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Posts: 1531
Joined: Nov. 7 2008
From: New York City/San Francisco
Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao
In my infamous attempt to compose a Solea' for the CD Challenge, I felt instinctively drawn to the Eminor key. However, I rarely hear any Solea in this [I suppose] 'unorthodox' key. Is this why the Palo is described as Ganania (Solea')?
How do you generally feel about resorting to different keys when composing in a Palo that traditionally is expected to be in a specifically given key [A minor or D minor -arriba y medio, as they say, for Solea']?
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RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to gj Michelob)
Solea por buleria I wouldn't label this video as "Solea". (Even though as we all know solea and solea por buleria are basically the same, just different speed, rythmical feeling, etc.) But this is a solea por bulerias.
Posts: 1531
Joined: Nov. 7 2008
From: New York City/San Francisco
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to Arash)
quote:
Solea por buleria I wouldn't label this video as "Solea". (Even though as we all know solea and solea por buleria are basically the same, just different speed, rythmical feeling, etc.) But this is a solea por bulerias.
Thank you, Arash. Two questions left: 1. Is the Eminor Key acceptable because it is a 'Solea por Buleria'? 2. What in the name... is a 'Ganania'
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to gj Michelob)
quote:
1. Is the Eminor Key acceptable because it is a 'Solea por Buleria'? 2. What in the name... is a 'Ganania'
I guess any key is acceptable for any palo as long as the spirit of the palo is caught by the player. Granainas is one of the free forms of fandangos, like tarantas. One of the characteristics is a specific binding pattern fallowed by the sliding F#>B.
this is a nice one. The sliding part is played at 2:45.
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to gj Michelob)
quote:
2. What in the name... is a 'Ganania'
quote:
Granainas is one of the free forms of fandangos, like tarantas.
I made the same mistake at the very beginning when this tune came out...I was confuzed too at that time. It's not granaina but ganania. I'm not sure but I think it's something related with the 'labores del campo', related with el ganado or something. A rural house or a farm I'd say
_____________________________
"The most important part of Flamenco is not in knowing how to interpret it. The higher art is in knowing how to listen." (Luis Agujetas)
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to mezzo)
quote:
ORIGINAL: mezzo
quote:
2. What in the name... is a 'Ganania'
quote:
Granainas is one of the free forms of fandangos, like tarantas.
I made the same mistake at the very beginning when this tune came out...I was confuzed too at that time. It's not granaina but ganania. I'm not sure but I think it's something related with the labores del campo. related with el ganado or something.
You goth a point there :-)
Now i have a question:
What is a Gañanía (as it is indeed spelled in above video) ?
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to gj Michelob)
I'm gonna probably state some BS coz of my absolute lack of theoritical knowledge. But this tune is played in an alterated tunning (more or less the same as the Rondena but not exactly the same). So I don't get where the Em key came from. If Am is for E phrygian if Dm is for A phrygian then Em is for B phrygian (aka granainas key). but here is more or less a C#phrygian (rondena key) no? so it would be more or less Fm#.
_____________________________
"The most important part of Flamenco is not in knowing how to interpret it. The higher art is in knowing how to listen." (Luis Agujetas)
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to gj Michelob)
quote:
How do you generally feel about resorting to different keys when composing in a Palo that traditionally is expected to be in a specifically given key [A minor or D minor -arriba y medio, as they say, for Solea']?
i think more common to hear flamencos refer to por arriba as "E major" and por medio as "A major" even though technically neither is correct in terms of classical written keys.... but when the home chord is E maj or A maj you can see where they are coming from.
i think there are some other threads about this track, toño and tuning etc.
Posts: 1531
Joined: Nov. 7 2008
From: New York City/San Francisco
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to xirdneH_imiJ)
quote:
correct, the tuning is DADF#AD and it's in C#
Some sensitive 'ear' there, good catch, _imiJ. And thank you.
Thank you Mezzo, for clarifying that Ganania is the title, not another Palo, yet.
