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I don't ask for help unless I just can't figure it out for the life of me so here we go again:
1.) 2:14 he starts just before 12 (I'm sure about this)
2.) 2:24 he starts just before 12 again after the abanico on beat 11
3.) 2:33 he starts at beat 1 and plays all triplets before that golpe after the picado run ends at beat 11?
So here's the problem : it's missing one whole beat because by the current counting, the end result is him resolving at beat 11 @2 :42 which is obviously wrong. Which tells me I'm somehow counting wrong, small chance that he actually missed a beat but that's close to impossible. (I only say this because I counted millions of times all to the same result) The problem most likely I think lies in the 3rd point... If you're patient, then I would greatly appreciate it. It's also a fantastic (and quite difficult) solea so it would be good for you too
So that you don't spend your head scratching trying to figure out the part before, the piece itself starts at beat 12 @ 0:08 which is also the exact same phrasing at 1:56 (again you can count me on this )
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to Mark2)
Elaborate, I told you, I already counted a million times all to the same result. How's it he resolves on beat 11 @ 2:33? Are you sure about that? I think he resolved it on 11
Posts: 15334
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to metalhead)
quote:
3.) 2:33 he starts at beat 1 and plays all triplets before that golpe after the picado run ends at beat 11?
Absolutely not, move it all back one beat. He starts the triplets on 12 and plays through count 12 accenting 12, 3, 6, then golpe from above on 12. The next compás has the syncopated chords but ends on 10 as it should.
Here is a tip. Whenever there is a legit backing track, first play along with scratch rhythm, or count if you must, (both are ideal), so you get a sense for how the phrase lines up to the background. In this case your focus about the melody fooled your ear because you are connecting your inner clock to that backing like he has done already. This goes for all compressed recordings (the background is pushed back by loud frontline dynamics so you need to focus your ear on it).
quote:
Elaborate, I told you, I already counted a million times all to the same result. How's it he resolves on beat 11 @ 2:33? Are you sure about that? I think he resolved it on 11
No. The E inverted with G# is right on 10. A count back. I guess your ear is thrown by the syncopated rhythm at 2:24? The E arpegio that stops at 12th fret going up is stopping on count 10 (9e&ah10). Again, track 12,3, and 6 for those accents. Yes he does the thumb pick up notes before those accents each time.
Posts: 15334
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to metalhead)
quote:
Am I right?
If by whatever your confused scribble means you do that E major arpegio 9e&ah10 that comes after, and it fixes all the rest, then YES.
To get that rhythm as EFDE, GAbFG, over top counts 12,1,2, and 3,4,5….you can do the classic drummer 4 against 3 syncopation (say “pass the goddamn butter” over 3 foot taps)
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to Ricardo)
confused scribble? the 'a's are what you call the 'ah' of the 16th notes. Common, you're saying as if I wrote this while being high on meth, it's basic math
Posts: 15334
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to metalhead)
quote:
ORIGINAL: metalhead
confused scribble? the 'a's are what you call the 'ah' of the 16th notes. Common, you're saying as if I wrote this while being high on meth, it's basic math
If you do meth instead of math that is your business. But you are off earlier and demanding clarification despite a clear backing track. You are welcome.
Posts: 1956
Joined: Jul. 12 2004
From: San Francisco
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to metalhead)
I think if you understand the palmas it becomes clear. Do you recognize the pattern in the palmas and would you know which beat you are on with just the palmas sounding? That is the issue, and it will continue to vex you as long as that is the case. Listen to some solo compas tracks of solea until you internalize the pattern(s)
BTW I was impressed with Ben's syncopation. Dude had good compas. May he RIP.
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to Mark2)
quote:
I think if you understand the palmas it becomes clear. Do you recognize the pattern in the palmas and would you know which beat you are on with just the palmas sounding? That is the issue, and it will continue to vex you as long as that is the case. Listen to some solo compas tracks of solea until you internalize the pattern(s)
It's all good now, I was wrongly counting the phrasing from 2:24 to 2:26 as eight notes which lead me to missing a whole beat.
Posts: 15334
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to metalhead)
quote:
confused scribble? the 'a's are what you call the 'ah' of the 16th notes. Common, you're saying as if I wrote this while being high on meth, it's basic math
I reread what you wrote today and realize that you are trying to assign 16th note subdivisions over counts 12,1,2, and also 3,4,5. But you are not doing it correctly. The correct way is simply understand the polyrhythm 4:3 which turns out to be:
12..ah(2).&.(3)e..ah(thumb bass note) 3..ah(4).&.(5)e..ah, etc.
If you want to master it by the drummer rudiment “pass the god damn butter” the 3’s are “pass…God….but”, and the 4’s are “pass the…damn…er.” Good to learn it with two hands, or hand and foot doing either and switch.
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to Ricardo)
I was a bit annoyed to having to re-practice it as I already developed the muscle memory after practicing it yesterday. But you know the funny thing? Today I sat back to practice it and started playing it by the counting you said, it turns I'd been playing by the exact same way yesterday. So despite writing it wrong here, while playing I played by the right subdivisions, most likely my intuition took over
Posts: 15334
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to Manitas de Lata)
quote:
ORIGINAL: Manitas de Lata
i didnt enjoy that solea
Prefer more like
Irrelevant, but worse, it is not Peña, it is R. Montoya and Sabicas material, Peña often records their stuff and takes credit. At least Ben wrote his own falsetas.
RE: Can you help me count a solea? (in reply to metalhead)
the main riff , very used in progressive metal . some hints of rumba (solos) of what Ricardo calls fakeflamenco (or whatever its called) recalling some spanish style near the sea where english and german people likes to stay and hear some fake whatever, no country style no hints of flamenco/solea , in my ignorance doesnt feel like a solea.
only the solo have some feeling , the rest sounds also to mechanic like you pratice tecnic with a metronome.
well thats my opinion , its a matter of personal taste
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