RE: soundportparty in my patio

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Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to RobJe)

quote:

Am I missing something?

lol yes ...a soundport

what about accompanying classes ? rehershals...why go to the bathroom when u can stay in the livingroom...besides its not just the louder sound...the doubled sound produces something of a nice stereo effect..u never heard if u havent played a ported guitar, its very nice..u hear sounds u never knew your guitar made...and because u hear yourself clearely u feel as if the guitar is more responsive...theres many benefits...and absoluteley no negatives that i can think off...anyone of the guys that just got it done would probably confirm the same as i have just said...it adds quite a bitt to your enjoyiment in top of whatever u allready had the way it sounds and feels as far as you are concerned...

so if you can sacrifice a hole in your guitar for extra enjoyment of your instrument, extra volume and most importantly extra inspiration cause u like what u hear. even more....then it dosent require much thinking

however much you love your sound now you will like it even more after...if thats a good enough reason for you to put a hole in then do it

btw Leo posted some audio examples of the same guitar with the covered hole and without in the audio section...and what u hear from the players prespective...u have to keep in mind its only about 65 % as rich as what you hear in real life....because u will hear the recording stereo anyway...from 2 speakers...but in realife when u hear yourself in an unported guitar the effect its closer to mono cause of the one soundhole...and u dont realize how mono it was until you play a ported guitar

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 10 2009 1:01:40

Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to satvic)

Hi satvic,

I must admit, I like this kind of idea better myself.

I feel the single round hole kinda looks as if the guitar had at one time been retro-fitted with a jack or pre-amp control which has now been removed.

I suppose I'd prefer say a single large hole, surrounded by a pattern of say, 8 small holes....or even just a pattern of small holes on their own (if that would work), so that the soundport looks intentional and part of the guitar.

To be honest, if I was buying a used guitar from someone and had never heard of soundports and saw a single hole in the side and the seller told me it was to make it sound better to the player.....well I would kinda think he was blowin' smoke up my backside!

This story just came into my head...

A few years ago I was in my garage workshop when I heard a smash, like glass breaking coming from the outer garage.
When I went out to check, I saw a large hole in the top of the window and a golf ball lying on the floor amongst the glass splinters.
I ran outside only to see two kids haring it over the park, each carrying golf clubs...
After cursing, I found that the hole was about the same diameter as the vent tube for my tumble dryer, which was situated nearby.
So I bought quite a large shuttered window vent and glued it in position with glass-bond epoxy, then attached the hose from the tumble dryer to it, instead of just sticking it out of a small, nearby window opening as I had before.

cheers,

Ron

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 10 2009 2:10:37

Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Ron.M)

quote:

To be honest, if I was buying a used guitar from someone and had never heard of soundports and saw a single hole in the side and the seller told me it was to make it sound better to the player.....well I would kinda think he was blowin' smoke up my backside!

haha thats true..i remember chatting to grisha on video on messenger and i looked at his guitar and saw a weird hole...i remember thinking to myself..." poor guy...such a brilliant guitarist cant even afford a decent guitar

...its so unfair"

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 10 2009 5:39:37

at_leo_87

Posts: 3055
Joined: Aug. 30 2008
From: Boston, MA, U.S.A

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

quote:

" poor guy...such a brilliant guitarist cant even afford a decent guitar ...its so unfair"

lmao. his hole is pretty large. you sometimes see him stuck his ear into when he plays.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 10 2009 6:54:43

kozz

Posts: 1766
Joined: Feb. 26 2009
From: Eindhoven NL

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to at_leo_87)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 10 2009 7:23:07

satvic

Posts: 20
Joined: Jan. 17 2007
From: Seville, Spain

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to at_leo_87)

quote:

post a pic when you're done with

that won't happen in the near future. It sounds so good i can't put it down :) 'Florian' is right, it sounds in a very different way. it's almost like converting a mono into a surround sound! I keep catching myself trying to put my ear next the ports :)

P.S. I don't do well with circular designs :) it has to have a flow with some surprising turns. I actually found the original design in my archives. Hope the Luthier doesn't get offended.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 10 2009 20:37:41

Exitao

Posts: 907
Joined: Mar. 13 2006
From: Vancouver, Canada

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

So I have a few questions, and one suggestion:

Is there any research or consensus of opinions on a minimum size for a soundport?

And/or is there a point of diminishing returns or something where it's pointless to make a sound port larger?

I've aded the pic Ron posted in the other thread, and I have to wonder if having too delicate/intricate an opening might interfere with the sound or cause buzzing, not to mention the possible fragility?

The pic Satvice posted seems to satisfy a need for dressing up a soundport to be a bit more aesthetically pleasing without being possibly too delicate.

Now my suggestion:

If anyone sees an interesting soundport design, or other design that could be applied to soundports, maybe y'all could post them here?