Erik, when I first wrote the post, I too had misread the post and spelled out, Granainas. No offense, at all. In fact, in my mind I listened to it thinking it was going to sound as Granainas turning into Solea at some later point, and listened to it as if a 'Eminor/Bmajor key -and that betrays my pauper ear
And Mark74, I will pass your comment along to my fourTEEN year old daughter, who wears religiously only black, lipstick, along with black nail polish, clothing, backpack etc. to contrast of course the palest skin [that contrast being essential to 'Goth', apparently]...
Lastly, Mark Indigo, yes that was what i meant, with Arriba and Medio, but thank you for reminding me that it should properly read 'por'... Medio or Arriba.
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to mark74)
quote:
ORIGINAL: mark74
oh i wasn't meaning to criticize just clarify...,i wouldnt criticize anyone from another country writing in english unless i knew their language
Don't worry, i loved your commend.... like i love the looks and outfit of goths :-) As a matter of fact, one of the better musicians of the netherlands happens to be goth as well. At Rotterdam Conservatory he switched from studying flamenco guitar to composition and with fabulous results. One of his inspirations are mechanically/electronically generated sounds, like using very long and thick metal cables that (ones vibrating and amplified) generate incredible sounds. His final exam was a real treat with all kinds of instrumental set ups/ styles of music, some of which were extremely complex, demanding and inspiring.
This is a bulerias suite he composed/performed quite recently .... it gives you an impression of his music and looks (he obviously is playing the electrical guitar)...if you don't like the beginning skip to the the second half.
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to gj Michelob)
Interesting video Erik......... That looks like an Ibanez Xiphos he's playing, Muhammed Suicmez's signature guitar. You sure he's not a metal head? People tend to confuse us with goth sometimes, we're not sad, we're angry
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to Leñador)
quote:
ORIGINAL: Lenador
That looks like an Ibanez Xiphos he's playing, Muhammed Suicmez's signature guitar. You sure he's not a metal head? People tend to confuse us with goth sometimes, we're not sad, we're angry
It sounds like you know way more about the subject then i do, so i gladly surrender.... metal head it is.
Funny he plays an Ibanez...i have a very player friendly Ibanez classical guitar from the early 70ties (fabric made in Japan) that i don't mind playing instead of my top class flamenco guitars.
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From: Washington DC
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to gj Michelob)
Although the key he plays in is essentially the same as Rondeña, the form is SOLEA that he plays. We have discussed till blue in the face on the foro what complex details differentiate the labels SOLEA....SOLEA POR BULERIA and BULERIA POR SOLEA.
They are at times interchangeable depending on context. If you must wonder WHY did he label his solo piece SOLEA and not buleria por solea or solea por buleria, it is because he was thinking of doing THIS with his fasletas:
THIS s SOLEA, not buleria por solea that she is SINGING, despite the fact the movie makers labeled it solea POR BULERIAS. IF she had sung instead buleria por solea (buleria larga or corta) or solea de jerez (frijones etc) they could have labeled differently. For diego it doesnt matter the playing is the same. Hope that makes sense.
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to mark74)
Its quite interesting how much flamenco palos can be varied, for example in the beginning even Paco de Lucia was dissed by the purists that he stretched it too much, correct me if Im wrong though. But that song is great.
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to mezzo)
quote:
i think more common to hear flamencos refer to por arriba as "E major" and por medio as "A major"
But if the solea por arriba is in E major key, then what would be the key for alegrias played with E7-B7 chords?
E major, obviously
what i was trying to say in that post was that although technically it's not correct for por arriba (E phrygian) to be called E major, you do sometimes hear it referred to like that, i guess because the home chord is E major.
The point I was trying to make was that although the "key signature" fits when it's written in standard notation, por arriba (E phrygian) is not A minor!
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to mark indigo)
E dominant phrygian and A dominant phrygian
Often though in flamenco guitarists use notes outside the basic scale, for example using both dominant phrygian and phrygian but thats only one note difference, some others are also used.
RE: Solea' in Eminor... Diego Del Morao (in reply to tele)
quote:
E dominant phrygian and A dominant phrygian
Often though in flamenco guitarists use notes outside the basic scale, for example using both dominant phrygian and phrygian but thats only one note difference, some others are also used.
easier to just call it por arriba or por medio and be done with it!
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I made the same mistake at the very beginning when this tune came out...I was confuzed too at that time. 
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