Foro Flamenco
Posts Since Last Visit | Advanced Search | Home | Register | Login

Today's Posts | Inbox | Profile | Our Rules | Contact Admin | Log Out



Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.
This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvir, Philip John Lee and Craig Eros who went ahead of us too soon.
We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.





guitar scratch...   You are logged in as Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >>Discussions >>Lutherie >> Page: [1]
Login
Message<< Newer Topic  Older Topic >>
 
El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

guitar scratch... 

Ah well I suppose it had to happen .....so I banged the front of my guitar a bit , just below the bridge toward the back . could be worse I suppose . .
but still if there is a chance of polishing it out or doing something to help it blend in or diminish then I would ...
This was on a Yamaha Cg171 so its a lacquer finish , which I know all you luthiers will hate (the finish not the guitar I mean) anyway any advice would be nice and maybe of use to others who may have a ding here and there.
I cant belive this has never been asked before but I could not find any thread about it , so sorry if there is one ....

_____________________________

Don't trust Atoms.....they make up everything.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 11 2011 23:41:37
 
Stephen Eden

 

Posts: 900
Joined: Apr. 12 2008
From: UK

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

getting it out fully is not going to happen without a re finish. In this situation I've filled the ding with laquer and buffed it as much as I could. Doesnt look great but better than nothing!

_____________________________

Classical and Flamenco Guitars www.EdenGuitars.co.uk
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 12 2011 8:26:30
 
El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to Stephen Eden

ok , i thought as much , any particular type of lacquer to use for small dings? not that I'm thinking of making a habit of it ..........and thank for the advice by the way, nice little website you have , I was just looking through it, maybe a few sound files of your guitars might be nice on there as well.

_____________________________

Don't trust Atoms.....they make up everything.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 12 2011 12:18:51
 
TANúñez

Posts: 2547
Joined: Jul. 10 2003
From: TEXAS

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

Leave it alone. It gives the guitar character. Scratches and dings are going to happen.

_____________________________

Tom Núñez
www.instagram.com/tanunezguitars
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 12 2011 12:27:06
 
Stephen Eden

 

Posts: 900
Joined: Apr. 12 2008
From: UK

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

Cheers Riko - I'm trying to get time to get some updates on there. I'm soon going to have some you tube videos and a list of proffesionals that use my guitars. Im also going to have actual Pictures of my guitars!! For some reason I havent needed any of those for the last 3 years. It seems word of mouth really is the best way to sell a guitar.

You could also leave the ding there!


The best stuff I have used it car laquer. Spray it into a pot then paint the laquer into the crack. Be careful not to get it anywhere else on the guitar. It will shrink so you will have to rinse and repeat. Once you have got it to how you want it. Use a very very fine sand paper about 2000 grit just to level it and blend with the the rest. To finish use an ultra fine buffing compound with a duster to bring back the shine! its not too difficult you've just got to have the stuff.

_____________________________

Classical and Flamenco Guitars www.EdenGuitars.co.uk
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 12 2011 13:22:50
 
jshelton5040

Posts: 1500
Joined: Jan. 17 2005
 

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to Stephen Eden

quote:

ORIGINAL: SEden

The best stuff I have used it car laquer. Spray it into a pot then paint the laquer into the crack. Be careful not to get it anywhere else on the guitar. It will shrink so you will have to rinse and repeat. Once you have got it to how you want it. Use a very very fine sand paper about 2000 grit just to level it and blend with the the rest. To finish use an ultra fine buffing compound with a duster to bring back the shine! its not too difficult you've just got to have the stuff.

Stephen is correct but drop filling with lacquer is not something to attempt with abandon. Without some experience it's very easy to end up sanding through the color on your guitar and turning a scratch into a blemish. I use straight nitro lacquer and depending on the size of the scratch or ding use any appropriate applicator (tooth pick, small brush, etc) to apply a puddle lacquer which stands proud of the surface. After a couple of days of curing and shrinking you can carefully sand it flat with 2000 grit wrapped aroung a small block of wood. Don't use your finger. It usually takes several applications.

