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Jason Webster and the state of flamenco
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Kate
Posts: 1827
Joined: Jul. 8 2003
From: Living in Granada, Andalucía
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 RE: Jason Webster and the state of f... (in reply to Ron.M)
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From the moment I picked up the book I knew it was wishful fiction. For start he arrives speaking no Spanish and yet not once does he talk about the difficulties of learning the language, and even more difficult understanding the way Gitanos speak and they in turn understanding you. Having spent a lot of time in the hard Gitano neighbourhood myself, having had guns pulled on me and been threatened and bullied, as well as protected , loved and accepted I knew that he was lying. Aside from the fact that in such a short time he had got so good at the guitar that he was accompanying cante professionally and being paid. If so where is the album from Jason Webster , the concerts, the tour to accompany the book ????
And speaking of which .. what strikes me is that if this flamenco group he worked with did exist, where are they now? Surely they would be out there shouting about it, hey we're the band in the book. When 'Driving Over lemons' author write about Emilio Maya he knew about it, so would this group. So where are they ?
Kate
_____________________________
Emilio Maya Temple
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B000CA6OBC
http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/emiliomaya
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Date Aug. 29 2004 12:20:39
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RE: Jason Webster and the state of f... (in reply to Escribano)
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When I first heard about this book I wanted to read it, but then I read somewhere that the author went to Valencia in search of Flamenco. No one in the recorded history of mankind has ever gone to Valencia in search of Flamenco. It's like going to Minneapolis, Minnesota in search of the Blues. However, if you're going to write fiction and try to pass it off as fact, then it starts to make sense. If he had gone to Jerez, for example, there would be too many witnesses. It would be all too easy to verify what he writes.
I have no problem with someone writing a fictionalized account of something, but I do have a problem when they try to pass it off as fact. There's a bit too much fiction nowadays being passed off as fact. The 'DaVinci Code' comes to mind. There you have a little different situation - a book that's clearly labeled as a novel that tries to convince the reader that it's fact. It's poorly written and badly researched, yet it has become the number one best seller in the world.
I've heard that Webster's book is a good read. Would it have been any less entertaining if he had called it a novel and gave credit to the person on whom he based it? I think not, but reality sells. It's a marketing ploy. I hope the hell this Rafa guy sues the pants off of Webster.
Phil
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Date Aug. 29 2004 14:50:26
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RE: Jason Webster and the state of f... (in reply to Escribano)
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I got carried away with my last post and forgot to answer Simon's original question. I agree that Morente is knowledgeable. I've heard some of his early stuff and really like it. There's no doubt in my mind that Morente is firmly rooted in traditional Flamenco, but I personally don't like what he's been doing for the last 20 or so years. Just listen to Morente accompanied by Cañizares in Saura's film 'Flamenco' and tell me it sounds anything like a Siguiriyas. That's just my opinion. Only time will tell if Morente will have any lasting influence. Personally I don't think he will.
Phil
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Date Aug. 29 2004 15:04:57
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RE: Jason Webster and the state of f... (in reply to Escribano)
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quote:
I believe he went to Alicante
Sorry, just realized that I wasn't logged in. Anyway, regarding the above quote from Simon - that's what happens when one comments on a book that one hasn't read. 
Phil
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Date Aug. 29 2004 15:22:54
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bailoro2000
Posts: 93
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
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RE: Jason Webster and the state of f... (in reply to Kate)
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Sounds (without reading the Duende thing) like you'd all have been better saving the money and buying Robin Totton's "Song of the outcasts", a genuine attempt to understand flamenco and with a great CD thrown in. Every book gets its share of "ayes"
and "nos" but Totton comes across as totally genuine. IMO, of course (thouuh not that of some others I won't mention) ((-:.
Kate (off topic and with appologies).
You have to read deeply into the history of the Knights Templar, The history of Freemasonry, The Arthurian Legends and Rosyth Chapel to get an understanding of the
Sion and Opus Dei topics. As a stauch Roman Catholic I got an eye opener from reading books such as : The Hiram Key, The Second Messiah, The History of Rosyth, The Bible Code, The Turin Shroud, The Grail Legends, Arcadia, The Holy Blood and The Holy Grail,
The Gold of Exodus etc etc. There is more mystery and intrigue in fact than any fiction. (((-: Again, just my opinion.
Jim.
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Date Aug. 30 2004 11:57:34
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gerundino63
Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands
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RE: Jason Webster and the state of f... (in reply to miguel)
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Thanks all!
Did Not know about the book, buyed it yesterday ,the Duch version,( it came out this year)
Checking out here a little, see the name Webster, thought: "hey, isn't that the guy from my book?)
Now I read all of this stuff!! 
At least, I can tell you if it brings you as much fun to read, if you know, before you read, the story is a fake.....
BUT, if I ever read a detective before you guys, I tell you who did the crime, and get even!! 
Peter.
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Date Sep. 12 2004 18:06:10
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Tenshu
Posts: 150
Joined: Oct. 18 2003
From: Belgium
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RE: Jason Webster and the state of f... (in reply to Escribano)
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Hey Gerundino
I have an excellent book suggestion for you... actually I'd recommend it to everyone here, except I'm pretty sure it's Dutch-only (I live in Belgium myself). A shame, because this is an incredible book, with the heart in the right place.
It's called Duende - Een bericht over Andalucía, flamenco en zigeuners. (Translated: Duende - A note about Andalucia, flamenco and gypsies) written by Ivo Hermans, ISBN 90 6445 084 6.
The writer doesn't try to approach flamenco in a scientific manner, although the book presents extensive historic background, detailed palo info, etc... He talks about where the true essence of flamenco is: in its soul, its duende, something I think we all have forgotten about to some extent.
He travels through Andalucia, passing through long forgotten paths. He visits people, often old friends because he says 'time to visit them is running out'. He takes you through little places noone knows about and tells you their stories, uncovering a bit of the soul of Andalucia.
Definitely an amazing book, written by an amazing man who has actually been there and is constantly drawn towards those strange people who are only limited by the borders of their own imagination.
I actually think this book is so romantic, too emotional, it shouldn't have been released. I strongly advise you to get it; else you'd be missing out.
Comes with a CD with good solid cante.
_____________________________
-T
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Date Sep. 12 2004 19:57:23
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RE: Jason Webster and the state of f... (in reply to Tenshu)
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Hi Tenshu!
Thanks for the tip!
I red the book already, very good, the first one and half page gave me the goose spots!
Ivo Hermans is from Belgium, right?
Has he written more books?
Hartelijke Groet, Peter
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Date Sep. 12 2004 22:49:32
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RE: Jason Webster and the state of f... (in reply to gerundino63)
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Cheers Peter.
I hear about that one and it's on my list. I also have the other three books by the author of The Da Vinci code, Dan Brown, although I just got them as a birthday gift and haven't read them yet. Thanks again.
Jim.
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Date Sep. 13 2004 9:59:51
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and I enjoyed this a lot more than Duende. 
