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What is the essence of flamenco?   You are logged in as Guest
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What is the essence of flamenco?
Cante
  65% (13)
Toque
  35% (7)
Baile
  0% (0)


Total Votes : 20
(last vote on : Jun. 19 2007 10:41:02) 
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sonikete

Posts: 735
Joined: Jan. 9 2004
From: Sweden

What is the essence of flamenco? 
What is the essence of flamenco?
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 22 2006 23:08:53
 
sonikete

Posts: 735
Joined: Jan. 9 2004
From: Sweden

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
Well, you already know what i think LOL
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 22 2006 23:10:53
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14833
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
Cajon
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 4:38:59
 
duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
sherry

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This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 6:26:13
Guest

[Deleted] (in reply to sonikete) 
[Deleted by Admins]

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 6:33:54
Guest

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to Guest) 
gee sometimes i really wish u guys wouldnt joke around so much. This is meant to be a serious forum u know.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 6:45:41
Guest

[Deleted] (in reply to sonikete) 
[Deleted by Admins]

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 6:59:31
 
Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006
 

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete)2 votes
Cante, pulgar y rasgueados. El resto es chulear

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Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 7:44:59
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
Toque , because it is not limited to spanish speaking people

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 10:18:18
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14833
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
And Baile is the physical manifestation of the "Duende", whatever that is.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 18:36:05

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005
 

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
We discussed something similar in this thread:

http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=37016&appid=&p=&mpage=1&key=trinity&tmode=&smode=&s=#37016

Personally, I feel that flamenco is divided up into a "trinity" of cante, baile and toque and that the importance is divided equally amongst the three.

but its just an opinion.

Jb

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¡Si esto no está en compas, esto no es el Flamenco!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 18:45:14
 
duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
it´s sherry.

im having pistach nutts and gambas fried in garlic and chilie with a glas of dry sherry



_____________________________

This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 18:48:14
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14833
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to duende) 
Jamon, Pata negra, and Manzanilla, and green olives.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 18:49:03
 
duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
pata negra and sherry or the Pata Negra vine?

_____________________________

This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 18:50:41
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14833
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to duende) 
The band.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 21:15:12
 
duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to Ricardo) 
aaaah what cd?

_____________________________

This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 21:22:40

ToddK

 

Posts: 2961
Joined: Dec. 6 2004
 

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
Polka dots

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2006 22:10:47
 
Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005
 

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
? He?
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 0:18:58
 
JasonM

Posts: 2058
Joined: Dec. 8 2005
From: Baltimore

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to Doitsujin) 
The Force.

Tonight I opended up a package of Jamon Serrano I bought from La Tienda. It tasted like the the plastic package it came in. I then drank an entire bottle of manzinilla in celebration of the birth of our lord. (although it was the la gitana feria bottle)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 4:57:45
 
Francisco

Posts: 879
Joined: Jun. 13 2005
From: SW USA

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
The essence of flamenco?
Vibration!

Ok, what did I win?
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 6:04:03
 
sonikete

Posts: 735
Joined: Jan. 9 2004
From: Sweden

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
No Benise is,



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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 9:35:29
 
JasonM

Posts: 2058
Joined: Dec. 8 2005
From: Baltimore

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
quote:

No Benise is,


YOU WIN!!!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 16:51:31
 
Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to JasonM) 
quote:

What is the essence of flamenco?


sorry to get all serious on you guys now I know you are all just kidding but i wish you were more serious... like me sometimes

Imo Cante, Toque, Dance are just tools used to deliver flamenco, if it wasent those tools it would be something else ( I am getting all deep on your ass now hehe)

Honesty is the essence of flamenco

For example in some other style someone might say " It hurts", yet you look at theyr face and u dont see expression on theyr face that you would expect someone who is hurting to have on theyr face or even worse he/she is trying to look sexy while singing it or whatever, not to mention it sounds musically estetic (eg, perfect estetinc pleasing to the ear tone ) but pain is never pretty and esteticly sounding and never light. nobody screams from pain in Key.

