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Buying a decent flamenco guitar
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rombsix
Posts: 7815
Joined: Jan. 11 2006
From: Beirut, Lebanon
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 Buying a decent flamenco guitar
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Hola mates,
I've been playing guitar for nine years now, and I think it MUST be time to move on from my classical guitars (that have been rigged to become more flamenco) to a decent flamenco one. If I get to start working as a medical intern in about six months from now, I'll get to start generating some very modest income (finally, after having been a penniless student for the past 23 or so years  ) which I hope to dedicate part of to buying a decent flamenco guitar. I plan to buy something in the $2000 range, or so.
The question becomes, knowing that I live in Lebanon (with no available flamenco guitars in the country except for the possibility of a Yamaha CG171SF for about $850, because that's how things are priced here), what is the most appropriate guitar to buy (taking everything into consideration)?
I mean, I probably would like to buy a blanca, because it's cheaper, and I think I like the way blancas sound compared to negras (even though I've NEVER played a negra). But, what brand do I buy? A Culpepper? An Anders? A Navarro? A Hermanos Sanchis Lopez? A student model Conde?
I guess I might be able to find such guitars within the range of $2000 - $3000. The thing that I am worried about, though, is this: I know that luthier-made guitars are the way to go. I never have been able to understand the concept, though, that you have to "order" a guitar, and get stuck buying it regardless of the outcome. And living in Lebanon, that makes it even harder since I need to travel to actually GET to the location where the guitar is at, so I can pick it up and head back home (knowing that ordering something online, and having it get shipped to Beirut through the airport is a sure-plan for the guitar to become fire-wood, or get swiped over at airport customs), making travel costs add up to the guitar's cost. I most-likely will be traveling to the USA (either Atlanta, Houston, Chicago, Los Angeles, or Philadelphia) within the coming six months or so, to take one of the US Medical Licensing Exams. I guess I'll be staying for a week, to get settled in, take the 8-hour exam, and get back home. That seems to me like the most appropriate time to buy a guitar. That, however, restricts me to the guitars available in the USA (which is probably a huge-enough range, unless I'd be missing some brands that might only be found in Spain). I don't see myself traveling to Spain or somewhere else (other than the USA / Canada) anytime soon.
Going back to the concept of buying a luthier-made guitar: I don't think I'll have any fancy or special requests as to how I would like my guitar to be built. It would most likely be standard regarding most measurements and features. I was thinking, probably, that If I were to visit the shop of a luthier, they might have ready-made guitars they've built that I can try out and buy, if I like one of them. Am I being unreasonable asking, "What if I have a luthier build me a guitar, and when I play it I am NOT satisfied with the sound, and don't want to buy it?" Does that ever happen? Can any of you luthiers / pros give me some tips?
This was a bit lengthy, but I am just trying to brainstorm here, and hopefully get to the best solution regarding buying a decent flamenco guitar, with the help and experience of all of you flamencos.
Gracias! 
_____________________________
Ramzi
http://www.youtube.com/rombsix
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Date Nov. 10 2010 5:47:54
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rogeliocan
Posts: 811
Joined: Nov. 23 2009
From: Canada
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RE: Buying a decent flamenco guitar (in reply to rombsix)
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Hi,
I live in Canada and buying a guitar here remains difficult. There is one relatively decent shop and it's 5 hours from here, often I have went and not found a guitar I liked, that had the sound I was looking for (the majority are factory guitars).
I am right by the US but the luthiers are far apart and there is no way you can visit all or even a lot of them unless you want to travel a lot of long trips. Then, most have no guitars or only one.
There is the online buying, only Zavaletta and GSI (I know of) have recordings so that's a plus, at least you can hear them although mixing often tints the sound. GSI will have a guitar recorded for you if you ask them, they are very nice.
What you can do is describe the sound you like, with recorded examples to someone where you want to buy a guitar, Spain or the US for example and have them sample guitars from you, eventually if they find one they can show it to you (through web) and buy and ship to you. That is what I am trying now.
I tried Andy's Negra and it is a very good sounding guitar and plays well too, I did not buy it because it was not the sound I was looking for. As I commented in the Four Sevillanas for Four Guitars post, his guitar reminds me of the 2nd guitar, a flamenco sound, more brilliance with less bass. It's been a month so I don't remember the sound clearly, Andy can describe it better. The bases are less than in the recording of the guitar IMO. That's the thing with any recordings.
Finally at $2K US, you won't find a lot of luthier made guitars, I know of none actually although there must be some. With this in mind I would seriously look at Andy's negra.
EDIT:
I forgot, there are the 2nd hand guitars too. I know when I sell a guitar it is normally in perfect condition except for minor scratches, if any. Plus the guitar got to open up because it was played, so also a good option.
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Date Nov. 10 2010 10:33:25
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HolyEvil
Posts: 1240
Joined: Nov. 6 2008
From: Sydney, Australia
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RE: Buying a decent flamenco guitar (in reply to rombsix)
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Hey El Rumbero..
talking as a person who has no good flamenco guitar stores near him.
The 2 good guitars that I bought, the Eliasson blanca and the Macias negra, 1 was through ebay but was sold by a foro member to another guy in Australia then I got it off the guy in Australia. Another was just through another foro member.
Being totally honest, if they were not sold by foro members, I won't be as keen as I was buying it unseen.
Seriously, don't buy new, buy used, you'll get a better quality guitar (altho used, but as long as it's not too banged up, I don't see the diff).
Maybe buy from the more reliable foro members whom you can trust.
If I haven't got my Macias, I'll jump at Andy's negra being sold.
But buy from someone you can trust and I think it'll be smooth sailing from there.
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Date Nov. 10 2010 12:50:49
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Ramon Amira
Posts: 1025
Joined: Oct. 14 2009
From: New York City
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RE: Buying a decent flamenco guitar (in reply to gbv1158)
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quote:
I have a Ramirez FL2, but to my ears, my Anders blanca is ABSOLUTELY superior!
Thanks for the audio clip of the FL2, but I posted that link in my original post. It's on the GSI page for the FL2.
As to the Anders, I didn't say that the FL2 was better. I alluded to the FL2 in conjunction with the previous recommendation of the Adalid Viviana. Of course any luthier guitar made by a respected luthier will be superior to a factory guitar.
But Rombsix stated that he is under certain constraints and time limitations. He also expressed a desire to be able to play the guitar before committing to a purchase, and to be able to buy it on the spot and take it home with him, which usually cannot be done with a luthier guitar. I was simply suggesting AN alternative for him to think about.
He also has budget considerations. I don't know how much Anders charges for his guitars, but obviously if it is way more than the cost of the FL2, then that has to be taken into account. On the other hand, if the cost of the Anders is close, then there's nothing to think about, except still for not being able to play it first.
_____________________________
Classical and flamenco guitars from Spain Ramon Amira Guitars
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Date Nov. 10 2010 18:03:27
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