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Callidus et iracundus.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 13 2009 13:58:21

GuitarVlog

Posts: 441
Joined: Mar. 19 2009
From: San Francisco Bay Area

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

330 Euros for this one.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 13 2009 20:46:55

GuitarVlog

Posts: 441
Joined: Mar. 19 2009
From: San Francisco Bay Area

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

Using a baroque parchment rose would certainly make your soundhole the most interesting part of your guitar. Just don't go poking it with your finger.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 13 2009 20:48:58

Exitao

Posts: 907
Joined: Mar. 13 2006
From: Vancouver, Canada

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to GuitarVlog)

I'm afraid that would buzz. Wouldn't it?

Ah... never mind, I searched parchment roses, here's a bit of a tutorial site to making one:
http://crab.rutgers.edu/~pbutler/parchment.html

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Callidus et iracundus.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 13 2009 22:06:03

GuitarVlog

Posts: 441
Joined: Mar. 19 2009
From: San Francisco Bay Area

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

If you'd prefer to carve one, see Larry Butler's tutorial instead:

http://www.cincinnatiearlymusic.com/baroque_guitar.html

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 5:13:58

Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to GuitarVlog)

These are good Guitarvlog!
Personally I prefer the one at €208 you posted on the "OK Florian.." thread as the one above is getting a bit too ornate for me IMO.

One of the problems would be getting a nice curve to follow the contour of the bout of the guitar as a "straight" insert wouldn't look quite so good.

Good stuff!

cheers,

Ron

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 5:47:43

Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Ron.M)

you yappies

what ?.too good for a simple hole ?

i am just kidding ...do whatever u need to do

...i am thinking of supergluing some hair along the edges of mine so that i feel like i got to buy my guitar a drink and take it out to dinner everytime before hoping to play it....i blush everytime i practice

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 5:54:27

Exitao

Posts: 907
Joined: Mar. 13 2006
From: Vancouver, Canada

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to GuitarVlog)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GuitarVlog

If you'd prefer to carve one, see Larry Butler's tutorial instead:

http://www.cincinnatiearlymusic.com/baroque_guitar.html

That's a nice one. Thanks.

You know what occurs to me is that if you cut outer diameter of the material you were going to make the rosette out of so that it would fit snug in the sound hole/port and it was the same thickness as the guitar's side, you could glue that on to a thin sheet of wood that's wider than the hole by, say, 1/2" before your carve out your pattern (so you'll be cutting through both pieces), you could glue the inside edge of the port/hole and the extra bit hanging off the edge get's glued onto the inside (cross-grain) and act as a reinforcement...

Would that work?

edit:

Actually, as I read it more carefully, I think that sort of what he did.

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Callidus et iracundus.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 6:05:24

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

Come on guys lets talk directly without a filter....be serious... when thinking twice... the soundports are like so many strange inventions ... see picture:

A butter-stick is a clear enhancement... No dirty knife, fast, exact... but do we need a butter-stick? Answer: NO
So.. carving a hole in my several thousand euro guitar would give me a slight wider directer sound... .. till I get used to it and dont recognize it anymore because it became normal for me.. Its like watching 3d movies.. the first 5 mins "whoa..the shark jump out of the screen in my room" and than.. from the 6st minute on.. you dont recognize it..but you recognize the damn plastic-3d-glasses and its uncomfortable edges... So after a while the soundport just become reduced to a secondary anus of my guitar right under my nose.... Gentleman.. when thinking twice about soundports.. its a clear FAIL. LOL..l

I dont need any reaction..Just a comment to think about when thinking about buying a hole.. (isnt it strange to buy a hole??? lol! )
Well,.. as we know.. everybody thinks different and thats my actual viewpoint.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 8:10:02

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

edit..

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 8:15:01

kozz

Posts: 1766
Joined: Feb. 26 2009
From: Eindhoven NL

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Doitsujin)

quote:

I dont need any reaction..Just a comment to think about when thinking about buying a hole.. (isnt it strange to buy a hole??? lol! )

Hahaha, this is no reaction at all, just a comment.
NASA spends a millions of euros investigating Black Holes....I've seen the Discovery programs for ages now, but its still fasinating, but you don't know what you get........
Yet "another-hole" just costs you a few euo's and you see direct where that hole is leading to, and as a side effect it sounds awesome.

But my advise is Doitsujin....don't do it

. No pain no gain!

quote:

Florian: i am just kidding ...do whatever u need to do ...i am thinking of supergluing some hair along the edges of mine so that i feel like i got to buy my guitar a drink and take it out to dinner everytime before hoping to play it....i blush everytime i practice

Still recovering from MySpaceBabe?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 8:41:10

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Doitsujin)

Doit, i know you like guitarplaying alot and i am sure, you will be a good candidate for a hole... once you find a soundhole guitar and realize its effect you will want one.

