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lukeofgod

Posts: 113
Joined: Jan. 11 2012
From: Bay Area- CA

Went to the Guitar Salon 

What an incredible collection of flamenco guitars. I got a chance to play an Ethan Deutsch guitar. It was a pretty awesome guitar for the price I believe some where around 3000. It held its own against a 5500$ one I fell in love with and am now determined to buy before someone buys before me!

Anyone who has the chance to visit the showroom,do it, it's highly recommended!

website: http://www.guitarsalon.com

EDIT: that Ethan Deutsch guitar is actually $4000, still a great guitar for that price!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 18 2013 1:00:27
 
Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

I live near it, been a few times. Very cool place, they're cool about letting you play things that you're obviously not going to buy too. You came down from the bay area to check it out?

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 18 2013 1:47:42
 
FlamencoD

 

Posts: 113
Joined: Apr. 7 2012
From: Portland, OR

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

Haven't been there but I go to their website weekly, if not more, to gaze at the beautiful guitars that I can't afford. They have a great photographer, and most of their guitars have a video associated with it which is cool.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 18 2013 2:12:18
 
bluesbuster

Posts: 56
Joined: Mar. 9 2011
From: Los Angeles

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

It's a cool place and most folks there are fine. I bought a guitar from them about 2 years ago and it was a great experience, much better than what I expected.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 18 2013 5:33:19
 
lukeofgod

Posts: 113
Joined: Jan. 11 2012
From: Bay Area- CA

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to Leñador

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lenador

I live near it, been a few times. Very cool place, they're cool about letting you play things that you're obviously not going to buy too. You came down from the bay area to check it out?


Yeah I did. I took a two day vacation with my buddies and decided to stop buy. I'm do for an upgrade, I've had my guitar for 5 years and I think I've gotten to a point where I deserve a better guitar. Definitely will buy one from GSI before the end of the year. (just not looking forward to that drive again )
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 18 2013 5:44:25
 
tri7/5

 

Posts: 570
Joined: May 5 2012
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

Always good eye candy but there are much better deals to be had outside of GSI.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 18 2013 12:36:28
 
tele

Posts: 1468
Joined: Aug. 17 2012
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to tri7/5

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dyingsea

Always good eye candy but there are much better deals to be had outside of GSI.


Yeah definately high prices but no wonder as they are mostly spanish guitars, in california.

For example, antonio raya pardo makes a guitar (blanca) to your specs for 3000 euros and there is used one for usd5500.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 18 2013 13:44:13
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14984
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

Guys, ok, maybe I shouldn't say it in public but just so you know...when prices are inflated (as at G. salon) you are SUPPOSED to negotiate. It's how the market works. Often they are selling used guitars on consignment etc so they get what they can get for the sellers plus the commission. Tough business. BUT do research and see what you can play with. You say 3K from other source, they list 5.5K, so you can tell em you go with other source or let it go 3.5K, plus some strings etc ....get the idea?

Ricardo

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 18 2013 16:53:26
 
tele

Posts: 1468
Joined: Aug. 17 2012
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to Ricardo

Well negotiation goes for just about anything, but if one can cut thousands off then its quite something.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 18 2013 18:20:36
 
Turner

 

Posts: 81
Joined: Nov. 5 2011
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

Sounds good, but will you ever actually get more than a few hundred off a decent guitar?
Maybe so, I've never dealt with them but I'm skeptical they would drop very much off the the price.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 18 2013 22:27:22
 
tele

Posts: 1468
Joined: Aug. 17 2012
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to Turner

quote:

ORIGINAL: Turner

Sounds good, but will you ever actually get more than a few hundred off a decent guitar?
Maybe so, I've never dealt with them but I'm skeptical they would drop very much off the the price.



