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bernd

 

Posts: 680
Joined: Feb. 15 2004
 

Ivor Mairants CD 

Ivor Mairants made a Method book of flamenco guitar that had an optional LP with all the content and some nice and easy solo pieces. Does anyone know if this LP is available as CD? Also a shop recomandation would also be helpful.

Thanks.

Salu2
Bernd

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 11 2007 2:34:58
 
nhills

Posts: 230
Joined: Jul. 13 2003
From: West Des Moines, IA USA

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to bernd

My copy of the book is dated 1958 - long before CDs and I doubt that it's ever been re-released. I've always wondered how "correct" it is - despite the people helping him, he was definitely not a flamenco guitarist.

I have the LP but I've never bothered to rip it.

Cheers,
Norman

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 11 2007 15:05:22
 
bernd

 

Posts: 680
Joined: Feb. 15 2004
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to nhills

I remember someone posted a link to a source where the LP was available on CD. It was in the Mundo Flamenco forum, but that forum is disabled. The message appeared this summer. I also do have the LP but have no record player anymore.

Salu2
Bernd

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 11 2007 18:17:57

Tomás Jiménez

 

Posts: 235
Joined: Feb. 24 2006
 

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Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Mar. 13 2008 23:08:35
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 11 2007 18:18:45
 
Pimientito

Posts: 2481
Joined: Jul. 30 2007
From: Marbella

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to bernd

I am pretty sure I have an audio cassette of that recording. I can look for it on the weekend.
send me PM
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 11 2007 18:35:22
 
frhout

 

Posts: 451
Joined: Apr. 28 2005
From: France

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to bernd

I have this LP but don't have the book. Music arranged by Ivor Mairants and played by Pepe Del Sur.

Side A includes Soleares, Seguidillas, Sevillanas, Alegrias, Bulerias, Tanguillo, Tientos, Cantino, Farruca, Guajira, Zapateado, Media Granadina, Fandango, Tientos, Seguidilla, Fandanguillo, Petenera, La Rosa, Serrenas, Tarantas, Solea por bulerias, Mineras, Alegrias, Soleares, Malaguena.

Side B has Tanguillo, Alegrias, Tientos, Farruca,Seguidilla or Seguiriya, Bulerias, Granadina.

I haven't listened to it for ages, bought in the early '80s. If I have a USB turntable, I'll convert it into mp3. This could be my next purchase when I have the cash.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 11 2007 18:38:10
 
bernd

 

Posts: 680
Joined: Feb. 15 2004
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to Tomás Jiménez

Tomás:
quote:

I regret that I do not know what the music is like in it.
They say that the music was played by Paco Peña with a different name.


There are some nice and easy solo pieces to different palos. Only classical tremolo is used and no alzapúa. But nevertheless it´s a fine traditional repertory. Regarding the guitarist I was told several times that it really is Paco Peña. The problem at that time was that Paco P. already was contracted to a record company and not allowed to bring out records at another company. So his name changed to Pepe del Sur. In the Mundo Flamenco forum someone said the guitarist was not Paco Peña but Pepe Martinez. That was new to me. Maybe someone has the possibility to ask Paco directly, would be an interesting answer.

Salu2
Bernd

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 11 2007 19:28:02
 
steenland

 

Posts: 36
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to frhout

www.musicroom.com has it. Have record SRLP 107, Copied this to tape and then to CD.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jul. 5 2010 7:27:35
 
steenland

 

Posts: 36
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to nhills

The guitaist Pepe del Sur (Paco Pena) is definitely a flamenco guitarist.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jul. 5 2010 7:31:33
 
Dave K

Posts: 155
Joined: Mar. 29 2006
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to steenland

