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water logged woods?   You are logged in as Guest
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at_leo_87

Posts: 3055
Joined: Aug. 30 2008
From: Boston, MA, U.S.A

water logged woods? 
what do you guys think of this? could it be used for flamenco guitars with success?

fast forward to 1:00


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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 1 2010 10:37:58
 
jshelton5040

Posts: 1500
Joined: Jan. 17 2005
 

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
Don't know what he means by "radial cut" I assume he means pealed.

"The cells become little echo chambers"...."30% longer vibration"....etc.

Where does he come up with this data? Sounds like BS to me.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 1 2010 11:49:03
 
Jeff Highland

 

Posts: 401
Joined: Mar. 5 2010
From: Caves Beach Australia

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
I agree John, bs for sure.
Cut into veneer and glue laminated into a ply shell, even if it had some amazing characteristic it would not influence the end result.
I have used lake sinker redwood in one tenor ukulele top with good results and it has a beautiful appearance. About to do another 4, will cost me about $15 per top for sopranos.
I am not totally sold on whether the sonic properties are improved or it was just good timber to start with.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 1 2010 12:26:48
 
estebanana

Posts: 9354
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
It's BS. It's a gimmick. Sinker wood..... *meh*.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 1 2010 18:44:42
 
at_leo_87

Posts: 3055
Joined: Aug. 30 2008
From: Boston, MA, U.S.A

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
so i guess maybe this guy should stop pulling random facts out of his arse and instead remove the drum stick lodged up there.

does anybody know if stradivarius actually soaked his woods? or is that bogus too?

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 1 2010 18:54:38
 
HemeolaMan

Posts: 1514
Joined: Jul. 13 2007
From: Chicago

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
Ima let you finish....but stradivarius had the best wood of all time.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 1 2010 19:32:28
 
estebanana

Posts: 9354
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
quote:


does anybody know if stradivarius actually soaked his woods?


He knew how to select wood and they had a lot of good wood to choose from. Everyone used the wood from the same suppliers so why were Stradivari's violins so great? He made 700 plus of them. If you built that many and paid attention, how could you not get good?

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 1 2010 20:26:36
 
HemeolaMan

Posts: 1514
Joined: Jul. 13 2007
From: Chicago

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to estebanana) 
also, if there are 700 made, then a goodly number mustve survived. who's to say that many better ones weren't made by lesser known makers and lost?

magical wood magical wood magical wood! lets live in a fairy tale dreamland where magical ancient sopping wet logs produce magical fairy tale instruments!! hoooraaaaaaaay!

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 1 2010 20:32:04
 
estebanana

Posts: 9354
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
You can read up on the Strads in the Hill books and other sources. My first training was in a violin bowmakers shop. He had all the important books published up to that time. I used to peruse them and we would talk about them all the time.

He used to take me to Los Angeles when he would visit other dealers and I got to see a great many wonderful instruments. I remember the first time I saw a Strad in person an was allowed to hold it. I about pissed my pants.

The collector we were visiting that day tested me. He said as he hauled a Cremonese violin from his vault " Here is a good instrument from the last great Cremonese maker of the golden period." I said "Ahh a Storioni." I said. He handed it to me, after that I got to see all the other violins in the vault. Cremonese an other old Italian violins are so wickedly cool and have an aura or presence that is very compelling to be near.

My aesthetic and threshold for how a guitar is finished and decorated owes a lot to those visits. I think it's why I am drawn to simple less complicated bindings and stuff. I suspect Anders might have some similar feelings.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 1 2010 21:33:28
 
at_leo_87

Posts: 3055
Joined: Aug. 30 2008
From: Boston, MA, U.S.A

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
nice story stephen. you've reminded me of the movie the red violin.

i wonder what you think of this little thing here...


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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 1 2010 22:01:12
 
Armando

Posts: 302
Joined: May 27 2005
From: Zürich, Switzerland

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
Hi

What this guy is talking about on youtube is nothing new. Stradivarius indeed used that kind of wood for his violins 300 years ago. I believe that there is something true about this.
The effect of soaking the wood as discribed in the video was not a thing that stradivari did himself. The wood he purchased was already soaked in a natural manner. We should remember that stradivarius travelled himself to the fiemme valley in the northern italian alps to personally choose his tonewood. They have cut the trees and they shipped the logs by throwing them into the river "Po" which is passing Cremona, the home city of Strativarius. During the time of shipping the logs were soaked and the wood gained exactly that properties as discribed in the video.

There is no doubt that such techinques had a significant influence on the sonority of the wood allthough they wern't applied for that reason rather more due to practical reasons. It was just the cheapest and easiest way of shipping wood.

regards

Armando

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 2 2010 2:20:33
 
estebanana

Posts: 9354
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
quote:

There is no doubt that such techinques had a significant influence on the sonority of the wood allthough they wern't applied for that reason rather more due to practical reasons.


It's purely anecdotal evidence and opinion that this treatment makes wood better. There is a lot of doubt in my mind.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 2 2010 5:15:45
 
jshelton5040

Posts: 1500
Joined: Jan. 17 2005
 

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to Armando) 
quote:

ORIGINAL: Armando

During the time of shipping the logs were soaked and the wood gained exactly that properties as discribed in the video.

There is no doubt that such techinques had a significant influence on the sonority of the wood allthough they wern't applied for that reason rather more due to practical reasons. It was just the cheapest and easiest way of shipping wood.

I doubt that floating down a river would convey the same properties as sitting on the bottom of a lake for many years. I have read that submerging wood does slow rate of cure resulting in more stability. I think that it's a common practice in Japan to sink logs for several years before use.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 2 2010 7:18:39
 
nhills

Posts: 230
Joined: Jul. 13 2003
From: West Des Moines, IA USA

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to estebanana) 
Hi!

Try googling with the following "wood violin water Nagyvary". Nagyvary did much of the research on this.

Who knows if he's right!

Norman

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 2 2010 7:48:00
 
estebanana

Posts: 9354
Joined: Oct. 16 2009
 

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to at_leo_87) 
Nagyvary is by many considered a quack. He's made many claims over the years. He's very good at sensationalizing his opinions.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 2 2010 9:17:39
 
nhills

Posts: 230
Joined: Jul. 13 2003
From: West Des Moines, IA USA

RE: water logged woods? (in reply to estebanana) 
I agree regarding Nagyvary. I was not supporting his opinions - merely providing the name as a reference.

Norman

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"The duende is God's orgasm." - Antonio Canales

"I'm just a poor crazy man in love with his art." - Santos Hernandez (as translated by R. Brune)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Apr. 2 2010 9:43:56
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