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Chicuelo Rasgueado   You are logged in as Guest
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sim999

 

Posts: 62
Joined: Aug. 18 2011
 

Chicuelo Rasgueado 

I know this question has been answered before but I can't find the post regarding the rasgueado that Chicuelo does at 8'46.



Could somebody confirm what i'm hearing ?

Sounds to me like 3 sextuplets starting on beat 1 of of a 6' group (either on the twelve or on 6 depends how you count this).
There is an off beat stroke just before the rasgueado (marked | on 9& I believe). And then I think there is one note to "launch" the rasgueado before the beat


| x123456 123456 123456 X | | | | | => then closing on 10.

I'm wondering what right hand pattern he's using I guess the golpe can just be done when the index is going down so maybe ?

a iiaiia iiaiia iiaiia (beat is on the first i going down, first a (or any finger m or i is just before the beat to launch the rasgueo)

Speaking for myself i use frequently the same one but start with an upstroke index with the downbeat either on a or directly on the index.

Formatting is all messed up but basically each groupe of 6 begin on the beat
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 12 2018 15:29:57
 
Leñador

Posts: 4865
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

Pretty sure just I and M like the Jerezanos do.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 12 2018 17:42:29
 
kitarist

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Joined: Dec. 4 2012
 

RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

The triplets (three groups of 2 triplets in each) seem to be done just with i; if you focus on looking at the i finger and its MCP joint, you can see the finger going up and down for each stroke. I see the whole sequence like this: (lowercase for upstrokes)

(I) i (I)iIiIi (I)iIiIi (I)iIiIi (I) I I _ CAMI where there is a golpe with a on each of the (I).

The golpes are on 10 12 2 4 6 and then the cami rasgueado on 10 (well, the 'i' of the cami is on 10). (BTW I am not sure if it is cami or just ami for the last rasgueado; the rest I am pretty certain about).

One difficulty with this video is that the audio and video are not in sync - the audio is delayed by about 300 ms. I had to correct that in VLC to be more confident in what I am seeing and hearing.

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Konstantin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 12 2018 19:03:12
 
FredGuitarraOle

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Joined: Dec. 7 2012
From: Lisboa, Portugal

RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

I listened to the rasgueo before reading your explanation and I hear it exactly the same as you.

iiaiia iiaiia iiaiia i

The bolted fingers being index dowstrokes with golpe on the 12, 2, 4 and 6 respectively.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 12 2018 19:09:50
 
sim999

 

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Joined: Aug. 18 2011
 

RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

I found another video


Same one at 5'12.

I dont think its im maybe it is indeed just i all along Iiiiii Iiiiii Iiiiii.
Lets wait on Ricardo hes pretty good at this !
Last rasgueo is just ami not cami beat is on i going down normal stuff.
Im pretty sure that there is a stroke just before the rasgueo To launch it.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 12 2018 19:43:10
 
sim999

 

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Joined: Aug. 18 2011
 

RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

Well I think it is indeed just the index but his hand is doing kind of a weird move.
What a beast ! I was trying to add new compas variations to my bulerias but this one is just too much :) The guy is uber tight all along
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 13 2018 21:53:41
 
rodrigovalt

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Joined: May 1 2011
 

RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

I really think he is doing this pattern: miiiii miiiii miiiii

m down - I down - I up - I down - I up - I down

That is why the first stroke from each group has the accent (because is being done with the m finger being released from the thumb). I also think he is releasing every down stroke from the thumb, but the first one which is being done with the middle finger is a little louder.

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Rodrigo
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 13 2018 23:04:42
 
kitarist

Posts: 244
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RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

quote:

ORIGINAL: sim999

Well I think it is indeed just the index but his hand is doing kind of a weird move.



Yeah I wondered about that too initially but if you try it yourself - I think it is just the combination of inertia (non-working fingers relaxed) and some sympathetic finger movement (and the a golpe at the beginning of each 6-group) which kind of move the hand and fingers that way, just from doing all that timed the way it is. We'll see what Ricardo says, if he notices this thread..

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Konstantin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 13 2018 23:23:28
 
callemunicion

 

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RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

Ricardo discussed it already in another thread.
He said it's i down (with golpe) i up a down i down i up a down repeat
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 14 2018 12:13:19
 
kitarist

Posts: 244
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RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to callemunicion

quote:

ORIGINAL: callemunicion

Ricardo discussed it already in another thread.
He said it's i down (with golpe) i up a down i down i up a down repeat


That would certainly be a more common pattern (the IiAIiA...) which I considered. The problem is that it is not consistent with how the i finger moves up-down-up-down with each stroke sound. Even if some of the i movement is just to re-position (rather than strike), in the second half of the "sextuplet" the i finger moves in the opposite direction of what it would be if it were IiAIiA (see in red below):

(I)iIiIi.. versus (I)iAIiA...

Based on that I concluded it must be (I)iIiIi (I)iIiIi ...

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Konstantin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 14 2018 18:37:15
 
Ricardo

Posts: 10490
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to callemunicion

quote:

ORIGINAL: callemunicion

Ricardo discussed it already in another thread.
He said it's i down (with golpe) i up a down i down i up a down repeat

This is what Paco did in el tempul. I had assumed the same but later revised my opinion after seeing another video.

It’s all index finger down up with golpe every 6 as ktitarst and sim999 figured already
http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=210578&appid=&p=&mpage=1&key=chicuelo%2Cel%2Ctempul&tmode=&smode=&s=#210727

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 14 2018 19:31:40
 
kitarist

Posts: 244
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RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to Ricardo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricardo
It’s all index finger down up with golpe every 6 as ktitarst and sim999 figured already




Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (1)

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Konstantin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 15 2018 7:48:09
 
sim999

 

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RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

Thanks you Ricardo for taking the time to check this one. It is just a simple back and forth index move but my god it's so hard to do at that tempo you have to be completely relax.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 15 2018 9:07:31
 
jalalkun

Posts: 159
Joined: May 3 2017
From: Iraq, living in Cologne, Germany

RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

god daym...this chap could kill a woman

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My name is Jalal.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 15 2018 10:28:33
 
Leñador

Posts: 4865
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: Chicuelo Rasgueado (in reply to sim999

WTF? Just index up and down??? That’s unnaturally fast.....P.E.D.’s!!

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 15 2018 17:29:34
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