Just read thru this thread for the first time. I purchased the book, "Flamenco Guitar" by Ivor Mairants at Schierson Bros in Los Angeles about 1959 or so. Its copyright 1958. Sometime later, but 1963 or before, I bought an LP "Introduction to Flamenco" Capitol LP T10012. I was surprised to find the record covered Ivor Mairants book. Side 1 covers part 2 in the book and features the great guitarist Paco Aguilera, with naration by Keith Patterson, with jelao by Rosa Flores, Soledad Jordan, and Ramon Velez.
Side 2 of the LP features guitarists Sarasate (M. Vasquez), Juanito Serrano, and Pepe Martinez playing for Cojo de Huelva and Adelfa Soto. Another guitarist, Antonio Gonzalez, is listed on the record but I'm not sure where he comes in. The book and record helped me a lot in the days that there was not a lot of info available (At least in California) about flamenco.
I don't see (or hear) any referance to Paco Pena here, but he may have been featured in other or later versions.

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Avise La Fin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jul. 6 2010 4:44:09
 
luiso_777

 

Posts: 1
Joined: Dec. 1 2010
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to bernd

Hi,

we've just bought the book, some weeks ago, but still keep searching for the audio.
Did anyone here could find it?

Thanks in advance.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 1 2010 16:01:15
 
Paul Magnussen

Posts: 1762
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to bernd

Pepe del Sur was indeed Paco. When I was doing my complete discography to go with the interview I did for Classical Guitar magazine (June/July 2004), I asked him if I should include the Mairants record and he said No. I rather got the impression that he didn't want his name associated with it.

What's the date on the recording? That might be the reason, rather than the contract with Fontana, which wasn't until 1968.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 1 2010 17:27:17
 
Paul Magnussen

Posts: 1762
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to nhills

quote:

I've always wondered how "correct" it is - despite the people helping him, he was definitely not a flamenco guitarist.


My friend the late Richard Lawrence marked up all the mistakes in his copy, and sent it back to Mairants.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 1 2010 17:29:18
 
Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to nhills

quote:

I've always wondered how "correct" it is - despite the people helping him, he was definitely not a flamenco guitarist.


Hi Norman,

I'm not sure if you mean the Transcriber was definitely not a Flamenco guitarist or the player?

Peña is probably the best Traditional Flamenco player on the planet.

cheers,

Ron
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 1 2010 18:02:06
 
frhout

 

Posts: 451
Joined: Apr. 28 2005
 

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 8 2012 7:40:12
 
attila57

 

Posts: 51
Joined: Oct. 27 2012
From: Budapest, Hungary

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to bernd

quote:

I bought an LP "Introduction to Flamenco" Capitol LP T10012. I was surprised to find the record covered Ivor Mairants book. Side 1 covers part 2 in the book and features the great guitarist Paco Aguilera, with naration by Keith Patterson, with jelao by Rosa Flores, Soledad Jordan, and Ramon Velez.


Hello Dave (and everyone),

I believe, there are two different LPs going with that book. The first one is the quoted 'INTRODUCTION TO FLAMENCO' Spanish Regal 1020, or Capitol LPT10012. This goes with section 2 of the book and played by the quoted guitarists. The other LP is called 'THE ART OF THE FLAMENCO GUITAR' & published as Spark Records SRLP 107. This latter one is played by Paco Pena and covers parts 2 & 3 of the book. It is currently available on CD and can be found and bought on the net, too, but you cannot download it. The CD should have a red front cover matching that of the book.
I'm looking for these recordings myself, too, if anyone has it as MP3.
It is easy to rip the music from the LP with any simple sound recording program.
Paco Pena is really brilliant. His Malaguena and Rumbas are unbeatable, I think.
As for he Ivor Mairants book, it's a nice old collection of palos. He uses the classical tremolo (which is more demanding for me than the 5-note one) and the notation is quite strange with all those rasgueos written as individual notes.
Once you've got used to it, you realize that he uses the same eami(i) pattern throughout.

Attila
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 27 2012 1:48:24
 
Dave K

Posts: 155
Joined: Mar. 29 2006
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to attila57

Hi Atilla, thanks for clearing up what was confusing for me, that there were two LPs for the Mairants book. Makes sense to me now.
Cheers,
Dave

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Avise La Fin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 27 2012 17:54:25
 
britguy

Posts: 712
Joined: Dec. 26 2010
From: Ontario, Canada

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to Paul Magnussen

quote:

My friend the late Richard Lawrence marked up all the mistakes in his copy, and sent it back to Mairants.