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Фламенко

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 8:58:08

GuitarVlog

Posts: 441
Joined: Mar. 19 2009
From: San Francisco Bay Area

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Doitsujin)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Doitsujin
Just a comment to think about when thinking about buying a hole.. (isnt it strange to buy a hole??? lol! )

WTF?!! I just realized that there's a HUGE HOLE in the middle of my soundboard! I even took a picture of it!! WHEN THE F**K DID THAT HAPPEN?!! I want compensation for my missing soundboard!

And donuts should be discounted too. Really. Muffins with holes in them?!

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 9:02:31

GuitarVlog

Posts: 441
Joined: Mar. 19 2009
From: San Francisco Bay Area

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Exitao)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Exitao
You know what occurs to me is that if you cut outer diameter of the material you were going to make the rosette ...

Actually, the bigger problem is fitting a flat carving to the curved hole. I have no idea how to do that. The most elaborate work that I would consider doing would be no more complicated than Tim McKnight's signature hole.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 9:06:12

GuitarVlog

Posts: 441
Joined: Mar. 19 2009
From: San Francisco Bay Area

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Ron.M)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ron.M
Personally I prefer the one at €208 you posted on the "OK Florian.." thread as the one above is getting a bit too ornate for me IMO.

Yes, the one on that thread has a pattern that, to me, has more of an Andalusian flavor.

The one above is too courtly. Still, very nice work and it would be beautiful on a baroque guitar. Probably demands even more effort than a Tibetan sand mandala.

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Upgraded Yamaha CG171SF
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 9:14:46

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

So here are the pics of my hole.

Hippner 'Santos' Model

Inside the house

Black Hole

Leo, this pic is for you. You can see the inforcement inside.

You know you want it.

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Фламенко

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 12:08:56

Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

OMG Butter Stick Type!!thats brilliant ...where do i get one ?...

quote:

Florian: i am just kidding ...do whatever u need to do ...i am thinking of supergluing some hair along the edges of mine so that i feel like i got to buy my guitar a drink and take it out to dinner everytime before hoping to play it....i blush everytime i practice
Still recovering from MySpaceBabe?

that was terrible

..i had too much wine last night at the gig when i posted this directly after....sounded really funny at the time ..

i dont know how many time i needs to remind myself to not post under the influence...luckly my eyes can only stay open for one stupid post at the time

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 13:53:27

M.S.A.

Posts: 493
Joined: Mar. 10 2009

[Deleted]

Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Feb. 7 2011 21:40:21

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 15:49:20

at_leo_87

Posts: 3055
Joined: Aug. 30 2008
From: Boston, MA, U.S.A

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

nice hole, deniz!

doitsujin,
let's say you go from a ****ty vcr tape to a high definition dvd player. sure, you'll become desensitized after awhile. but once you get used to it, you won't go back.

here's an example of a kid who didnt keep up with modern standards with his computer.

also,
the butter stick is an inferior invention. the butter spray is much better.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 14 2009 15:50:34

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to at_leo_87)

quote:

ORIGINAL: at_leo_87
here's an example of a kid who didnt keep up with modern standards with his computer.

"think positive"

wtf, you think its real? It cant be fake, but i also dont want to believe that hes for real...
oh heres a version with the correct translation

Maybe you like remixes?

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Фламенко

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 15 2009 1:05:22

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: soundportparty in my patio (in reply to Florian)

LOL!!

All the discussions about these holes let me think I landed in a porn foro...

"Holes, holes, holes! All holes
must go. At the Luthier (org.Titty Twister)
we're slashing holes in half! This
is a hole blow out! Make us an
offer on our vast selection of
holes! We got white holes, black
holes, Spanish holes, yellow holes,
hot holes, cold holes, wet holes,
tight holes, big holes, bloody
holes, fat holes, hairy holes,
smelly holes, velvet holes, silk
holes, Naugahyde holes, snappin'
holes, horse holes, dog holes, mule
holes, fake holes! If we don't
have it, you don't want it!"

hahaha

Ok one serious thought to the soundports, too.
Normal guitars have no soundport, so the sound that hears the audience is different than the sound that hears the player himself. Because the real "main" soundhole points towards the audience and there the loudest sound goes,.. louder than the sound, the player hears himself.

When you have a sounhole you have louder wider sound. Lets say the sound has than more the characteristics of the sound that goes forward when you have no soundhole.

What is the logical consequence when getting louder sound while playing with equal force?

Guess what... You start playing with less force. The player wont go on play with as much force anymore as he did when he had no soundport. Now he just plays as hard till he gets sufficient sound from the soundport to his ears. Of course with using less power.

That means,.. the sound that he produces that goes forward to the audience will be less powerfull than before when the player had no soundport. So if you play without mic, the soundport is a clear handicap and it worsening the quality of the performance of the player.

Many words few informations.... Think about it. Its exactly the same with many other things.

An extremely wise man said in past: " A good horse just jupms as high as it must, not higher".

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Aug. 15 2009 5:52:50