What is the essence of flamenco? (Full Version)

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[Poll]

What is the essence of flamenco?
Cante
  65% (13)
Toque
  35% (7)
Baile
  0% (0)


Total Votes : 20
(last vote on : Jun. 19 2007 10:41:02) 


Message

sonikete -> What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 22 2006 23:08:53)

What is the essence of flamenco?



sonikete -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 22 2006 23:10:53)

Well, you already know what i think LOL [:D]



Ricardo -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 4:38:59)

Cajon



duende -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 6:26:13)

sherry



Guest -> [Deleted] (Dec. 23 2006 6:33:54)

[Deleted by Admins]



Guest -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 6:45:41)

gee sometimes i really wish u guys wouldnt joke around so much. This is meant to be a serious forum u know.[:@]



Guest -> [Deleted] (Dec. 23 2006 6:59:31)

[Deleted by Admins]



Anders Eliasson -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 7:44:59)

Cante, pulgar y rasgueados. El resto es chulear



Arash -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 10:18:18)

Toque , because it is not limited to spanish speaking people [;)]



Ricardo -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 18:36:05)

And Baile is the physical manifestation of the "Duende", whatever that is.[:D]



JBASHORUN -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 18:45:14)

We discussed something similar in this thread:

http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=37016&appid=&p=&mpage=1&key=trinity&tmode=&smode=&s=#37016

Personally, I feel that flamenco is divided up into a "trinity" of cante, baile and toque and that the importance is divided equally amongst the three.

but its just an opinion.

Jb



duende -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 18:48:14)

it´s sherry.

im having pistach nutts and gambas fried in garlic and chilie with a glas of dry sherry

[:)]



Ricardo -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 18:49:03)

Jamon, Pata negra, and Manzanilla, and green olives.



duende -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 18:50:41)

pata negra and sherry[:D] or the Pata Negra vine?



Ricardo -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 21:15:12)

The band.



duende -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 21:22:40)

aaaah what cd?



ToddK -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 23 2006 22:10:47)

Polka dots[:)]



Doitsujin -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 0:18:58)

? He?



JasonM -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 4:57:45)

The Force.

Tonight I opended up a package of Jamon Serrano I bought from La Tienda. It tasted like the the plastic package it came in. I then drank an entire bottle of manzinilla in celebration of the birth of our lord. (although it was the la gitana feria bottle)



Francisco -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 6:04:03)

The essence of flamenco?
Vibration!

Ok, what did I win?



sonikete -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 9:35:29)

No Benise is,



Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px



JasonM -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 16:51:31)

quote:

No Benise is,


YOU WIN!!!



Florian -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 17:05:35)

quote:

What is the essence of flamenco?


sorry to get all serious on you guys now[:D] I know you are all just kidding but i wish you were more serious... like me [:)] sometimes

Imo Cante, Toque, Dance are just tools used to deliver flamenco, if it wasent those tools it would be something else ( I am getting all deep on your ass now [:D] hehe)

Honesty is the essence of flamenco

For example in some other style someone might say " It hurts", yet you look at theyr face and u dont see expression on theyr face that you would expect someone who is hurting to have on theyr face or even worse he/she is trying to look sexy while singing it or whatever, not to mention it sounds musically estetic (eg, perfect estetinc pleasing to the ear tone ) but pain is never pretty and esteticly sounding and never light. nobody screams from pain in Key.

The essence of flamenco is the Honesty in the way it deals with delivering emotions, its not about sounding pretty its about making the other guy feel the emotion you trying to deliver. this is where the "tools" come in Guitar, Song, Dance, Poem whatever.


the essence , is not a handmade instrument, or a chord or a falseta those are just tools.

flamenco is about telling any story about anything, but delivering in such honest manner that the listeners have no choice but be taken wherever the story goes, if its ugly or dark then u hear it with more then just your ears, if its happy you fell it in your heart as well as hear it with your ears.





Everything is the essence of flamenco and nothing exclusivly.

ps. dont ask me to clarifie anything because even i am not sure what i said [:D] but i belive in it 100 %



JBASHORUN -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 20:39:23)

quote:

Tonight I opended up a package of Jamon Serrano I bought from La Tienda. It tasted like the the plastic package it came in.


Yes, I found the same thing with Jamon, although mine was a premium packet by Sanchez Romero Carvajal. I think if you buy the fresh stuff (ie. a whole leg of jamon and cut it yourself) then it might be better, but the small plastic packets aren't as good IMO.

Jb



Ron.M -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 20:44:03)

I think virtually all serious music has to do with moving of emotions.
Pop songs do that as well.

Flamenco is in a class of it's own (to me anyway) in the way that there is extreme rawness at one end and extreme vituosity at the other, both going together to make the whole.
By virtuosity, I don't just mean players like Paco and Tomatito etc, but players like Niño Jero and Diego Amaya and others too...
Flamenco guitar to me is all about spot-on timing...great dynamics...extreme slickness in execution of the very simplest of things... inventive phrasing... finding just "the" sweet spot in a chord and the most appropriate tone and voicing for that chord on the guitar... tasteful juxtaposition of beautiful warm, sweet chords with sour/dissonant ones to make your spirit soar and crash and soar again.. playing even a single-note line in a way that it doesn't sound bare, but rich and full and emotionally charged...


Oh yeah...and keeping compás too..[:D]

cheers

Ron



Florian -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 21:04:40)

quote:

I think virtually all serious music has to do with moving of emotions.
Pop songs do that as well.

agreed, so what sets flamenco apart to me is the honesty and rawnes way in witch it delivers those emotions.



sonikete -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 22:25:36)

Well, the question from me was more intended like; which of these, in your opinion, is the only one flamenco couldnt exist without?


When it comes to what your personal relationship is to flamenco, then everyone probably have a different answer, but this thread started because ricardo asked me to see if it was right that most foreigners gets into guitar first rather than cante.



[;)]



JBASHORUN -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 22:33:34)

quote:

Well, the question from me was more intended like; which of these, in your opinion, is the only one flamenco couldnt exist without?


If a dancer and guitarist get together to play, but there is NO CANTAOR, is it still Flamenco?

If a Cantaor and Guitarist get together to play, but there is NO DANCER, is it still Flamenco?

If a Cantaor and dancer get together to play, but there is NO GUITARIST, is it still Flamenco?

IMHO (and I repeat I-M-H-O!!!) the answer is "yes" for each question.

Jb

PS: and yes... most foreigners DO fall for the guitar before the cante.



Florian -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 22:40:14)

I dont know , all i can say is that a guitarist can do without a singer and without a Dancer for a hole show.


but the same dosent normally apply the other way, very very rarely.


so all the the guitar might not be the essence (depending who u ask) is the most necesary thing to a show [;)]

but alone none of this elements feel like complete flamenco



sonikete -> RE: What is the essence of flamenco? (Dec. 24 2006 22:43:24)

quote:

PS: and yes... most foreigners DO fall for the guitar before the cante.


Exactly, that was my point, not that sologuitar isnt "flamenco"

[;)]



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