I really dont know but I can imagine it depends on how much the comission part is. I have taken 500 euros off a guitar, and this was suggested by the seller as his last price, so it really depends. Usually in a shop you would think there is less to take off but could be depending on many factors. I would take a guess that 700euros off the price is the usual limit on 4-6000 euro guitars.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 19 2013 0:19:09
 
FlamencoD

 

Posts: 113
Joined: Apr. 7 2012
From: Portland, OR

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

I always negotiate whenever I buy an instrument, car, jewelery, or other big purchase. It's standard procedure in those industries.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 19 2013 4:20:32
 
bluesbuster

Posts: 56
Joined: Mar. 9 2011
From: Los Angeles

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

I've got a great price at GS, but it was for a rather low-range guitar. Negotiation is key, I suppose.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 19 2013 6:58:01
 
lukeofgod

Posts: 113
Joined: Jan. 11 2012
From: Bay Area- CA

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to tele

quote:

ORIGINAL: tele

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dyingsea

Always good eye candy but there are much better deals to be had outside of GSI.


Yeah definately high prices but no wonder as they are mostly spanish guitars, in california.

For example, antonio raya pardo makes a guitar (blanca) to your specs for 3000 euros and there is used one for usd5500.


Speaking of antonio raya pardo... I actually had the chance to play that 5500$ guitar. Honestly the easiest, best sounding flamenco guitar i've played. But I see what you mean with the price differences.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 19 2013 8:30:13
 
tele

Posts: 1468
Joined: Aug. 17 2012
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

He is a great guy and his guitars are well built, a completely different amount
of attention to detail in my pardo palo rio 89 1a(perfectly built) as in my conde 93 gravina 7, he really knows his stuff as he started in 72 and I can recommend checking him out for anyone who wants to make a guitar to his own specs for reasonable price.

If you liked the 5500 one ask then how low will they go. Who knows you might be able to cut it to 4000

quote:



Speaking of antonio raya pardo... I actually had the chance to play that 5500$ guitar. Honestly the easiest, best sounding flamenco guitar i've played. But I see what you mean with the price differences.


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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 19 2013 13:52:47
 
naguabo

 

Posts: 13
Joined: Nov. 27 2006
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

They seem to have a really cool staff there.
A few years ago I was in the area and didn't even know it. I did a search on my phone for flamenco and saw their shop was just a few miles away.
Me and my wife drive over and stopped by.
I told them I was just taking a look and they took me downstairs and let me play whatever I wanted. Had a great time. I'd be happy to by from them.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 18 2013 1:46:05
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to tele

It also depends how thought after a guitar is.
If its a guitar which is cobwebbed after been in the shop for 6 years with no interest from buyers, then you will probably get an amazing deal

We take a $5000 guitar as an example, where both can save face:


You: "Damn. This is a very nice guitar, love it. Too bad i don't have enough money."

Dealer: "How much can you spend?"

You: "I am afraid its not even close to your asking price, so i hesitate to tell you"

Dealer: "Just tell me"

You (taking all of your money out of your pockets, important: put it on the table and empty all your pockets): "If i scrample up all my money together, $3000"

Dealer: "Oh thats really not enough, sorry i can't do that"

You: "Yeah, i was afraid you would say that, i guess i will look if i find one of these in ebay or second-hand market, i want one of these and nothing else. Anyway thanks a lot for your time, i am really sad i have to leave this beauty, but life is not always fair".

Dealer: "hmm, i can talk to my boss and see what we can do, but i can't guaranty anything"

after 2 minutes ...

Dealer: "He said we can do $3500, but thats really the absolute limit and only because of a special deal we had for this guitar"

You: "wow thanks a lot. thats really kind of you, but i only have $3000 and i don't think i can take vacation anytime soon to come back. i came from the bay area. ****."