I bought Mairants' book about 1958 or so. Mainly because there was hardly anything else available in England at that time, written in English.

I recall Ivor Mairants as a popular steel-string jazz guitarist who had frequent broadcasts on radio and TV etc. Also recall he had his name splashed around endorsing things like ( steel) guitar strings, etc.etc. But always wondered why he had the nerve to author a book on Flamenco guitar!

I recall the edition I had was liberally laced with numerous " look; me too" - type credibility photos of the author posing with several Spanish flamenco guitarists. But I did not find the book very authoritive, and I doubted that he personally knew - or cared - very much about the real art of Flamenco. But, seems like he sold a lot of copies. I didn't sell my copy, I think I just gave it away.

Hopefully there are more definitive instruction books on Flamenco guitar available today. And hopefully authored by genuine flamenco players; perhaps more qualified than Mr. Mairants. . .

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 27 2012 20:38:20
 
attila57

 

Posts: 51
Joined: Oct. 27 2012
From: Budapest, Hungary

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to britguy

Hi Mr Fruit Farmer,

It's nice to read your lines. You know, I had the same feelings as you when I first opened the book. There's a photo when Mr Mairants poses with Sabicas and Manolo Moreno, and he even got F. Moreno Torroba to write a short recommendation to his book.
I thought he must have been kinda finger in every pie guy.
And now it comes true...
Recently the book has been re-published in an unchanged format. It must have something to to do with Mr Mairants' own company but I haven't checked it. He has a big site on the net, too.
Back in the 50's he got Paco Pena and other flamenco guitarists to perform the pieces for his book, because, obviously he couldn't. Really, I think it must have been their idea (and their material) first to publish it, Mr Mairants just brought it under roof.
I'm actually looking for a downloadable version of the matching Paco Pena CD, which I'm sure, is very interesting. As I have the book they would be more interesting together, because, I feel, the notation in the book is oversimplified. According to the book all rasgueos should be the eami(i) pattern which, I suspect, cannot be true. Also, historically it'd be nice to have an overview of the trends and palos in the fifties.
So please, if someone has the LP or the CD, and he's ready to convert it to MP3 and share it with me, let me know.
As for other flamenco books, yes, there are very some good ones, and you can even donload them from faststrings.com if you register and click on 'flamenco'. There are books of Tomatito, Juan Martín, Paco Pena etc. on that site, all with videos and CDs.

Attila
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 28 2012 0:47:20
 
Dave K

Posts: 155
Joined: Mar. 29 2006
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to britguy

What bullschit! In 1958 very little outside Spain was known about flamenco... Mairants not only produced a damn good book (for the day) about flamenco, he got probably the best, authentic, flamenco guitarist of the time, Paco Aguilera to play some samples and accurately (for the most part) transcribed his music.
You couldn't have asked for more back then.
If you have problems (evidently) playing flamenco, chalk it up to "giving away" your copy of Ivor Mairant's book.
Cheers,
Dave

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Avise La Fin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 28 2012 1:42:46
 
frhout

 

Posts: 451
Joined: Apr. 28 2005
From: France

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to frhout

I'll post mp3 from this album in the Download section.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 28 2012 7:49:26
 
attila57

 

Posts: 51
Joined: Oct. 27 2012
From: Budapest, Hungary

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to frhout

Francis, this is great, thank you.
This recording is, I think, quite invaluable. There's not much left to us from that period, apart from this. And, it's good quality and comprehensive! All the palos as they were almost 60 years ago, at the end of the 50's. And, from one of the best flamenco performers of all time!
I've just listened to the last track (No.7) and it isn't a Malaguena but a Granaína with a lovely falseta taken from Albéniz's Asturias.
What you've uploaded must be side B of the LP.
It would be great if you could do the same to the shorter pieces and samples on side A as well.
This recording is definitely Paco Pena, his style, his rasgueos, his falsetas.
It is just as I suspected: the book is great, but you must have the recording to feel what Paco had really meant. The book just generally shows a 4- or 5-stroke rasgueo, but leaves the rest to you (which is OK), but it's nice hear Paco Pena clarifying the things.
Thanks again.
Attila
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 28 2012 13:26:06
 
frhout

 

