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Quiet tonight isn't it....now what's everyone up to? I've been scrubbing the weeks accumulated life wear from the depths of my questionable existence and looking at trying to feel the necessary elements of differences in compass....also looking at working on tremolo...make it smother and to have a little feeling...loose that blandness of repetition without emotion which seems to be so apparent in my playing. I've also been thinking on how interesting it is reading all the different approaches there are to playing when one person reads and learns from dots and another learns from ear. I don't read music at all and have spent a lifetime of playing and learning from ear. I sometimes wish I had applied myself to reading music but am unsure of what it may have removed from my ear and perhaps from my 'musicality' ( if indeed I have any at all) I don't mean that those who only play from dots have no musicality,i am only applying that statement to myself!! How you guys all doing? Are the roads getting any easier for any of you or is it all a hard slog of pain and no progress? Just wondered
Quiet tonight isn't it....now what's everyone up to?
Slogging away on a big app and server (social network) project for a rich client who is as frustrated as I am at Apple's developer web site hack, which means I still not send him the latest version to test
It also means that I haven't picked up a camera or guitar in weeks, if not months. Though I am tinkering with the idea of buying me a cheapish banjo as a reward soon. I am rather partial to bluegrass and the music of the American Civil War after watching Ken Burns's epic documentary recently.
Anyone tried the banjo and got some tips? 4 or 5 string, etc?
Are the roads getting any easier for any of you or is it all a hard slog of pain and no progress? Just wondered
Yeah that's me. In perpetual practice mode. Fortunately I enjoy practice. Like Tárrega's tremolo study: Fransciso really hit the jackpot with this one but I noticed that Bream uses a different fingering starting at measure 5 using a bar at position 8 and maintaining it until 5th beat at measure 10. This eliminates several position changes but is not as resonant as Terrega's. What to do. Any way I bought a copy of Juan Martin's beginner book so will give that a shot. Have mastered the first solea at level 0. I dunno, zero has a negative connotation.
5 string....kicks a.r.s.e and its just so cool!! I can play some stuff as too can my youngest son who won't!! Sorry the guitar or camera haven't found their way into your hands...I hope they both do soon.....too much work can be too destructive.
There is a third layer between "ear" and "reading".
Ear: people usually go by fingerings on their instrument, relying more on physical cues associated to stuff they already know. Getting out of this box is very unlikely. Its like the good old pentatonic shape & its blues licks.
Reading: here we can find people who can only read and are unable to play happy birthday by ear (this is true). The best readers are like a humanized midi player.
3rd layer: a guy that doesnt read but KNOWS & USES his theory. When you associate intervals, chords, cadences, patterns and all that with a symbol (theory), you end up creating your own vocabulary, your library that you can expand and use to understand genres that are new to you...
...instead of hunting the notes down with your fingers or running to buy sheet music.
What I mean is that if you get that 3rd layer down you'll immediately understand written music without even learning it. Either way, its your choice if you want to read or not but it certainly opens up your own visualization of note movement as opposed to thinking in numers all the time (the 3rd layer thing).
Little by little Ive been forcing myself to write stuff using notation, it certainly opens up new perspectives after those 10min spent figuring out how to write those two measures
From zero we start heading up so that point of reference should always encourage as it will always serve to remind us of the point at which we started....if that makes sence? I think that's a good book and c.d. set to work from and a player with your years of knowledge and obvious dedication ,especially ,I think I'm right in saying, with/to classical guitar ,will move through the levels skillfully for sure.
Rui, you are right of course and I guess I have maybe been unfair to myself! I have played guitar I excess of 30 years now...at a fairly good level....from ear....and can nail stuff in a working band situation pretty quickly....I listen and am, I've been told by other musicians , a player for the song....great compliment I guess. Now ,flamenco... .OMG....not only has it really grabbed hold of me from the listening point it has also really made me re-evaluate my whole application to playing guitar ,period. I've had to start again which has meant trying to undo all those years of bad habits too. At 47 years of age that's a big ask.....and I guess I was wondering, if I read, and had that mathematical structure to what I do instead of relying on those things from the 3rd layer ,would I be in a better place with this new road? Also Rui i am hyper critical of myself....especially when it comes to playing guitar....my Achilles heel I guess.