Dealer (goes back to his boss again and comes back): "ok, but don't tell anyone that we gave you this price"

You: YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH!

disclaimer: doesn't always work.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 18 2013 13:14:15
 
xirdneH_imiJ

Posts: 1907
Joined: Dec. 2 2006
From: Budapest, now in Southampton

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to Arash

whenever i spend big, i haggle and get a better price...just bought a great mic and saved 25% :D
when i bought my guitar i did the same thing, got around 20% off with hard case included...as long as the seller is profiting, you shouldn't feel bad for trying...
and "what's a couple hundred off of a guitar costing x thousand" is a really bad attitude...for that money you can buy lots of great things (like food for poor children or something)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 18 2013 15:22:26
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

I personally am a very "bad" customer.
I don't leave much profit for the dealer.
Either i am thrown out, or get a really good deal.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 18 2013 15:43:35
 
gj Michelob

Posts: 1531
Joined: Nov. 7 2008
From: New York City/San Francisco

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to Arash

Arash, I want to hire you as my 'PersonalShopper'; with the kind of savings your system may generate you'd be worth every penny !!!

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gj Michelob
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 18 2013 16:36:25
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to gj Michelob

quote:

ORIGINAL: gj Michelob

Arash, I want to hire you as my 'PersonalShopper'; with the kind of savings your system may generate you'd be worth every penny !!!


no problem if you will be my "PersonalLawyer" , i will be your "PersonalShopper".

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 18 2013 16:42:06
 
pjn

 

Posts: 113
Joined: Mar. 23 2009
From: New York

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

Another experience: a year and a half ago, knowing I would be in LA for a couple of days, I wrote GSI and made an "appointment" with one of their high mucky-mucks to visit the shop. (Background: professional player from New York, customer of theirs in the past, blah blah). I wasn't expecting the Grisha treatment but I wasn't expecting this:

Arrived on the scheduled weekday afternoon, not a super busy time; was given to an early 20's "sales associate" whose playing experience was electric guitar. Was shown all the mediocre to appalling instruments which had been sitting around the place for a while, at prices which would be high even were they good instruments.

Asked to see a couple of "high end" instruments -- "oh no, that's a $10,000 guitar, we can't just bring that out for you." -- "Well may I speak with Dave" -- sorry, he's not here" -- but I'm here from New York for one afternoon and I wrote ahead about this" -- well sorry but that's our policy."

In addition, these people set the the standard for over-the-top hype and purple prose in their descriptions; every guitar has "singing/brilliant/crystal clear trebles and "powerful, punchy, furniture rattling basses. Every guitar is incredibly easy to play, has a perfect set-up, boasts gorgeous woods and impeccable workmanship. Yes of course, because they personally have chosen everything about the guitar and have given explicit instructions to the builder on how to make it.

I'm glad you and countless others have had such good experiences but I personally, as someone who has been around the block a couple of times, find the GSI-zation of the guitar "business" not only distasteful but also a disservice to the many journeyman players, amateur and pro alike, who see prices rise while they money we can make at our jobs gets sliced because of the "bad economy."

Solution: Andy Culpepper, Stephen Faulk, Ethan Deutsch, Anders -- deal directly with them. Support the builders, not the p*mps who make money from other people's skill and dedication. I understand that builders want to to get their instruments into shops, it's great exposure and puts the stamp of respectability on their work -- but as someone who needs a good instrument at a fair price and doesn't appreciate a frat house full of smart-alecks, I don't have to like it and I don't. I think this aspect of things is way off the rails.

Outside of that, peace, man.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 19 2013 4:38:37

ToddK

 

Posts: 2961
Joined: Dec. 6 2004
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

Agree with pjn, GSI is a heap of overpriced hype.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 19 2013 6:26:15
 
gj Michelob

Posts: 1531
Joined: Nov. 7 2008
From: New York City/San Francisco

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to Arash

quote:

no problem if you will be my "PersonalLawyer" , i will be your "PersonalShopper".


a dangerous pair....



Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (1)

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gj Michelob
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 19 2013 16:32:53
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to gj Michelob

quote:

ORIGINAL: gj Michelob

a dangerous pair....



