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Al golpe?   You are logged in as Guest
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TANúñez

Posts: 2559
Joined: Jul. 10 2003
From: TEXAS

Al golpe? 
What exactly does "Al golpe" mean? more emphasis on the accents???

There is a Buleria in Niño Josele's self title CD that I really dig called Estripe(Buleria al golpe).

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 8 2012 13:34:52
 
Ricardo

Posts: 14837
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to TANúñez) 
Golpe is when we tap guitar or the dancer stomps foot so...in flamenco it refers to percussion. "palo seco" is an other term that refers to music that is percussion only, no guitar. Dancers tell guitarists "a tapao" meaning to do a muted strum which is also called by GUITARISTS "apagado" refering to the technique of doing that.

So the cante refers to doing cante with no guitar, por buleria but slow "Buleria al golpe"....some also refer to this as "solea al golpe". If the guitar is used to accompany the cante it is called "Buleria por Solea" although, in modern times we often call it "Solea por buleria"...but for sure the letras used are mainly "Buleria corta" and "Buleria Larga" as per Mairena's definitions.

So to keep it clear, Buleria al golpe=buleria por solea but with no guitar, as palo seco.

Now I take a brief moment to agree and sound like Estela, the term is also used by foreign guitar players mainly to describe the old school style of buleria strumming with the up tap tap, up tap tap, etc, type feel a la Sabicas, Diego del Gastor ,etc . So in that sense it is just a guitar thing. But if josele is using it too, then I guess just like "solea por buleria" caught on as other terms described above, it is general modern way to describe old school buleria soniquete. I need to hear the track to understand why he labels it that way, but hopefully it applies as ONE of the above.

EDIT...just listened to his track....he and palmeros are simply doing buleria as normal guitar solo...dancer footwork too normal. The "al golpe" refers to the percussion of the cajon which marks only in 3, but affects the overall sound. But it's not real important to have labeled it that way IMO, "buleria" is fine. Similarily Guadiana is from Extremadura and bulerias extremeños is often called "jaleos". So I would not have had a problem if they called this Jaleo either, its just kind of fast. (On Almoraima Paco has two buleria, but labels one "jaleo" and it is not that big a deal to have been so definitive that they are different IMO, and indeed live he mixes the same falsetas together).


Ricardo

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 8 2012 13:55:03
 
Paul Magnussen

Posts: 1805
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to Ricardo) 
quote:

the term is also used by foreign guitar players mainly to describe the old school style of buleria strumming


Not just foreign guitar players: I have bulerías al golpe by:

Chano Lobato & Paco del Gastor
José Ramos “Cachitas”
Juan Moneo “El Torta”
Luis Maravilla
Manuel de Paula & La Familia Fernández
Pedro Soler
Roman El Granaíno
Rosalia de Triana & Juan Moreno

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 8 2012 15:47:22
 
TANúñez

Posts: 2559
Joined: Jul. 10 2003
From: TEXAS

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to TANúñez) 
Thank you for that very informative reply Ricardo. I just learned a lot more than I new before I made this post. I know what golpe means but wasn't sure why it was called "al golpe". Was thinking maybe there were more golpe's from the guitarist or golpe's on certain beats.

Then when you said "So the cante refers to doing cante with no guitar, por buleria but slow "Buleria al golpe", ...I remember there is a brief moment where the singer is singing with no guitar, this made a little more sense after you explained it.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 8 2012 15:56:12
 
Ramon Amira

 

Posts: 1025
Joined: Oct. 14 2009
From: New York City

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to TANúñez) 
I have several recordings of solo guitar "Bulerias al Golpe." In these recordings it mostly just means exactly what the name would imply – Bulerias with a lot of golpe, generally tap – tap – stroke - tap – tap - stroke. The best one I have is by Roman el Granaino.

Ramon

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 8 2012 18:54:29
 
mezzo

Posts: 1409
Joined: Feb. 18 2010
From: .fr

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to TANúñez) 
quote:

Then when you said "So the cante refers to doing cante with no guitar, por buleria but slow "Buleria al golpe", ...

Once i asked in a thread (search for "solea al golpe") if this appelation refers always to an acapella tune. The answer i get from Norman (even if he not clearly answered by yes or no) was that the term golpe refers to a speed up variation. Not to a voice only oriented tune.
But maybe i misunderstood his reply coz it was not a simple yes or no answer.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 9 2012 7:33:52
 
Pingaloka

Posts: 42
Joined: Jun. 9 2011
From: Granada, España

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to TANúñez) 
For my understunding, Bulería al golpe is to play a bulería doing the 3 beat tap, that is: pu-pa-pa, pu-pa-pa, pu-pa-pa. Old school bulería.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 9 2012 14:43:06
 
Ramon Amira

 

Posts: 1025
Joined: Oct. 14 2009
From: New York City

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to Pingaloka) 
quote:

For my understunding, Bulería al golpe is to play a bulería doing the 3 beat tap, that is: pu-pa-pa, pu-pa-pa, pu-pa-pa. Old school bulería.


Actually - using your terms - it would not be "pu-pa-pa." It would be "pu-pu-pa." As I said above, it goes tap - tap - stroke, tap - tap - stroke. Most often the golpe is on 1 and 2, 4 and 5. The stroke gives the traditional accent on 3 and 6.

Ramon

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 10 2012 2:24:52
 
Dave K

Posts: 155
Joined: Mar. 29 2006
 

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to Ramon Amira) 
I believe payohumberto explains 'bulerias al golpe' very well here;
Cheers, Dave

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Avise La Fin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 10 2012 4:26:37
 
Pingaloka

Posts: 42
Joined: Jun. 9 2011
From: Granada, España

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to TANúñez) 
quote:

Actually - using your terms - it would not be "pu-pa-pa." It would be "pu-pu-pa." As I said above, it goes tap - tap - stroke, tap - tap - stroke. Most often the golpe is on 1 and 2, 4 and 5. The stroke gives the traditional accent on 3 and 6.


Yes, absoluty right, I didn't realize I started counting on the 12.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 10 2012 7:17:43
 
mezzo

Posts: 1409
Joined: Feb. 18 2010
From: .fr

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to Dave K) 
quote:

I believe payohumberto explains 'bulerias al golpe' very well here;

Every one seems to have a clear definition of what a buleria al golpe is. There' re around 4 differents in this topic

I enjoyed all these Payo's vids. He has a lot.
So for him (if I understand correctly), buleria al golpe is equivalent to PdL's way of foot tapping por buleria. The only moment where he pronunced "buleria al golpe" in the vid is when he ended the boot tap demonstration on the guitar.

Btw, i'm not very convinced by his tables and explanations about the 3 differents manner to mark the compas. It seems to me that he mixes foot tapping while playing guitar with clap while doing palmas.

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"The most important part of Flamenco is not in knowing how to interpret it. The higher art is in knowing how to listen." (Luis Agujetas)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 10 2012 10:50:07
 
mezzo

Posts: 1409
Joined: Feb. 18 2010
From: .fr

RE: Al golpe? (in reply to mezzo) 
quote:

I believe payohumberto explains 'bulerias al golpe' very well here;


Even better in this one



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"The most important part of Flamenco is not in knowing how to interpret it. The higher art is in knowing how to listen." (Luis Agujetas)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date May 15 2012 7:45:01
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