Quiet tonight isn't it....now what's everyone up to?
Slogging away on a big app and server (social network) project for a rich client who is as frustrated as I am at Apple's developer web site hack, which means I still not send him the latest version to test
It also means that I haven't picked up a camera or guitar in weeks, if not months. Though I am tinkering with the idea of buying me a cheapish banjo as a reward soon. I am rather partial to bluegrass and the music of the American Civil War after watching Ken Burns's epic documentary recently.
Anyone tried the banjo and got some tips? 4 or 5 string, etc?
Cheers for that Simon. I'll be smiling till bedtime !
And, whilst I agree with you Rui on a lot of what you said I think that there are a lot more than three options. There are many many other ways but four might be the guy who played by ear and took his time and really enjoyed learning to read and kept up both. And five his mirror image the guy who learned by reading and started working by ear and really enjoyed it and kept up both.
Less happy the guys, and I was one, who learned one way and then foolishly abandoned it whilst pursuing another.
Generally speaking you have black & white. Either you read music or you play by ear, thats what 99% of the world population will ask you if they see you playing something.
I was just saying that there is a gray area that can be much more useful. That zone where you arent either hunting the right notes on your instrument or waiting for the score to be published.
Now that gray area can have whatever degree of shades you want.
Rui Think I am confused here and have misunderstood the term....my apologies to you! Anyway , I hope from what I have said in my posts about where I am as a player you can see where i am coming from?
Generally speaking you have black & white. Either you read music or you play by ear, thats what 99% of the world population will ask you if they see you playing something.
I was just saying that there is a gray area that can be much more useful. That zone where you arent either hunting the right notes on your instrument or waiting for the score to be published.
Now that gray area can have whatever degree of shades you want.
Well, Pink, You sound like I felt 15 years ago, I was 43 I was playing in rock bands ....played by ear since I was 12 Kinda got bored of the electric guitar and took on Flamenco mostly to spend more time with my wife that like to dance It did seem daunting at first,and certainly has had its challenges. But I focused on the rhythm and the right hand technique and listened to a lot of flamenco. Used some available tabs ...but mostly watched others. And learned the basics of the most common palos. You don't have to be a virtuoso to enjoy flamenco....nor to have others enjoy your guitar playing of flamenco. Now, I don't regret one second of all the hard work it takes to feel confident It is like a continuation of learning something new forever.
Tonite I rest my fingers after a week of accompaniment for a dance workshop taught by a fantastic teacher visiting from Spain. My Reward
Rui Think I am confused here and have misunderstood the term....my apologies to you! Anyway , I hope from what I have said in my posts about where I am as a player you can see where i am coming from?
Yeah, I got you and I would suggest that at this point you ignore the staff.
Get into the mathematical side of things, the roman numerals for chords, numbers for intervals...etc. You'll be pretty amazed at how much you already know and how it all locks togheter and opens up new possibilities and musical ease.
There's good instruction on youtube and some sites that sell video tutorials too. There are also pretty bad, awful things to be found that might confuse you. Beware!
Are the roads getting any easier for any of you or is it all a hard slog of pain and no progress? Just wondered
Yeah that's me. In perpetual practice mode. Fortunately I enjoy practice. Like Tárrega's tremolo study: Fransciso really hit the jackpot with this one but I noticed that Bream uses a different fingering starting at measure 5 using a bar at position 8 and maintaining it until 5th beat at measure 10. This eliminates several position changes but is not as resonant as Terrega's. What to do. Any way I bought a copy of Juan Martin's beginner book so will give that a shot. Have mastered the first solea at level 0. I dunno, zero has a negative connotation.
I think, no I am certain, that Bream changed the fingering to enhance resonance. The piece is in four part harmony and the original Tarrega fingering sacrifices the tenor/alto to allow the melody to stay on the second string for longer . Bream, and I also decided on this fingering as a lowly teacherless student many years ago, decided to allow all four parts to ring as much as possible and that is the reason for the fingering change.