Indeed



Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 19 2013 17:22:02
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14984
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to pjn

quote:

Solution: Andy Culpepper, Stephen Faulk, Ethan Deutsch, Anders -- deal directly with them. Support the builders, not the p*mps who make money from other people's skill and dedication. I understand that builders want to to get their instruments into shops, it's great exposure and puts the stamp of respectability on their work -- but as someone who needs a good instrument at a fair price and doesn't appreciate a frat house full of smart-alecks, I don't have to like it and I don't. I think this aspect of things is way off the rails.


Well, to be fair, there are alternatives. THere is Dan Zeff and Trilogy Guitars in LA area, both had no problem letting myself and some buddies try the most expensive guitars for sale. Dan is especially honest in my experience dealing with him, and often has more interesting selections than GSI, plus he keeps previous sale prices open to public so we can see what's up.

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CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 19 2013 17:31:40

C. Vega

 

Posts: 379
Joined: Jan. 16 2004
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to Ricardo

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricardo

Well, to be fair, there are alternatives. THere is Dan Zeff and Trilogy Guitars in LA area, both had no problem letting myself and some buddies try the most expensive guitars for sale. Dan is especially honest in my experience dealing with him, and often has more interesting selections than GSI, plus he keeps previous sale prices open to public so we can see what's up.


I think those are his previous asking prices and not necessarily the prices that the particular instruments actually sold for.

While Trilogy and Zeff may not be nearly as bad as GSI in the hyperbole department their prices are still rather high.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 19 2013 19:15:07
 
tri7/5

 

Posts: 570
Joined: May 5 2012
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

Trilogy's flamenco selection never seems to change on the website. This means one of two things, either they are priced high (likely) or they never update the website. I have talked to Trilogy before and they seem like good dudes, very straightforward.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 19 2013 20:12:37
 
Arash

Posts: 4495
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to C. Vega

On a serious note: I understand both sides.
Folks who want to save and get the best price like myself.
Shops and dealers who have to make such prices to make some money and a living.

When you have a shop/are a guitar dealer and have many guitars, you have a lot of "dead capital" until something is sold, its not like you buy one guitar, sell it with profit, then buy another one, etc.

So saying "p*mps who make money from other people's skill and dedication" is far fetched. Thats basically the business model of EVERY stockist, shop, etc. no matter which product. When i ordered large quantities of steel in my business to factories, i got much better prices, but longer delivery time. When i wanted to order small quantities, i had to buy from Stockists, with a higher price but immediate delivery (just an example).

Of course employees should always be friendly and should offer many options and treat you well and with respect.

Now when you become bigger and bigger, you sell more, but the problem is that your costs also explode (employees, shop, insurance, tax, etc. etc.) and you have to pay these costs. So it can be that your prices become very high and you always wait for the customers who have a lot of money, don't care, don't compare, etc. Definately a lot of us know about their stuff and are not the "prefered" customers of these BIG shops.

So i personally think (when talking about guitars) small "shops" and "one man dealers" are the best choice and compromise. Thats of course if they also offer "reasonable" prices.

Best compromise for BUYERS too, because you have one advantage with dealers:

1) You can try out the guitar before buying
2) you have a wide selection to compare and chose from

The disadvantage is that you are paying some extra money for this.

But if you are 100% sure that you want one specific guitar model and if you are sure that a guitar which is going to built will be exactly what you want, then best choice is to order directly to the luthier and cut off the middleman. But if you are NOT sure and if you are the type of guy who wants to play the guitar and try it out before buying, or want to buy used guitars, then shops and dealers are a good choice. Thats of course if you visit the shop/dealer and have the opportunity to try out the guitars.

Just my 2 cents.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 19 2013 20:41:27
 
el carbonero

 

Posts: 295
Joined: Jun. 23 2007
 

RE: Went to the Guitar Salon (in reply to lukeofgod

dan zeff trilogy and GSI are all overpriced,
compare to flamencoguitarsforsale solera flamenca ,it s incredible,
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 20 2013 13:20:07
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