Ricardo -> RE: modern vs traditional (Dec. 7 2009 6:32:08)
|
quote:
ORIGINAL: runner Ricardo, in your last post, you wrote,"In my experience, there are few who really appreciate modern flamenco guitar...... There should be way more folks tolerant of the modern players on a flamenco forum IMO." Could you expand a little on this? My sense is that this Foro is almost completely dominated by, first, those whose interest in flamenco is overwhelmingly about guitar, and, second, whose interest is in those very modern players that you feel are not appreciated enough. If one compares the numbers of posts and posters on this Foro to those of the tiny handful of forums dealing with Old School, this Foro blows the rest out of the water, in terms of sheer numbers, and, I presume, appreciation of modern players. runner Correct about guitar being the focus. Second thing is about many people being interested in modern players is true in general, but there is a distinction to be made. They are generally interested in "modern" players and at the same time the traditional players. So why make it seem like it is not possible to be into traditional playing if your favorite is some modern guy? I can only think of a few, Florian Doit, and no one else off hand who openly admits to NOT liking traditional players AS MUCH as modern ones. On the other hand, over the years, the number of people who have vocalized a lack of interest or tolerance for "modern" or "nuevo" or "technical" or "jazzy new age" flamenco, as they percieve it, is quite large IMO, relative to the two guys above. I would say the reason it SEEMS that modern flamenco lovers dominate, is because in the mind of the old school lovers, it does not make any sense how someone could accept both traditional and modern flamenco as to be part of the same genre. You can either have a taste for this or that, not both...and more confusing to that mind set, how can one not see there is a clear division???? Again, that mind set resulted in the split of the forum...not between modern lovers vs trad lovers....but from those who generally view flamenco guitar as a single evolved art form (this forum in general) and those that view classical flamenco guitar as a separate genre, the dividing line specifically being Paco de lucia. I am not saying that in this forum it is a requirement to like all and every player in the history of flamenco, I am just saying there are many around who still have that division in their tastes and minds. We all draw a personal line somewhere. quote:
Ricardo, one can recognize the influence of Ramon Montoya in Tomatito's playing and still appreciate Ramon Montoya's toque more than and above that of Tomatito's. Likewise, one may appreciate Tomatito's more than and above that of Ramon Montoya's. It is a matter of personal preference. There is no logical inconsistency in either position. i agree with you 100%. You can understand and recognize something and still NOT like it, of course!!! But something is missing there too, you can actually like BOTH players. And you can even like them both if you DONT see the connection. My point of the analogy was not about liking or prefering an artitst or not. I was generalizing that the types of folks who are not tolerant of modern flamenco, and write off modern players as "not flamenco" or as jazz or whatever, usually don't hear the connection to players they DO recognize and like. That is usually why they dont' like it. For example: "I like sabicas. Tomatito is too jazzy for me. Paco Peña? Oh yeah he is good too." To me all 3 guys stole A LOT from Ramon Montoya, and in many ways flat out note for note. But it is not simply artist inspiration and borrowing of ideas, those musical or technical details define the art form in general!!! Regardless if they like or don't like the modern artist, those connections exist in the music. As Arash posted above about himself, i think it is totally true that the more you study, the deeper you go into it, not only do you start appreciating things you did not have a taste for earlier, you actually end up with a bigger list of players you DO like. So many things in flamenco are an acquired taste, acquired by listening and learning and being open to the stuff. The concept of modern VS traditional, to me, is a close minded concept that does not leave much room for acquiring taste. Oh to Doit about the juerga...it is a way to really help with rhythm IMO, assuming you are doing the juerga with high level people. Very important for getting detail of rhythm and feel, tonos for the singer, improvising etc etc....all you can't learn so immediately and solidly in your room with videos, music, and a metronome. And most important...it can inspire creativity. Sure many things can too, but never cancel out on something that might be inspiring.
|
|
|
|