"Coupling" issue - serious request for help

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Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

"Coupling" issue - serious...

No this isn't a dodgy request! This is what ToddK said when advising John about his picado runs

quote:

I think you might have a very very slight "coupling" issue
between I and M.

Although I'm nowhere near at John's level, I'm struggling with a coupling issue between M and A in arpegios - when I play at speed M is always a little bit late, so a fraction too close to A. At first I thought it was the nail catching, but it isn't. So I practice REAL slow. But if I try faster it goes back to it's previous pattern. Any suggestions?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 10 2008 21:28:55

John O.

Posts: 1723
Joined: Dec. 16 2005
From: Seeheim-Jugenheim, Germany

RE: "Coupling" issue - ser... (in reply to Ailsa)

Hi Ailsa,

I got the exercize below from a book, worked well for me. You can do it for pami and pimami as well:

http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=83774&p=1&tmode=1&smode=1

And like in the video one beat per note like I'll be doing with picado.

_____________________________

Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 11 2008 0:42:54

luke.park

Posts: 114
Joined: Dec. 29 2005

RE: "Coupling" issue - ser... (in reply to Ailsa)

hey ailsa,
this is where technique becomes soo gruelling and slave-driving. but you're doing the right thing, you already know what you're trying to improve and with persistency of the obsessive variety you will see results. as with all cases of training techniques, it comes down to extreme patience - something im training in itself! - so id say keep listening to examples of good arpeggios and going it over with the metronome until it eventually gives in lol
and i think that the robotic right hand takes a loooong time to get, and a human hand doesnt seem to suffice!! perhaps gerardo's got a bionic hand......

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 11 2008 0:45:42

Stu

Posts: 2551
Joined: Jan. 30 2007
From: London (the South of it), England

RE: "Coupling" issue - ser... (in reply to luke.park)

Hi Ailsa,
I posted this advice to someone struggling with Pimami arpegios, but can be applied to Pima too if thats your trouble spot.

quote:

Hey, another good practise technique for this (as well as everything else) is overlapping/underlapping. Its helped me a great deal especialy with my continous rasgueado.

basically it goes like this...... for arps...

.....If you are playing pimami, pimami etc,...then you have six strokes.

For underlapping,
Play very slowly and precisely and count each stroke as you go. Count in fives. 1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5 etc and stress every stroke on the count of 1.

So you'd end up with....
PimamIpimaMipimAmipiMamipImamiP......etc etc
1234512345123451234512345123451.....etc etc
You are basically changing where the stress is everytime. The stress moves in the opposite direction of the apr.

For overlapping you just count in sevens and again stress every count of one. this time the stress moves in the same direction as the arp.

Does this make sense??

It may sound confusing here but once you try it you will see how it works and its fairly straight forward.
Once you've cracked it its good to use on other techniques aswell.

Stu

In your case, if you are doing four stroke arps then you would count in 5s to overlap and 3s to underlap.

Try it if it makes sense, if it doesn't I'll show you on Sunday

Stu

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 11 2008 2:38:11

John O.

Posts: 1723
Joined: Dec. 16 2005
From: Seeheim-Jugenheim, Germany

RE: "Coupling" issue - ser... (in reply to Ailsa)

quote:

No this isn't a dodgy request! This is what ToddK said when advising John about his picado runs

Just to make sure:
This is a serious request and not another one of your shenanigans again, right?

_____________________________

Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 11 2008 3:04:26

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: "Coupling" issue - ser... (in reply to John O.)

quote:

This is a serious request and not another one of your shenanigans again, right?

You know me John, I'm not shy. If I've got something dodgy to ask, I'll come straight out with it

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 11 2008 5:16:15

Estevan

Posts: 1936
Joined: Dec. 20 2006
From: Torontolucía

RE: "Coupling" issue - ser... (in reply to Ailsa)

Stu's advice is very good - a classic method for dealing with many problems.
Practising scales with M and A (slowly) can help too.

Here's another arp exercise you might like to try (assuming that you have i-m-a on 3-2-1, and p on whatever bass note you like, depending on the chord).
Practise groups of five, grouped into 2+3 by accenting M and A like this:
p i M i m |A m A m i

...slowly and evenly, concentrating on the exact placement (in time) of m and a in particular. It really focuses the attention on the relationship (there's that 'coupling' thing again

) between those two fingers.

_____________________________

Me da igual. La música es música.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 11 2008 5:51:32

Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: "Coupling" issue - ser... (in reply to Estevan)

Thanks Stu and Estevan!

Will try those in my practice tonight.

Stu your explanation is fine - the accent is either one note more, or one note less, than the pattern, so it moves one note every time. Maths I can do, it's just arps!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 11 2008 6:24:19

Ricardo

Posts: 14861
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: "Coupling" issue - ser... (in reply to Ailsa)

Simply landing my "weak" finger ON the strong beat usually works out the bugs for me. Use a metronome, medium speed. Mipa, Mipa, etc. Or Mapi, Mapi, or Mamipi, or Mipima.

If the string M finger is on is 2nd string, I might change just that note in the chord each beat so I have a melodic focus as well as rhythmic.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 12 2008 1:40:38

n85ae

Posts: 877
Joined: Sep. 7 2006

RE: "Coupling" issue - ser... (in reply to Ailsa)

Cut you fingernails short, so your fingers can adapt to the movement without
fingernail snagging. Then when you get smooth and fast, let them grow back
out a bit. Long nails can cause all kinds of misery when trying to develop
speed at some techniques.

Jeff

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 12 2008 3:57:11