RE: How anyone can become a good guitarist

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Kate

Posts: 1827
Joined: Jul. 8 2003
From: Living in Granada, Andalucía

RE: How anyone can become a good gui... (in reply to Miguel de Maria)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Miguel de Maria
It must take formidable discipline to play perfect rhythm. "Good enough" becomes the enemy. Distractions avoided. Groove becomes the unifying concept. Guitar becomes a mediation.

Well said Miguel, all of it and not just the bit I quote above. I was watching a programme on BBC last night about the mind and how we learn. It was fascinating and even more poignant when I read your post. They showed a gymnast practising for the Olympics and she had to learn a new move, first she watched some-one else do it, then her trainer literally moved her through the positions and then she was up on the bar trying it out for herself. She failed every time, falling on the mat. Then they tried the experiment which had her standing with eyes closed visualising every move she would make. The next time she completed the move perfectly. More examples were shown of creative visualisation being used to prepare in your mind what you wished to acheive physically. They even showed that a body builder could visualise a work out and his muscles improved without moving a muscle. Apparrantly if we visualise something part of the mind is tricked into believing we have already done it thereby strengthening our ability to actually do it. And of course the more we do something the better we get.

Kate

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 3 2006 14:14:25

PacoPaella

Posts: 163
Joined: Nov. 7 2004

RE: How anyone can become a good gui... (in reply to Kate)

this is a very interesting thread for the amateur, reading you pro guys' thoughts. Few things i cannot agree with - the "politically correct" idea of "sky's the limit" directly contradicts my experience. And theres one thing thats hard to describe for me that i noticed on my last visit to spain where i was lucky enough to see and hear some excellent flamencos. It was a different level of music, different from everything i've seen so far, and taht includes the cd's i have heard. Before taht i admired the guitar heroes and hoped to be able to play intermediate stuff one day at decent speed cleanly. The more you listen to pure guitar flamenco though the more it becomes frustrating if you have average talent, and limited time resources. You hear the stuff - you hear yourself - you are constantly reminded of how limited you are and will be.

Then tehres these guys in spain. The guitar solos were not - technically - impressive. Yet the musical feeling that these guys showed while accompanying the cantaores ... the perfect synchronisation without any effort. This is what i want to reach now. And, different from my handicaps of pure mechanical/motorical abilities in solo guitar, i think that the main skill here is the ear, and the musical feeling, something you can work on without even having a guitar in hand!

What i want to say is that to become a good guitarist, it can be a mistake to focus on technique only, and to watch others and compare yourself to them. After all this is music, not sport.

Sorry for being incoherent

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 3 2006 16:19:14

Francisco

Posts: 879
Joined: Jun. 13 2005
From: SW USA

RE: How anyone can become a good gui... (in reply to Kate)

quote:

No, i think theres many drives combined that are different for everyone

Well said, Flo. Let me add to the list: Some do it because the melodies/rhythms have a nostalgic effect, and remind us of music we heard earlier in life.

quote:

More examples were shown of creative visualisation being used to prepare in your mind what you wished to acheive physically

I have read about this technique. One of the examples given to describe it explained how a photographer would mentally 'work out' the sequence of a photo session. Mentally visualizes each setting, angle, lighting etc. All done mentally, no notes, eyes closed, etc. When the time came for the shoot, each setting received only one or two takes as opposed to the numerous rolls of film normally taken during a session.

So, what I've taken most from this thread:
1. "when you play, listen as though you were transcribing yourself"
2. "use more creative visualization in preparation for a piece"
...I wonder if the latter would have helped avoid a recent injury i had?

quote:

Miguel
I think the study of people who are really good at something is fascinating. Certainly there are such things as natural advantages or even perhaps natural skills or instincts, but I'm that doesn't interest me that much because it can't be changed. What can be changed is your mental state and your approach. Anyone here seriously tried meditation?

I couldn't agree more. I have never meditated, that I'm aware of anyway.

Is it something you do often, Miguel?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 3 2006 18:27:36

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: How anyone can become a good gui... (in reply to Kate)

No...but it seems like it would help.

Paco, the sky is the limit if you put in the time. If you don't put in the time, the limit is a lot lower...

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 3 2006 20:17:45

Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: How anyone can become a good gui... (in reply to Kate)

quote:

Few things i cannot agree with - the "politically correct" idea of "sky's the limit

this is not some Oprah or Dr Phill politicaly correct statment when u live by those rules and you really belive in them sky really is the limit.

And even if its not so, you still achive alot more than if you put limitations on yourself and accept that you will never be.

In a race nobody bothers runing if they know they gonna come 3rd , u have to atlist belive that you have a chance at coming first to even try.

So in short even to be wrong about sky is the limit and to practice as if sky is the limit its still more beneficial to your playing rhather than beeing right about sky not beeing the limit.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jan. 3 2006 23:22:56

Guest

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 11 2006 22:58:49

Rain

Posts: 475
Joined: Jul. 7 2005

RE: How anyone can become a good gui... (in reply to Guest)

Thru discipline and focus anyone can become better at what ever it is they wish to accomplish. That is a universal truth.
If you put some guitarist or some piece of music in a place that is unreachable by yourself than ypu are subconsciously already setting your self up for mediocrity. Respect musicians and their music, but do away with putting them in a place of worship. Let them inspire you to do more, but dont ever believe you cannot be even more technically brilliant, and that the music you will create will be anything less than beautiful. I f you think that somethig is unatainable then it will be.
KILL YOUR IDOLS!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 12 2006 0:43:48

musicalgrant

Posts: 188
Joined: Oct. 21 2004

RE: How anyone can become a good gui... (in reply to Kate)

I think Greisha hit the nail on the head, when he said there is so much more to being a good muso than technique. Life experience, and i would like to add one that i think is very important to being a good musos,

SURVIVAL...PDL had to perform to survive, and he had that extra urge to better himself.

Those of us who have comftable lives, have jobs that pay the bills and put food on the table, do not need to play to survive and hence have less of an urge.

But when playing guitar is more than just technique and a question of survival, u have no choice than to push it beyond its boundaries..

Ill fetch my coat

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 12 2006 1:25:30

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: How anyone can become a good gui... (in reply to Kate)

Romie,
it's a coincidence; I have been lifting weights and paging through my copy of Zen Guitar inbetween sets. So true, so true!

Also, I have started to shift my practice a little to do what you and Ricardo do, isolate a compas or even less and then just play it over and over with the metronome, making sure it's perfect in every way and sounds just right...Then repeat! Such a difference from the superficial kind of learning in my past.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 12 2006 1:30:08

Guest

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 12 2006 2:29:52

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 12 2006 2:46:22

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: How anyone can become a good gui... (in reply to Kate)

Romie,
I like the practice technique a lot. It makes a lot of sense. How are you going to get a whole piece to groove if you can't get one compas to sound right?

I will check out that book.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Nov. 12 2006 2:57:42