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Posts: 2697
Joined: Jun. 7 2010
From: The South Ireland
RE: The young El Payo Humberto! (in reply to rombsix)
Sir Spamalot hit us again ........
This is very "traditional" and done in that way , even the traditional sitting position and sound of the guitar,,..I kinda like this stuff from time to time I think it would be a big hit in the feria or romeria to accompany the tapas and then some dancing.. I Like the alegrias in particular , I didnt have time to listen to them all , If I had more time I would have a play along time to learn a few things ........it's very good ., says 1988 but it could be earlier (by it's style ) if you know what I mean ...
RE: The young El Payo Humberto! (in reply to rombsix)
This was one of the first recordings of his playing that Humberto gave me... very good stuff... some of the falsetas and transitions in the alegrias are pretty much godly...
Posts: 15242
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
RE: The young El Payo Humberto! (in reply to kudo)
quote:
ORIGINAL: kudo
i personally think his accompanying is not correct/accurate and also in terms of chord changes in there
I only watched granaina so far and he was dead on, although his guitar was a bit out of tune and he kept trying to fix it. I felt the singer changed the melody a bit to give more clear guide tones which I think is wrong as per tradition, but the guitar accompaniments were correct.
I assume you guys mean the other cantes so I will take some time to check.
Ok Solea de Triana, tough stuff, but he was right with him all the way.
Ok, Taranto he does F# for first line then responds D7. It's ok, though most others touch on G, or go right into D or D7. It's totally deliberate though and he is totally with the singer which is what is important. The next cante is Levantica I think, and dead on accompaniment.
Malagueña DEAD on. (for you nerds with an ear, when the singer gives the 7th of V the guitar responds to I chord. EXample he sings Bb and the guitar goes to F. That is the way most malagueñas are, and Taranto is similar.)
Need I check the rest? I will....
Ok tango piyayo no problem, colombianas too, 2 chords easy stuff. Caña was good. Fandango next to last vid was fantastic, he is lucky to have such a complete cantaor to work with. And he plays well, he really knows the cante. The buleria was good too. The only thing I did not like was his treatment of compas in the Alegria/cantiñas but every thing else is pretty exemplary.
I recommend instead of critic this guy Kudo you actually do your best to learn from this, it's pretty clear he knows his stuff.
RE: The young El Payo Humberto! (in reply to Ricardo)
El Payo has some nice musicality in his toque. I enjoyed the overall.
quote:
Ok, Taranto he does F# for first line
Are you talking about the one he gave at 3'14? IMO he made a mistake here coz it sounds like a resolving one but the cante melody has not resolve yet. After that hit he clearly search for the appropriate one
This remind me what he said about cante the levante in his YT uploads while explaining cante stuff. I watched most of 'em coz they're interesting. And he clearly stated that for him the levante cante were always difficult to get and gave him a lot of trouble to understand...
And i'm not really surprised by kudo's reaction. Maybe it's not what he expected to heard in a 'correct' accompaniment task. I remember he told me that my Marina Heredia's attempt (the buleria controversial one) was NOT correct coz I did strum and sound traditionnal rather than contemporary.
I'm more surprised by toddk's.
BTW Umberto could have named the 'cancion por buleria' (al golpe) according to how he and others define the 'al golpe' adjective...
_____________________________
"The most important part of Flamenco is not in knowing how to interpret it. The higher art is in knowing how to listen." (Luis Agujetas)
Posts: 15242
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
RE: The young El Payo Humberto! (in reply to mezzo)
quote:
Are you talking about the one he gave at 3'14? IMO he made a mistake here coz it sounds like a resolving one but the cante melody has not resolve yet. After that hit he clearly search for the appropriate one
Ah no man sorry. He did the same exact thing earlier (first line of verse, your point was the repeat, 3rd line or compas if you will) it is deliberate. As I stated, other players play G or jumb directly to D. The levante cantes are a challenge because as I stated, the singers sing the dominant 7th of the V chord, yet the guitar moves to the I chord, or rather your ear WANTS the IV chord (making the note sung tonic rather then Domiant 7th). I often wondered if this was always a mistake of early accompanists, but the further back I look in time, the earliest recordings of cante are all done the same way. Get a compilation of levante cantes including malagueñas and verdiales etc, it sounds strange to play a chord that does not have the note signaled by the singer, but it is long standing part of tradition. With most of the fandangos, roots or thirds of the tonos are given by the voice and it makes more sense than the levante cantes.
RE: The young El Payo Humberto! (in reply to Ricardo)
quote:
Ah no man sorry. He did the same exact thing earlier (first line of verse, your point was the repeat, 3rd line or compas if you will) it is deliberate.
Ah ok. The 1st time it didn't hurt me. Indeed i even not realize. But for the repeating one, i immediatly notice it.
I'm gonna rewatch it.
_____________________________
"The most important part of Flamenco is not in knowing how to interpret it. The higher art is in knowing how to listen." (Luis Agujetas)
Posts: 15242
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
RE: The young El Payo Humberto! (in reply to Morante)
quote:
ORIGINAL: Morante
la Alegría es mal cantada y mal tocada
Harsh, but yeah, not exemplary, of all the stuff that was not so great compas wise, not good for study. Singing was off tune in several spots too. The singer did better with the fandango levante stuff for sure.
RE: The young El Payo Humberto! (in reply to rombsix)
Humberto rules! I wonder if there are any folks here that could accompany 12 palos in one setting (give or take), and make as few mistakes as El Payo did. The sound of that guitar is muy flamenco, is that a Reyes? And the cantaor, Merenguito sounded great for the most part too.
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