mystery guitarrero

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mystery guitarrero

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doubtingt

Posts: 4
Joined: Mar. 30 2016

mystery guitarrero

maybe someone on this forum can identify this mystery negra from Enrique de Melchor's first solo LP done in 1977. he may have recorded with in for cante previously but i can't tell. this is the only one of his few solo recordings in which he did not use a Conde. he moved with his famous father to Madrid as a boy and lived in Madrid his entire life. i have never been able to solve this guitar mystery.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 25 2017 22:58:09

Echi

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to doubtingt)

The guitar is a Manuel Contreras.
Later on Enrique used a Conde negra.
Btw if someone from France offered to trade Enrique's Conde negra with your guitar, it's a scam. A friend of mine got it.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 25 2017 23:44:46

Richard Jernigan

Posts: 3430
Joined: Jan. 20 2004
From: Austin, Texas USA

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to doubtingt)

Here is the headstock of a Contreras guitar for sale at Guitarsalon.com.

It matches precisely the headstock of an instrument I bought from Manuel Contreras Sr. in July, 1991. It looks to me like the headstock of Enrique's guitar in your post.

At first I thought Enrique's guitar might have been a Paulino Bernabe, but Bernabe's headstock is just a little different from Contreras's. The Contreras design has a notch in the center at the top, while Bernabe's has a small protruding knob.

RNJ

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 25 2017 23:45:35

Erik van Goch

Posts: 1787
Joined: Jul. 17 2012
From: Netherlands

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to doubtingt)

My fathers classical 1962 Ramirez has the manufactory stamp of Contreras which seems to suggest he was the main constructor of that guitar, although previous posts about the subject suggest that's not so simple in retrospect (depending on the period?).

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 26 2017 0:09:23

doubtingt

Posts: 4
Joined: Mar. 30 2016

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to doubtingt)

you guys are amazing. so, there was a Madrid connection, really a Ramirez connection, which i can see now in the head. if you can get a copy of "Recordando a Enrique de Melchor" CD, produced after Enrique's death in 2012, you can hear this fine Contreras negra. unfortunately UMS Spain did not include the entirety of the LP on that CD, a glaring omission was the rondena, oh, the sound of that Contreras in that altered tuning is to die for.

thanks for researching this. someone needs to publish a coffee-table book with photos of all the Spanish Guitar heads known to man, i would buy that book in a heartbeat.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 26 2017 14:15:01

doubtingt

Posts: 4
Joined: Mar. 30 2016

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to Echi)

you have a very lucky friend but he can't possibly have Enrique's great hands, brain, experience, and bloodline to make that Conde sing like Enrique did. that's gone forever which is why you have to see the artists whenever you can and appreciate them.

i always try to look forward but a lot of great players have died off, this has been a tough 5 yrs or so for flamenco. the players DRIVE the guitarreros and make them build better instruments. everything gets re-created, in time, but it's going to take a while to find flamenco brilliance like we had in late 20th c.

Echi - thank you for the very quick post.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 26 2017 15:21:23

doubtingt

Posts: 4
Joined: Mar. 30 2016

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to Richard Jernigan)

beautiful head, you can see the Ramirez legacy, just like in the head of a Bernabe, another fine former-Ramirez Madrid guitarrero. that's what i mean, someone needs to publish a PHOTO book about this stuff!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 26 2017 15:36:58

Echi

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to doubtingt)

There are many former employees of Ramirez that later became quite famous as independent flamenco guitar makers: Josè Romero, Pedro de Miguel, Manuel Caceres (who worked for Arcangel) etc.
Four guitarreros deserve a special place though: Antonio Martinez, Paulino Bernabè, Manuel Contreras and Felix Manzanero: they all contributed to the design of the early Ramirez III guitars ( before 1965 the year of the cedar topped guitars).
Contreras became a company as big as Ramirez, Bernabè and Manzanero have been way less productive.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 26 2017 17:14:12

Ricardo

Posts: 14801
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to Echi)

Seems like he used half a dozen different Conde Negras over the years. This one sounds like the one he used on Cuchichi which is a fantastic sounding guitar IMO, at least it sounds like it to me here versus the same falsetas played on other guitars.

The Contreras in that old black and white TV show sounds very classical to me.

quote:

thanks for researching this. someone needs to publish a coffee-table book with photos of all the Spanish Guitar heads known to man, i would buy that book in a heartbeat.

I have two huge encyclopedias that are the perfect coffee table book for spanish guitar lovers, 50/50 classical and flamencos. Both published by the same guy, one called GUITARREROS DE MADRID and the other GUITARREROS DE ANDALUCIA. Highly recommended
http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=239830&appid=&p=&mpage=1&key=guitarreros%2Cde%2Cmadrid&tmode=&smode=&s=#239830

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 26 2017 17:38:02

Joan Maher

Posts: 213
Joined: Dec. 3 2013

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to doubtingt)

La Guitarra Flamenca de Enrique de Melchor

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Gracias!

Joan Josep Maher

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 26 2017 20:37:09

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to doubtingt)

sec

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date May 26 2017 20:41:05

pundi64

Posts: 234
Joined: Jul. 29 2016
From: Thailand

RE: mystery guitarrero (in reply to Richard Jernigan)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Richard Jernigan

Here is the headstock of a Contreras guitar for sale at Guitarsalon.com.

It matches precisely the headstock of an instrument I bought from Manuel Contreras Sr. in July, 1991. It looks to me like the headstock of Enrique's guitar in your post.

At first I thought Enrique's guitar might have been a Paulino Bernabe, but Bernabe's headstock is just a little different from Contreras's. The Contreras design has a notch in the center at the top, while Bernabe's has a small protruding knob.

RNJ