34

Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Ricardo)

yess , theres any easy way? i dont recall learning something "new" or not so new on a easy way... even flamenco or some other stuff , theres allways a cost , financial or time consuming or both..

thats life

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 18 2024 12:41:01

ernandez R

Posts: 742
Joined: Mar. 25 2019
From: Alaska USA

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

Somthing about this guitar is off. Took me a while to think it through.

I don’t think that label is original to that guitar.

I think is posable that guitar is at lot older then 1910 but that label could have been installed then.

It’s the bridge with no saddle or even saddle slot. Doesn’t that make it a pre-Torres guitar?

Somthing to think about.

Regardless cool as **** for sure and one I would be proud to have hanging on my wall.

I would find a way to stabilize the cracked up rib/ribs.

Remove that ugly glue patch or whatever on the lower bought and retint accordingly.

Repair the one broken peg and fabricate a similar peg to replace the missing one.

And that’s it.

Find a low tension set of strings but only bring her up a full step flat and only while playing then remove most of the tension cause.

Dont **** with that groovy fretboard or frets or anything else…

Where the F is @firefrets this one is right up his alley!

_____________________________

I prefer my flamenco guitar spicy,
doesn't have to be fast,
should have some meat on the bones,
can be raw or well done,
as long as it doesn't sound like it's turning green on an elevator floor.

www.instagram.com/threeriversguitars

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 19 2024 2:33:50

ernandez R

Posts: 742
Joined: Mar. 25 2019
From: Alaska USA

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

Perhaps it was origanly a wood saddle integral to the bridge? A moment with a ruler would tell all?

HR

_____________________________

I prefer my flamenco guitar spicy,
doesn't have to be fast,
should have some meat on the bones,
can be raw or well done,
as long as it doesn't sound like it's turning green on an elevator floor.

www.instagram.com/threeriversguitars

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 19 2024 2:38:07

Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to ernandez R)

theres two little holes on the right and left side of the bridge , for what?

Maybe the size of the guitar and the harmonic bars will help to define a decade .
The label seems legit on the guitar , maybe the small wood piece was putted in place for a restore and above the label.

lets see , with some luck will arrive by friday

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 19 2024 9:27:59

RobF

Posts: 1611
Joined: Aug. 24 2017

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

One last kick at the can...

Please preserve it and save it for study. The label is likely original. The holes in the bridge were probably put in later (to mount some kind of wire saddle, maybe). The discolouration over the smashed part of the top is probably glue residue from gaffer tape that could be cleaned up with naphtha. And so on...

Look, the bridge is shot and the cost of properly repairing the cracked side and smashed top will likely exceed the value of the instrument. The fingerboard and frets are in horrible shape and probably need replacement. Any luthier willing to work on this at an 'affordable' rate probably shouldn't be given the job, and any luthier that should be probably won't want to. Ever wonder why there's so few of the old lower end instruments around? It's not like a crapload of them weren't made. Well, it's probably because the ones that weren't sent to the local dump were 'repaired' into oblivion.

Do you really need to do this?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 19 2024 10:54:32

Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to RobF)

thank you for your view and care.
no one is going to do Frankstein stuff , this guitars have demand and offer , like Telesforo Julve (and some others) that arent high end , they were normal guitars avaiable at the time.

The goal as i said before is keeping original and preserve the age of the guitar , so a very conservative restore.
The playability will depend of the condition , if theres chance to do it or not...and just put her on the wall

I have a deal with this luthier , and we have a very good relation (positive and honest), we dont hide stuff and we keep it honesty above all.
If doesnt work theres more very good guitar luthier and old classic instruments luthiers , but they can charge me more (maybe..or not)
I also dont have any rush on this, can be a medium term project so the money/cost will be diluted in time

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 19 2024 12:40:12

Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

just received , at least the neck is straight and ok as the headstock .
somethings to glue on top sides etc

The size is smaller than i was expected , seems like a size of a Romantic guitar

checked for the harmonic bars and theres none...

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 22 2024 20:01:58

hxwhf72752003

Posts: 38
Joined: Mar. 19 2024
From: Hunan, China

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Manitas de Lata)

Whatever your decision is, I will support you. It takes a lot of courage for a warrior to decide to take everything at his own risk in order to let the users on the forum know about this old-time gem

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 24 2024 8:14:31

Stu

Posts: 2540
Joined: Jan. 30 2007
From: London (the South of it), England

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to ernandez R)

quote:

A moment with a ruler would tell all?

This is a pleasant phrase. I like it.

Maybe you could patch that crack on the side with some noodles. There's a famous youtube restoration video where the guy does that!!! Genuinely... Noodles and glues and sands them.

http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=338284&p=3&tmode=1&smode=1

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 24 2024 10:45:56

Manitas de Lata

Posts: 660
Joined: Oct. 9 2018

RE: Juan Estruch 1910 (+-) (in reply to Stu)

not sure about noodles for the long run , because it gets fragile with time , maybe if use with other stuff it will be stiffer or so , really dont know.
but if someone studys materials therefore can aplly anything on anything.
For example , isopor + resin/glue you can get stiffer and flexible filling , cotton+ resin/glue is stiffer but hard no flexibility .

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Mar. 25 2024 10:08:05