I would assume that the difference in tone quality between the first and second string since the advent of nylon technology has been smoothed out in the intervening century making the alternate fingering less jarring to the melody line.
No way was Bream's decision based on a lazy avoidance of shifting.
Well, Pink, You sound like I felt 15 years ago, I was 43 I was playing in rock bands ....played by ear since I was 12 Kinda got bored of the electric guitar and took on Flamenco mostly to spend more time with my wife that like to dance It did seem daunting at first,and certainly has had its challenges. But I focused on the rhythm and the right hand technique and listened to a lot of flamenco. Used some available tabs ...but mostly watched others. And learned the basics of the most common palos. You don't have to be a virtuoso to enjoy flamenco....nor to have others enjoy your guitar playing of flamenco. Now, I don't regret one second of all the hard work it takes to feel confident It is like a continuation of learning something new forever.
Tonite I rest my fingers after a week of accompaniment for a dance workshop taught by a fantastic teacher visiting from Spain. My Reward
Wonderful reply c and I thank you for that input....as I do all who have commented so far. Deciding to learn this has for me reinvented my love affair with the guitar and I must admit am not at all daunted by the hard work ahead....in fact its a dream come true to get this far down a road and still be enjoying the journey. I do hope I can get to a point where I too can accompany... with confidence.... so shall use your model to remember what you can achieve if its something you really want.
I think, no I am certain, that Bream changed the fingering to enhance resonance. The piece is in four part harmony and the original Tarrega fingering sacrifices the tenor/alto to allow the melody to stay on the second string for longer . Bream, and I also decided on this fingering as a lowly teacherless student many years ago, decided to allow all four parts to ring as much as possible and that is the reason for the fingering change.
I would assume that the difference in tone quality between the first and second string since the advent of nylon technology has been smoothed out in the intervening century making the alternate fingering less jarring to the melody line.
No way was Bream's decision based on a lazy avoidance of shifting.
I would never have thought Bream was lazy! For me (and with my guitar) stopped bass strings in the upper end tend to lack resonance. But I don't like the effect of playing one open and then one stopped string accentuating the alternation so I'll stick with Bream.
Ran across this link with some interesting thoughts on Segovia/Bream fingering. Particularly Segovia's manner of playing along a string for timbral consistency and even Bream playing with one right hand finger rather than alternating to max consistency. I remember reading ages ago an article where a guy analyzed a Sor Minuet by Segovia on record and noted how carefully he had worked out his interpretation. No wonder he could make such a simple piece sound exceptional while I could play the thing and it just lay there! http://www.steventhachuk.com/blog.html
Here you go Aeolus my favourite one string extravaganza .
Sorry about the dead strings and sloppy unfocused playing, will make it private in an hour or so but you made me wanna play it and I put the webcam on.
The Sor 'Beginner' studies are terrific for working on interpretation. First Vienese school, nowhere to hide.
Sorry about the dead strings and sloppy unfocused playing, will make it private in an hour or so but you made me wanna play it and I put the webcam on.
I know almost nothing about banjos but if I were ever to buy one it would be to do this.
D.
PS there is a terrific book by Steve Kaufman. Really simple but cute arrangements and he plays through most of them on the accompanying DVD. And if you keep up on your sight reading you can get through the whole thing in a day as it is mostly authentic open position real life bluegrass. Best twenty quid I ever spent on a music book, and there is A LOT of music in it(with tab too).
Bath festival sounds great, the country dudes take a pride in being welcoming and you can get through a lot of jam sessions if you have a well honed three chord trick. Glad to know I am not the only bluegrass enthusiast on the foro.
I am tinkering with the idea of buying me a cheapish banjo
If you play flamenco guitar you will have no serious technical problems with bluegrass banjo, although getting used to fingerpicks take some adjustment.
The UK used to have a thriving bluegrass scene, and no doubt still does (I played with a band called The Cardboard Mountain Boys).
PM me of you need some recommendations for books or recordings.
P.S. Pete Stanley used to play with his nails; but that’s unusual and I don’t recommend it — particularly if you need them for Flamenco!
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