Help Identifying My Conde

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kjnouri

Posts: 9
Joined: Oct. 8 2016

Help Identifying My Conde

New to the forum. I have Conde that I purchased 16 years ago from my then instructor. Can the forum experts and old timers help me identify the model?

It is a 2000 Gravina 7 and has a Media Luna headstock.

Thank you in advance.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 8 2016 2:07:44

Echi

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013

RE: Help Identifying My Conde (in reply to kjnouri)

Hi,
You have a primera model from the shop of Calle Gravina.
The label is signed by Faustino's widow as Faustino died in '87.
The shop of Calle Gravina is the same shop once belonged to Domingo Esteso and the main venue of the Conde Hermanos in their best years.
In 2000 the Condes used to have 3 different shops (as in the last years the 3 old Conde brothers got independent from each other).
In those years the guitars made in Felipe V shop (run by Felipe and Mariano jr) were considered "generally" better quality than the guitars coming out from Gravina and Atocha even though many pro- players kept using guitars from the shop Gravina and Atocha like yours.
Nobody can tell for sure who is the real maker of a Conde in those years, no matter the shop.
For some people Ricardo Sanchis Carpio at the time was involved in the building but there is not evidence.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 8 2016 8:42:25

mark indigo

Posts: 3625
Joined: Dec. 5 2007

RE: Help Identifying My Conde (in reply to kjnouri)

what other models did they make at that shop?

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 8 2016 10:42:13

Ricardo

Posts: 14833
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Help Identifying My Conde (in reply to Echi)

quote:

Nobody can tell for sure who is the real maker of a Conde in those years, no matter the shop.
For some people Ricardo Sanchis Carpio at the time was involved in the building but there is not evidence.

The evidence we have found was 90's era Conde from ATOCHA, the r.sanchis Carpio STAMP is located on the soundboard inside.

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CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 8 2016 16:16:52

Echi

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013

RE: Help Identifying My Conde (in reply to kjnouri)

My belief is that the Sanchis Carpio Company made guitars for Atocha, Gravina and the first 3 years of Felipe V.
I was told that these things are ruled by contracts and that Ricardo was bound not to copy the Conde Felipe V bracing, plantilla etc. on his own guitars or reveal the collaboration.
Someone well in the business (cannot make the name, but a very reliable fellow) told me also that Ricardo was one of the handful of luthiers (mostly former Ramirez employees) who used to make the 1st class Felipe V model. Not sure it's true.
I set up many Condes and I'm inclined to believe that there are different recurring hands involved.
I have no direct evidence, I don' mean to say that Sanchis = Conde or anything like that.
Conde is Conde and at the end I am still a Conde fan

Btw the old Sanchis Carpio were very good guitars, way better than today IMHO.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 8 2016 16:42:42

kjnouri

Posts: 9
Joined: Oct. 8 2016

RE: Help Identifying My Conde (in reply to Echi)

Thanks Echi!

Is this considered a pro/concert model or a strong student guitar? Would it be comparable to the FC range today or the FP range? Is this considered a Negra?

I know guitars have very individual characters but I've just started practicing again and haven't seem many Conde's except for the 2 I own and the one's my teachers played many years ago.

I acquired (rather underserving) my second Conde last week for an arm and leg. She is a 1996 Negra from Felipe V. Will post and get your opinion. She is much louder than the Gravina 7.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 8 2016 17:27:21

Echi

Posts: 1132
Joined: Jan. 11 2013

RE: Help Identifying My Conde (in reply to kjnouri)

Hi, your guitar is a negra or a blanca (black or white) depending of the woods used for the back and sides. It's a negra if the box is made of rosewood (dark brown) and blanca if in cypress.
Tipically the negras are louder than the blancas as rosewood is denser and heavier than cypress.
Yes, your guitar is a pro-model. All the "media luna" (half moon shaped headstock) are.
As I said above, there were 3 different Conde shops in 2000 selling the same Conde half moon kind of guitar.
The Felipe V Condes of 2000 are more sought after as generally considered better quality.
Non the less, mine is a generalization as the output of the 3 shop was quite inconsistent and some guitars of Gravina were very good.
Many pro-players used commonly Gravina, Atocha or Felipe V Condes .

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Oct. 8 2016 17:41:06