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the part from 0:41 - 1:56 seems to be played at bulerias tempo with eighth notes (I'm guessing 190 - 200 bpm). What do you think? If from 0:41 you count it like a solea with 16th notes, then the part from 1:49 does not make sense since it's clearly played like a blueria : 12-3-6-8-10. Am I right?
Posts: 15821
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
RE: Counting a solea as a bulerai (in reply to metalhead)
as I have been saying this guy does weird stuff on purpose...just look at the palmero's faces. It's taking the normal thing and going off the rails then back in. Technically Jaleo is the basis of the very slow soleá escobillas, where you can have a double time feel internally by the subdivisions of a very slow tempo 12 count (2 compases of buleria=1 of solea lento).
Since you don't really even know Jaleo yet, I recommend learning normal traditional material first before messing around with his material.
RE: Counting a solea as a bulerai (in reply to Ricardo)
what weirdness are you talking about? From 0:56 to 1:58 it's played as it as like a buleria slowed down. Syncopation is nothing crazy, quite intuitive actually. There's no elasticity either. When I had first seen the video at first glance and looked at the palmeros faces; even I was thinking like this one is gonna be a difficult piece to tackle. However after counting, I don't think there's anything difficult about the rhythm.
RE: Counting a solea as a bulerai (in reply to JasonM)
he happens to count it in 1,2,3. I counted it like a buleria: 6-8-10 and I felt it was more intuitive that way. Atleast from 0:56 to 1:58. I'm yet to look at the other parts. Btw are you the same Jason Mcguire?
RE: Counting a solea as a bulerai (in reply to metalhead)
quote:
I counted it like a buleria: 6-8-10
This is the right kind of feel. A feeling of threes, kind of similar to Abandolados or even Verdiales. Heavy but somehow also silent on the 1 of the 1,2,3. But it is in 12.
PS And as relates to the composing thread, I'm sure that Yerai got most of his ideas from baile. (And not just what Ricardo pointed to here- changing the value of the same pulse so 2 compases of buleria=1 of solea lento or 1 compas tientos=2 compas tangos.)
It's good practice to be able to feel the same pulse or rhythm in different ways, and not get hung up on the counting. After all different professional people can count the same thing differently and no one is 'right', if one gets stuck on the 'right' numbers it can be hard to discuss things e.g. with a dancer or singer.
Or being able to feel buleria in 2s or 3s or 6s or 12s and easily feel and shift between them without counting. To accent, or not accent any beat in the cycle without breaking rhythmic flow. Or as spoken about already, being able to shift between 2 compases of buleria=1 of solea lento or 1 compas tientos=2 compas tangos.
RE: Counting a solea as a bulerai (in reply to metalhead)
quote:
he happens to count it in 1,2,3. I counted it like a buleria: 6-8-10 and I felt it was more intuitive that way. Atleast from 0:56 to 1:58. I'm yet to look at the other parts. Btw are you the same Jason Mcguire?
The point I got from the 1,2,3 counting is more to show where the quarter notes or downbeats are in relation to all the syncopation.
Nope I’m not him.I carried my user name over from the old flamencoteacher forum before I/we knew of McGuire.
Posts: 15821
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
RE: Counting a solea as a bulerai (in reply to metalhead)
quote:
what weirdness are you talking about?
I have been over this several times. Rather than invent a brand new thing in compás he takes a fairly standard thing that is solidly ingrained in the hearts and minds of flamencos, then deliberately off sets it in unusual ways, then as that tension builds he fails to resolve it so that IF you don't simply ignore him, you will get lost in there. 2:50 for example is basic soleá but shifted early so the remate does not line up. That is a game he is playing, and it is not a brand new idea, it is just that when it was done in the past, it is used to build tension to give a more satisfying and unique resolution....which he does not give you. Even Jason is there laughing at certain spots.
I am not saying it is not cool or whatever, I am just saying you should be working on the standard things first. I mean if you are not laughing like Jason there, and just think this is "normal" syncopation, then you don't get it at all.
Jason is only counting to 3, but you could count to 12 instead...and in two tempos. In fact I could redo the video that way so clarify his thinking of the specific phrases. But, I am not going to. You should try that on your own.
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