Not all luthiers hate lacquer. I think it's a wonderful finish for guitars.

_____________________________

John Shelton - www.sheltonfarrettaguitars.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 12 2011 14:29:11
 
GuitarVlog

Posts: 441
Joined: Mar. 19 2009
From: San Francisco Bay Area

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

Yamaha? The finish is polyurethane.

You might be able to buff it out with scratch removers from an auto shop. That's how I touched-up another guitar that used poly.

_____________________________

Upgraded Yamaha CG171SF
The Guitar Student Journal
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 12 2011 16:13:57
 
estebanana

Posts: 8324
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

I use lacquer for drop fills too. It's tricky though because of the color layering issues mentioned. Best thing you can do is be happy it's a Yamaha and not a Barbero

_____________________________

https://www.stephenfaulkguitars.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 12 2011 19:13:36
 
Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006
 

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

I actually think SEden And Tanuñez are comming the closest to the point.

The guitar is laquered with polyurethane and car lacquer is very often poly as well. And Tom is right... Leave it. why not. As long as its only the lacquer, it wont hurt the sound or playability of the instrument.

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 12 2011 20:56:26
 
El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

I think you are all right about it all , I know i could just leave it , you know just clean it up a bit to reduce it and thats all. It's just so annoying to get the first DING , assuming there will be more .. in an other wise clean guitar , resale value dropping per ding ..
you just kinda panic ,,.. anyway I was wondering how hard it was to get out or if it was worth it at all , or if anyone else had done it ,
This is what is so good about this particular website , lots of good professional advice and now if anyone else gets a ding in a similar guitar you have e thread to refer them to , .
What I will do is get some buff and polish stuff and give it a little clean and see how it looks after that ,
I think that anything else may (In my hands) make it worse rather than better .
quote:

Best thing you can do is be happy it's a Yamaha and not a Barbero

Yes , I am not allowed to pick up a Barbero now after dinging a Yamaha .....

_____________________________

Don't trust Atoms.....they make up everything.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 13 2011 10:23:51
 
estebanana

Posts: 8324
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

Take a photo of it- you can drop fill it, but it might not be worth it.

Sometimes you have to ding a guitar before it realizes it's a guitar. And to make you get over being neurotic about it. Guitarists are too neurotic about how things look. Being neurotic makes you a careful "precious" player, life is too short for that.

If you have an expensive guitar you must take care of it and steward it properly. But there is a limit to how neurotic you can be even with a fine instrument.

Just let it go, move on to being a better musician. This is all that is important.

Thank you.
That will be $175.00 for the therapy session.
Will you be paying via Paypal or Credit card or check?

_____________________________

https://www.stephenfaulkguitars.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 13 2011 17:11:39
 
ralexander

Posts: 797
Joined: Jun. 1 2010
From: Halifax, Nova Scotia

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

I so agree with Stephen. By the way, the very best guitar I ever owned was cracked in 4 places with an early-stage Willie Nelson hole starting under the strings
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 13 2011 17:25:54
 
GuitarVlog

Posts: 441
Joined: Mar. 19 2009
From: San Francisco Bay Area

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rico_Kiko
... resale value dropping per ding ...

Stop thinking about resale value. You will always need a guitar that you would feel comfortable taking anywhere. That's your Yamaha.

My less expensive guitars may not sound as good as my pricier ones, but they carry more memories with them.


_____________________________

Upgraded Yamaha CG171SF
The Guitar Student Journal
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 13 2011 17:28:30
 
Turner

 

Posts: 81
Joined: Nov. 5 2011
 

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to GuitarVlog

GV is right.
You'll always want a take anywhere guitar and that guitar should have character and have lived a life, this is the beginning of yours gaining that character. Embrace it and move on - just don't make a habit of it.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 31 2011 16:53:10
 
Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3196
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to El Kiko

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rico_Kiko
Yes , I am not allowed to pick up a Barbero now after dinging a Yamaha .....


