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ViejoAmargo

Posts: 39
Joined: Jun. 29 2016
 

Juan Habichuela 

Hello all! Getting into flamenco (although perhaps a bit more biased towards "cante", as I don't have the capacity of playing any musical instrument...!). I thought I'd share this article about JUAN HABICHUELA... Certainly not as well-known as Paco de Lucía, but definitely one of the "great" flamenco guitarists out there... I also found the links (videos or audio in blue / other articles in green) informative. There's quite a few "flamencos" that are well-known in Spain but little known elsewhere. I thought it was interesting getting to know the different styles (in both "cante" and "toque"). It seems to me that most people in North America think only of "Paco de Lucia" when they talk of flamenco (but I may be wrong) so it was interesting to find so many different names in one single article... Enjoy! :-)

http://bit.ly/29n87RG
Juan Habichuela
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 4:58:17
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

quote:

It seems to me that most people in North America think only of "Paco de Lucia" when they talk of flamenco


Or they equate "flamenco" with anything that sounds even remotely Spanish. A few years ago, I jammed with a cabaret singer in Paris. He told me he wanted something flamenco and asked me if I knew how to play "A Dios le pido" by Juanes.
I think you'll find this is not the case here (welcome btw!). Thanks for posting the link. Juan has done some incredible work with Fosforito (the latter is a great place to start for cante).
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 6:59:30
 
ViejoAmargo

Posts: 39
Joined: Jun. 29 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to Piwin

Thanks for the welcome Piwin... You are right, there's a lot misconceptions about flamenco out there (let's just not mention The Gypsy Kings). But now that I think of it, that's part of flamenco's charm: there's so much to learn, so much to discover, and that makes it so interesting and intriguing... And not just from a musical perspective, but also its history, and as a lifestyle, as a way to approach life (apologies for getting philosophical here...) I would expect better from someone in Paris though, as the French in general have a good understanding of flamenco (obviosuly no everyone though )
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 14:26:19
 
RobJe

 

Posts: 732
Joined: Dec. 16 2006
From: UK

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

A well deserved honour!

The history of the Habichuelas/Carmonas is depicted the film: The Flamenco Clan (Herencia Flamenca) [2006]. Juan and brother Pepe left poverty in post-war Granada to try and earn money in the Madrid Tablaos.

You can still purchase this new (or sometimes used).

Rob
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 14:29:28
 
Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

Welcome ViejoAmargo! Great name lol
The foro can get pretty guitar centric but we do our best to keep cante in our topics though.

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\m/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 14:38:36
 
ViejoAmargo

Posts: 39
Joined: Jun. 29 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to RobJe

quote:

ORIGINAL: RobJe

The history of the Habichuelas/Carmonas is depicted the film: The Flamenco Clan (Herencia Flamenca) [2006].


That sounds VERY interesting RobJe, I'll look it up!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 14:50:18
 
ViejoAmargo

Posts: 39
Joined: Jun. 29 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to Leñador

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leñador

The foro can get pretty guitar centric but we do our best to keep cante in our topics though.


Good to know... Flamenco in Spain seems to be mostly about cante, somehow (although in no way they "look down" on baile / guitar) while flamenco in other countries focuses mostly on guitar and baile... It makes perfect sense, though, as in baile and toque there isn't any language barrier. And the Spanish of cante is not just "normal" Spanish, but the Andalusian variety which has all sort of regional slangs and pronunciation oddities... not easy to get around... :-\
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 14:59:23
 
Ricardo

Posts: 15242
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

Juan playing with Paco and Potito:

http://youtu.be/oWBAgc7JxW8

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CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 15:49:31
 
Mark2

Posts: 1945
Joined: Jul. 12 2004
From: San Francisco

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

Actually most Americans have never heard of Paco, and if they have, it's because he played with the trio. Flamenco to most americans is the gipsy kings and ottmar leibert. Fortunately, that is not the case on this forum.




quote:

ORIGINAL: ViejoAmargo

Hello all! Getting into flamenco (although perhaps a bit more biased towards "cante", as I don't have the capacity of playing any musical instrument...!). I thought I'd share this article about JUAN HABICHUELA... Certainly not as well-known as Paco de Lucía, but definitely one of the "great" flamenco guitarists out there... I also found the links (videos or audio in blue / other articles in green) informative. There's quite a few "flamencos" that are well-known in Spain but little known elsewhere. I thought it was interesting getting to know the different styles (in both "cante" and "toque"). It seems to me that most people in North America think only of "Paco de Lucia" when they talk of flamenco (but I may be wrong) so it was interesting to find so many different names in one single article... Enjoy! :-)

http://bit.ly/29n87RG
Juan Habichuela
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 16:07:06
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

quote:

although in no way they "look down" on baile / guitar


Don't be so sure. Either in Spain or elsewhere, you will find people who look down on any given aspect of flamenco, or flamenco from any given period of time. There's plenty of looking-down-on to go around!

