Some one explain clip-on tuners for me please

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mrstwinkle

Posts: 551
Joined: May 14 2017

Some one explain clip-on tuners for ...

How do they work. Vibration from the neck? Sound?

I've had a couple, and they all seem to have different trouble spots on different guitars. For example my current D'addario mini one simply failed to work on low E on my Cordoba F7, but low E is fine on my Valeriano Bernal if tuned to E, but if I drop string 6 to D it can't get it right. However I also find on the Bernal it struggles with the third string (G).

I have workarounds (play fret 5 or 12) etc

Finally, anyone ever permanently mounted one on the back of the head rather than having the clip thing? Wondering if I could use a U shaped pin to mount to a small hole in near the rollers. i.e. won't damage the varnish.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 13 2017 13:33:22

Blondie#2

Posts: 530
Joined: Sep. 14 2010

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to mrstwinkle)

They work from vibration, not sound (vibration = frequency).

I have several, on different guitars, and never have any problems. Try mounting in a different spot on the headstock and/or (especially with that low E) try tuning to 12th fret harmonic instead of the open strings.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 13 2017 13:43:34

mark indigo

Posts: 3625
Joined: Dec. 5 2007

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to mrstwinkle)

you might have a rubbish one. Try snark or korg.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 13 2017 13:48:24

kitarist

Posts: 1715
Joined: Dec. 4 2012

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to mrstwinkle)

They are supposed to pick up the dominant frequency of vibration of the guitar body (in theory you can clip them on anywhere on the guitar if you physically could - not just the neck) as a result of the played note.

The hardware and algorithm for deciding what is that frequency varies between manufacturers - some are better at it than others, and if the threshold is close for some frequency ranges, it is normal that different guitars may make for issues at different frequencies. The only clip-on I never have issues with is the Peterson one, but it is pricey (though worth it in my case as it removed a lot of irritation :-) ). It is accurate to 0.1 cent as well (they say).

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Konstantin

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 13 2017 15:38:49

mrstwinkle

Posts: 551
Joined: May 14 2017

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to mrstwinkle)

Thanks - this is the one I have. I had a couple of cheap ones before and they were REALLY bad. The D'Addario is mostly okay to be fair apart from drop D on 6 and sometimes the G.

I'd like to permanently mount it just behind where neck meets head. The supplied clip-on mount blocks some strings at the mounting area so is less than ideally positioned.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 13 2017 17:35:57

kitarist

Posts: 1715
Joined: Dec. 4 2012

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to mrstwinkle)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mrstwinkle

I'd like to permanently mount it just behind where neck meets head.

I don't know about that - I once got used to having a Snark tuner behind on the neck while playing (before I got the Peterson), and after spending time chasing some weird buzzing sounds, I discovered it was the tuner itself - and it was not its mounting (i.e. not the clip itself), but rather its body assembly. So now I never leave my clip-on tuner on the neck after tuning. Just a word of caution. Maybe it would be no trouble if you secure it firmly....

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Konstantin

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 13 2017 18:00:06

mrstwinkle

Posts: 551
Joined: May 14 2017

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to Blondie#2)

Does vibration 100% = frequency to human ear?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 13 2017 23:35:24

Piwin

Posts: 3559
Joined: Feb. 9 2016

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to mrstwinkle)

Maybe the engineers on here could pitch in, but to me it's the same thing as a regular tuner, just a different medium (a regular tuner picks up the sound wave transmitted through the air, these tuners pick up the sound wave transmitted through the wood).
And if I remember right, the velocity of a sound wave can change depending on the medium, but its frequency stays the same. Something like that?
Where's Richard Jernigan when we need him?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2017 0:06:22

mrstwinkle

Posts: 551
Joined: May 14 2017

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to mrstwinkle)

I've got a prehistoric (80s) acoustic tuner which is much more accurate and always works - IF there is no background noise. Similar with Android apps on phone. I'm curious why the clip ons are less accurate - lower frequencies?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2017 10:31:28

mark indigo

Posts: 3625
Joined: Dec. 5 2007

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to mrstwinkle)

I have also had buzzing from tuners in the past, so I also wouldn't fix permanently. I also take it off after tuning, though that seems less necessary with the Korg. I prefer the Korg I use now to the Snarks I used before (and before that several even cheaper rubbish ones).

The whole point for me of having an electronic tuner is to use when there is background noise such as in dance class or noisy bar/restaurant and I can't hear anything or don't want to amplify tuning up so everyone else can hear it. At home I use a tuning fork and my ears.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2017 14:25:39

Ricardo

Posts: 14801
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to mrstwinkle)

quote:

ORIGINAL: mrstwinkle

Does vibration 100% = frequency to human ear?

No. In the same sense all electromagnetic waves do not equal visible light to the human eye. There is a spectrum we can see, same with our ears, only a small spectrum of frequency vibrations are "pitches" to us....in fact it changes over time. Take that test were children can hear frequencies adults can't, and it gets worse as we get older, losing the high end of the spectrum.

As to original question, we learned decades ago using these devices in noisy clubs that they don't pick up the fundamental pitch well if you play near the bridge using flamenco plucking. You need to pluck the string fairly gently over the soundhole to get the thing to track properly.

Hope that helps.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2017 14:36:48

mark indigo

Posts: 3625
Joined: Dec. 5 2007

RE: Some one explain clip-on tuners ... (in reply to Ricardo)

quote:

As to original question, we learned decades ago using these devices in noisy clubs that they don't pick up the fundamental pitch well if you play near the bridge using flamenco plucking. You need to pluck the string fairly gently over the soundhole to get the thing to track properly.

Another thing I have found is that it if I damp the other strings I am not tuning it seems to help the tuners' ability to lock onto the string I am trying to tune.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2017 19:41:17