If a classical story is permitted, this is from an article by the English luthier Kevin Aram in the Journal of American Luthiery.

Jose Romanillos had moved his shop from Julian Bream's cow shed on the farm at Semley, where Romanillos began his professional career, to a cottage in nearby Fontmell Magna. In 1973 Bream and John Williams visited Romanillos to have the tuners replaced on Wlliams's Fleta. Handing the guitar to Romanillos, Williams dinged it against the jointer, leaving a sizable mark on the top.

While waiting for the tuners to be changed, Bream took down a guitar hanging on the wall and began to play. Romanillos had shown the guitar to Bream when it was completed. Bream commented it was a nice guitar, "but perhaps a little quiet."

Romanillos said he was a bit ashamed of the guitar, and hung it on the wall of the shop. Williams commented to Bream that he sounded quite good on it. Bream liked it himself, and told Romanillos he would like to buy it. Bream used it for more than 20 years on all recordings and concerts, making it perhaps the second most famous classical guitar of the 20th century.

The guitar had already been sold when Bream asked for it. Romanillos had to convince the purchaser to accept a later instrument. Romanillos said he had never mentioned this to anyone until he told the story to Aram.

I have the guitar Romanillos made just before Bream's. I bought it in 2000, when it was 27 years old. It has only a very thin wash coat of shellac on the top. There are a few nail marks on he top beside the finger board, and a spot where the shellac is almost completely worn through just above the first string. The french polish is a bit cloudy on the back and is just about worn through at a spot on the neck. The tuners definitely need to be replaced. There is visible, but not disabling wear on the second and third frets under the fourth and fifth strings.

I have talked to Richard Brune about re-polishing the back, sides and neck and replacing the tuners, but I haven't gotten around to it yet.

All the same, it is my favorite of all classicals I have played, and when I'm gone my kids won't be disappointed that their old Dad spent some money on a guitar.

My '67 Ramirez blanca is well marked up, no really big dings, but it has been my faithful companion since it was new, and bears a lot of great memories. The '82 Arcangel blanca is spotless, but it almost never leaves the house.

RNJ
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 31 2011 19:27:00
 
rombsix

Posts: 7603
Joined: Jan. 11 2006
From: Beirut, Lebanon

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to Richard Jernigan

quote:

The '82 Arcangel blanca is spotless, but it almost never leaves the house.


Invite Rico or John Williams over so they can ding it for you.

_____________________________

Ramzi

http://www.youtube.com/rombsix
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 31 2011 20:13:09
 
El Kiko

Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to rombsix

Hmmm . it seems I have a new job as guitar finish tester. . .

I'm going to leave my ding , by the way , for the moment , when I change the strings I usually give it a general clean up and polish , I will buff it up a bit then ,, .and well see how we get along .,. I suppose it can't make my playing any worse ,,.. maybe I can use it as an excuse for all those duff chords and missed notes ......

_____________________________

Don't trust Atoms.....they make up everything.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 31 2011 21:24:04
 
Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3196
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: guitar scratch... (in reply to rombsix

quote:

ORIGINAL: rombsix

quote:

The '82 Arcangel blanca is spotless, but it almost never leaves the house.


Invite Rico or John Williams over so they can ding it for you.


Having seen Bream's Romanillos up close a couple of times in his hotel room, and photos of what he did to Rose Augustine's 1940 Hauser, I'd say he could do a pretty thorough dinging as well.

RNJ
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 31 2011 22:28:30
Page:   [1]
All Forums >>Discussions >>Lutherie >> Page: [1]
Jump to:

New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software powered by ASP Playground Advanced Edition 2.0.5
Copyright © 2000 - 2003 ASPPlayground.NET

0.0625 secs.