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"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 18:57:04
 
ViejoAmargo

Posts: 39
Joined: Jun. 29 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to Piwin

quote:

ORIGINAL: Piwin

Don't be so sure. Either in Spain or elsewhere, you will find people who look down on any given aspect of flamenco, or flamenco from any given period of time. There's plenty of looking-down-on to go around!


Haha, you have a point, so true!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 19:34:39
 
Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

quote:

There's plenty of looking-down-on to go around!

It's hard not to when my cante IS better than your cante. jk

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\m/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 20:07:38
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to Leñador

quote:

It's hard not to when my cante IS better than your cante


Tsk. My jondo kicks your cante's a**! My jondo's gunna Chris Brown the sh** out of your cante. Shh. Ya hear that? That's the sound of your cante shrivelling up in a ball under the blast of my jondo. BOOM
My jondo is the Ali to your Foreman, the Tyson to your Holyfield. My cante is to yours what Game of Thrones is to TV static.
If my jondo was a mountain, it'd be the E-VE-REST. Your mountain would be so small it'd be a hole.
Your cante is the reason we have middle fingers.

Drops mic.

**

what? too far?
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 21:00:28
 
Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo





Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px

Attachment (1)

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 21:14:15
 
BarkellWH

Posts: 3467
Joined: Jul. 12 2009
From: Washington, DC

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to Piwin

quote:

Don't be so sure. Either in Spain or elsewhere, you will find people who look down on any given aspect of flamenco, or flamenco from any given period of time. There's plenty of looking-down-on to go around!


Actually, just how popular is flamenco in Spain, not just parts of Andalucia but in all of Spain? My impression, just anecdotally, is that the majority of Spaniards are indifferent to it. They may or may not look down on it, but they prefer pop, world, and classical music like everyone else. I seem to recall a thread several years ago (I think Anders may have commented, but I don't want to misquote him) that indicated flamenco has little appeal throughout Spain.

Anyone have more anecdotal or other evidence to either confirm or refute the above?

Bill

_____________________________

And the end of the fight is a tombstone white,
With the name of the late deceased,
And the epitaph drear, "A fool lies here,
Who tried to hustle the East."

--Rudyard Kipling
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 21:59:38
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to BarkellWH

quote:

My impression, just anecdotally, is that the majority of Spaniards are indifferent to it


I agree. I'm not aware of any reliable evidence to support this but it is the general feeling I have here.
Flamenco is very much recognized as part of Spanish culture and most people I've talked to know at least about Pdl and Camaron.
That being said, even in Cano Roto, most of the music you hear nowadays in the street, from passing cars or from open apartment windows is either latin music or rumbas revamped with heavy beats. I remember a friend of mine in Salamanca expressing nothing less than hatred for flamenco. But it was part of a broader distaste for gitanos in general, something that is more common and more intense outside of Andalusia. That being said, of the people I've met during my time here in Madrid, I haven't met anyone who looked down on flamenco. Mainly indifference or a kind of polite curiosity about it.
The professional flamenco artists I've met in Spain pretty much all agree that they couldn't do what they're doing without foreigners and the tourism market. There simply aren't enough Spaniards interested in flamenco to book enough shows and pay the bills of a professional artist. And in current times, there is the sense that even those Spaniards who are interested just aren't affluent enough to keep the business going. Of what I've gathered so far, many of the local penas in and around Madrid are in a constant state of competition to obtain regional subsidies. Some of them have either closed or reduced their business to a strict minimum to get by. To be fair though, the entire arts industry is going through a rough patch in Spain, not just flamenco.
So, in a nutshell, I'd have to go with:
- more awareness of flamenco than abroad,
- but mainly indifferent to it.

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"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 29 2016 23:05:05
 
Estevan

Posts: 1942
Joined: Dec. 20 2006
From: Torontolucía

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

Here's an excerpt from the film that RobJe mentioned where you can see Juan dance, which is rather charming:



...and another where he plays (after his brother, and then later with his sons):



(from a different film)...accompanying various restaurant owners and friends of the family:



Piwin mentioned Fosforito - there's a great album of him and Juan.