The essence of flamenco is the Honesty in the way it deals with delivering emotions, its not about sounding pretty its about making the other guy feel the emotion you trying to deliver. this is where the "tools" come in Guitar, Song, Dance, Poem whatever.


the essence , is not a handmade instrument, or a chord or a falseta those are just tools.

flamenco is about telling any story about anything, but delivering in such honest manner that the listeners have no choice but be taken wherever the story goes, if its ugly or dark then u hear it with more then just your ears, if its happy you fell it in your heart as well as hear it with your ears.





Everything is the essence of flamenco and nothing exclusivly.

ps. dont ask me to clarifie anything because even i am not sure what i said but i belive in it 100 %

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 17:05:35

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005
 

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to JasonM) 
quote:

Tonight I opended up a package of Jamon Serrano I bought from La Tienda. It tasted like the the plastic package it came in.


Yes, I found the same thing with Jamon, although mine was a premium packet by Sanchez Romero Carvajal. I think if you buy the fresh stuff (ie. a whole leg of jamon and cut it yourself) then it might be better, but the small plastic packets aren't as good IMO.

Jb

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¡Si esto no está en compas, esto no es el Flamenco!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 20:39:23
 
Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to Florian) 
I think virtually all serious music has to do with moving of emotions.
Pop songs do that as well.

Flamenco is in a class of it's own (to me anyway) in the way that there is extreme rawness at one end and extreme vituosity at the other, both going together to make the whole.
By virtuosity, I don't just mean players like Paco and Tomatito etc, but players like Niño Jero and Diego Amaya and others too...
Flamenco guitar to me is all about spot-on timing...great dynamics...extreme slickness in execution of the very simplest of things... inventive phrasing... finding just "the" sweet spot in a chord and the most appropriate tone and voicing for that chord on the guitar... tasteful juxtaposition of beautiful warm, sweet chords with sour/dissonant ones to make your spirit soar and crash and soar again.. playing even a single-note line in a way that it doesn't sound bare, but rich and full and emotionally charged...


Oh yeah...and keeping compás too..

cheers

Ron

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A good guitar might be a good guitar
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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 20:44:03
 
Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to Ron.M) 
quote:

I think virtually all serious music has to do with moving of emotions.
Pop songs do that as well.

agreed, so what sets flamenco apart to me is the honesty and rawnes way in witch it delivers those emotions.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 21:04:40
 
sonikete

Posts: 735
Joined: Jan. 9 2004
From: Sweden

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
Well, the question from me was more intended like; which of these, in your opinion, is the only one flamenco couldnt exist without?


When it comes to what your personal relationship is to flamenco, then everyone probably have a different answer, but this thread started because ricardo asked me to see if it was right that most foreigners gets into guitar first rather than cante.



  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 22:25:36

JBASHORUN

Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005
 

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
quote:

Well, the question from me was more intended like; which of these, in your opinion, is the only one flamenco couldnt exist without?


If a dancer and guitarist get together to play, but there is NO CANTAOR, is it still Flamenco?

If a Cantaor and Guitarist get together to play, but there is NO DANCER, is it still Flamenco?

If a Cantaor and dancer get together to play, but there is NO GUITARIST, is it still Flamenco?

IMHO (and I repeat I-M-H-O!!!) the answer is "yes" for each question.

Jb

PS: and yes... most foreigners DO fall for the guitar before the cante.

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¡Si esto no está en compas, esto no es el Flamenco!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 22:33:34
 
Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to JBASHORUN) 
I dont know , all i can say is that a guitarist can do without a singer and without a Dancer for a hole show.


but the same dosent normally apply the other way, very very rarely.


so all the the guitar might not be the essence (depending who u ask) is the most necesary thing to a show

but alone none of this elements feel like complete flamenco

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 22:40:14
 
sonikete

Posts: 735
Joined: Jan. 9 2004
From: Sweden

RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (in reply to sonikete) 
quote:

PS: and yes... most foreigners DO fall for the guitar before the cante.


Exactly, that was my point, not that sologuitar isnt "flamenco"

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2006 22:43:24
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