Posts: 451
Joined: Apr. 28 2005
From: France

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to attila57

That is of course a Granaina, I mistyped the thing. I'll upload side A of the LP if anyone can enjoy as it's almost impossible to find.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 28 2012 13:53:43
 
horationelson

 

Posts: 21
Joined: Jan. 31 2012
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to bernd

Many thanks for uplaoding the mp3's
Iv'e had this book for 45 years, a lot of the material came from Joaquin Gomez
who is mentioned in the book.
I was Joaquin's "apprentice" back then (and dishwasher in his restaurant) he
told me he spent many hours with Ivor Mairants, putting the stuff on paper.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 28 2012 19:10:46
 
frhout

 

Posts: 451
Joined: Apr. 28 2005
From: France

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to horationelson

I bought the LP in the early '80s, but I didn't buy the book which was one of the three available at the time among Pena's Toques Flamencos and Juan Martin's El Arte Flamenco de la Guitarra.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 28 2012 19:20:04
 
eg.czerny

 

Posts: 56
Joined: Jun. 30 2005
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to frhout

Thanks very much for posting the audio. I've waited about 40 years to hear what the solos in part 3 sound like. I have the book and I managed to find and borrow the record (which I copied rather poorly on a reel to reel tape recorder) but it only covered part 2 with the 25 short pieces. It's a different recording than what you posted. My version (copyright 1958) features castanets, palmas, pitos and Taconeos on some of the palos and the capo position is different. The guitar definitely sounds better on yours.
Thanks again
Ed
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 28 2012 19:32:03
 
El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to eg.czerny

Awsome , I had a lend of that book from a guitar teacher I had years ago , and learned some bits from it , eventually he wanted it back , so I naturally , of course photocopied a few of the tunes i was interested in , and i never even thought there was a record ,, so juat now i dug them out to read along ....yes all good stuff ......
I have Bulerias ,, the Farruca , and Tientos i did have the Soleares but cannot find it any more ,,,. so really good to listen to , real thanks for posting them .

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 28 2012 20:48:22
 
frhout

 

Posts: 451
Joined: Apr. 28 2005
From: France

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to frhout

Thanks to my USB turntable which actually works and to Soundforge to remove some but not all of the clicks.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 28 2012 21:32:04
 
Dave K

Posts: 155
Joined: Mar. 29 2006
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to frhout

Great job Francis! I've had the 'Introduction to Flamenco' LP for many years now, and it was definetely played by Paco Aguilera, a very popular, much recorded, meat and potatoes kind of guitarist from that era. However, I had never heard the cover of part 3 before now. Paco peña would have been around 16 years old in 1958...Pretty amazing. To me, it doesn't sound that much like him 'till you consider when it was done.

By the way, the Farruca was left out of part 3, was that an oversite or was the record unplayable for that palo?

Many, many thanks to you for uploading your records Francis.

Cheers
Dave

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Avise La Fin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 29 2012 19:54:52
 
bernd

 

Posts: 680
Joined: Feb. 15 2004
 

RE: Ivor Mairants CD (in reply to bernd

Since a few days I haven´t been on this forum for about 2 years. Nice to see that my thread started 5 years ago, is still in use :-)

As I now read Paco Aguilera I have to say it really can be true. At the moment I have no possibility to listen to the LP, but I have some Volumes of the series "Maestros de la Guitarra Flamenca". In one of this volumes Paco Aguilera is playing 2 or three solo pieces that I liked very much. For everyone who is interested in traditional flamenco, I recommend this series. Most of the music is played as solo guitar and a lot has an acceptable sound quaiity.

Salu2
Bernd

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 30 2012 9:42:53
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