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Me da igual. La música es música.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 2:35:39
 
ViejoAmargo

Posts: 39
Joined: Jun. 29 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to Piwin

Barkell and Piwin, yes I'd also agreed that flamenco it's not "mainstream" in Spain. I've never been to Spain (yet) but I have a sense that it's something that the majority of the Spanish people (non-flamencos) sort of respect because so many foreigners have an interest to it, but it's not something they would listen to, on a daily basis (if ever...). In that sense, I think there's a big parallel with Blues in the USA... Blues is a genre well respected by serious musicians around the world, but you'd never ever hear Blues on mainstream US radio. Both genres are more like "gourmet music", enjoyed by people for whom music is more than just "having fun" and stuff, people who appreciate the beauty in human souls striving for a measure of happiness, against the harsh realities of poverty and loss. Neither of these two genres are feel-good or "easy listening" (personally I'd think that any "happy"or "fun" blues is not really blues, but I digress...). OK, there's alegrias, rumbas and tanguillos for a happier mood, so I guess my whole point about flamenco reflecting the "harsh realities of poverty and loss" is a bit off...
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 2:52:37
 
Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

Outside of doing flamenco things I never met a single person in Sevilla that liked flamenco and I was there for a month drinking in a lot of bars.

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\m/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 3:25:16
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

quote:

Both genres are more like "gourmet music", enjoyed by people for whom music is more than just "having fun" and stuff


That may be true, to an extent. Bear in mind that flamenco is a "popular" (in the sense of "of the people") form of music. Abroad it has become attached with a certain form of musical elitism, but I don't see this to be the case in Spain. I hear that it is similar with Argentine tango, a popular art form domestically, but rather an elitist art form abroad.
To risk an odd comparison, speedcore isn't mainstream (thank god!) but it is not at all "gourmet music" (probably the opposite of gourmet ).

@Estevan.
Thanks for the vids!

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"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 14:15:07
 
ViejoAmargo

Posts: 39
Joined: Jun. 29 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to Leñador

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leñador

Outside of doing flamenco things I never met a single person in Sevilla that liked flamenco and I was there for a month drinking in a lot of bars.


In Sevilla, of all places! Sad...
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 16:11:19
 
gkealy

 

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Joined: Dec. 12 2015
 

[Deleted] 

Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Jun. 30 2016 21:38:46
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 16:29:13
 
JohnWalshGuitar

Posts: 517
Joined: Aug. 10 2009
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

RIP Juan

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 19:41:10
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to JohnWalshGuitar

I think he's still alive. This is just a celebration of his career. But you got me worried now...

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"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 19:49:08
 
JohnWalshGuitar

Posts: 517
Joined: Aug. 10 2009
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to Piwin

He passed away this evening. Another great gone

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 19:54:15
 
Piwin

Posts: 3566
Joined: Feb. 9 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to JohnWalshGuitar

Sorry to hear that. Thanks for passing on the news.
RIP maestro.

_____________________________

"Anything you do can be fixed. What you cannot fix is the perfection of a blank page. What you cannot fix is that pristine, unsullied whiteness of a screen or a page with nothing on it—because there’s nothing there to fix."
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 19:55:56
 
Leñador

Posts: 5237
Joined: Jun. 8 2012
From: Los Angeles

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

What a terrible coincidence, RIP, he is a legend....

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\m/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 20:05:01
 
ViejoAmargo

Posts: 39
Joined: Jun. 29 2016
 

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

I'm in shock... I just posted this less than two days ago, just can't believe Habichuela is just "gone"... Makes you aware about the gift of life... Well, he left a good, lasting legacy... Rest in Peace...
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 20:08:29
 
BarkellWH

Posts: 3467
Joined: Jul. 12 2009
From: Washington, DC

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to JohnWalshGuitar

A coincidence indeed, as the subject of an active thread. RIP to one of the greats. By my calculation he was 83 years old. At least he lead a long, fruitful life that was not cut short like that of so many other flamencos.

Bill

_____________________________

And the end of the fight is a tombstone white,
With the name of the late deceased,
And the epitaph drear, "A fool lies here,
Who tried to hustle the East."

--Rudyard Kipling
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 20:09:29
 
Escribano

Posts: 6440
Joined: Jul. 6 2003
From: England, living in Italy

RE: Juan Habichuela (in reply to ViejoAmargo

D.E.P Don Juan.

I would listen to you and your brother a lot when I lived in a valley south of Granada, looking up at El Caballo, mostly topped with snow.

In the bitter winters, with seasoned olive wood burning slowly in the fire, I would hug my dog and cry a little. Just because it was all so beautiful.

I will never forget. It's hard to explain to others. Buenos noches y dulces sueños.

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Foro Flamenco founder and Admin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jun. 30 2016 23:44:09
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