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Posts: 1811
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)
Sabicas — Discography
Carrying on from the Flamenco Fever thread, which is getting rather diversified:
OK, this is the best I can do right now. These are all LPs. I won’t vouch for the dates, as you get different stories depending on whom you listen to. Decca LPs, vexatiously, carried no dates anywhere.
Albums available on CD are in green, on MP3 in blue, and unavailable in their entirety (as far as I’m aware) except on LP in red.
1949 Flamencan Guitar Solos 1957 Sabicas Vol. 1 (CD = La Guitarra Flamenca) 1957 Sabicas Vol. 2 (CD = La Guitarra Flamenca) 1958 Sabicas Vol. 3 1958 Gypsy Flamenco 1958 The Day of the Bullfight 1958 Romantic Guitars (with Mario Escudero. CD = Masters of the Spanish Guitar) 1959 Flamenco! (with Carmen Amaya) 1959 Queen of the Gypsies (with Carmen Amaya. MP3 = The Best of Carmen Amaya, Europe only) 1959 Flamenco Puro 1959 Serenata Andaluza (with the usual suspects. MP3 is Europe only) 1959 Solo Flamenco 1959 Fantastic Guitars (with Mario Escudero) 1960 Festival Gitana (with Los Trianeros) 1960 Flamenco Fantasy (CD = Adios a la guitarra. MP3 also available under the original title) 1960 Furioso (with Dolores Vargas. MP3 is Europe only) 1960 Soul of Flamenco (MP3 is Europe only) 1960 Flamenco Variations on Three Guitars 1961 Flamenco Virtuoso 1961 Rhythms of Spain (with the usual suspects) 1961 Flamenco Styles (with Mario Escudero) 1961 El Terremoto Gitano (with Dolores Vargas. MP3 is Europe mono only) 1962 Concierto En Flamenco 1963 Flamenco Reflections¹ 1963 Flaming Flamenco Guitar (MP3 is Europe only) 1965 El Rey del Flamenco 1966 Rock Encounter (with Joe Beck) 1967 Flamenco Fever 1967 Guitars of Passion¹ 1968 Artistry In Flamenco 1969 3 Guitarras Tiene 1969 Arte Gitano 1969 La Historia del Flamenco (with just about everybody, including Camarón. CD = Sabicas, RCA ND 74612) 1969 La Guitarra de Sabicas 1970 Variaciones Flamencas Para Tres Guitarras 1971 The Soul of Flamenco and the Essence of Rock 1972 Flamenco!! 1972 ¡¡Olé!! (with Adela la Chaqueta) 1972 Sabicas In Concert (CD = Concierto Vol. 2, mono only) 1972 Sixteen Immortal Performances (anthology of ABC recordings) 1972 Fiesta Flamenca (with various old-time singers) 1973 Flamenco Passions (2-disc anthology of ABC recordings) 1976 The Art of the Guitar 1990 Nueva York-Granada (with Enrique Morente)
¹ Flamenco Reflections and Guitars of Passion seem to be available on iTunes (but not Amazon) under the bizarre title of Flamenco Guitar - Master of Mid Century Flamenco Music, vols. 1 & 2. The samples of the former appear to be in mono (yecchh!)
maybe taking into account of all those endless re-issues with different names etc.
Those are coming out faster than I can keep track of them — so fast that I can’t help wondering if some of them haven’t gone into the public domain. Let’s face it, Sabas wasn’t the sharpest businessman in the World; and some of the record companies who might have been expected to renew the copyrights when they came due have gone belly-up.
OK, this is the best I can do right now. These are all LPs. I won’t vouch for the dates, as you get different stories depending on whom you listen to. Decca LPs, vexatiously, carried no dates anywhere. Albums available on CD are in green, on MP3 in blue, and unavailable in their entirety (as far as I’m aware) in red.
Thanks for posting your list, the colour coding is a nice touch!
I think Pimientito said he had a lot of Sabicas albums, but I think he is a bit discografried after his PDL epic.
between your list, the other list you posted a link to (which has pics of the LP sleeves), and your Amazon reviews I should be able to figure out what I've got and avoid duplicating anything.
He recorded a lot of LP's, but he does seem to have re-used a lot of material.
Posts: 1811
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to mark indigo)
quote:
I should be able to figure out what I've got and avoid duplicating anything.
I do try to list the sources of everything in my Amazon reviews, but it gets tricky with pieces that have no titles.
quote:
He recorded a lot of LP's, but he does seem to have re-used a lot of material.
Surprisingly little, to my way of thinking. There’s a fair amount of overlap between the Elektra trilogy and Flamenco Puro; and some bulería and colombiana falsetas crop up in several places; but other than that, his creativity seems to me astonishing.
Posts: 1811
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to mark indigo)
Worthwhile CDs other than the LP reissues mentioned previously:
19?? Recital de Guitarra Flamenca, Vols 1 & 2 (Europe only. Solos of mysterious provenance) 19?? Al compás de mi guitarra (with various pre-WWII singers) 1995 Sabicas y los cantaores (with various pre-WWII singers. Little overlap with Al compás) 2008 Flamencan Guitar Solos (all of the 1949 LP plus many more)
Thanks for starting this Paul. I think these discographies are kind of important because its only now on places like Foroflamenco that we can get the afficionado community to catalogue these works.
quote:
I think Pimientito said he had a lot of Sabicas albums, but I think he is a bit discografried after his PDL epic.
Discografried Its not just the solo material either. There are so many cante colaborations both as Sabicas and "El Niño de las Habicas" out there too. Discogs lists 57 Albums and 13 singles/Eps. But we can easily add double that figure with colaboration Lps. http://www.discogs.com/artist/775396-Sabicas
I agree with Paul...there is surprisingly little repeated material compared to say the Paco discography. Sabicas would often go back to the studio and simply record another album rather than reuse tracks. Thats why there are so many variations on Zambra, Alegrias, Bulerias etc. His output and creativity was unbelievable.
Posts: 1811
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
quote:
http://www.discogs.com/artist/775396-Sabicas
Thanks for the link, Mark. Few surprises:
• Ritmos de España is, unsurprisingly, Rhythms of Spain. • Sabicas y su Guitarra Flamenca looks like Sabicas Vol. 1, with tracks 2 & 3 reversed (or maybe mislabelled). • Con las voces de […] is what I’ve called Sabicas. There’s no other title on it. • Guitarra Flamenca (Polydor) is Guitars of Passion (apparently with one track missing). • Génie de la Guitare looked interesting; but it may be Sabicas Vol. 1 with 2 tracks missing.
Surprisingly little, to my way of thinking. There’s a fair amount of overlap between the Elektra trilogy and Flamenco Puro; and some bulería and colombiana falsetas crop up in several places; but other than that, his creativity seems to me astonishing.
_____________________________
Paul Magnussen
Probably he means rehashing or revamping the same falsetas....which he did a lot quite honestly. Not that ALL flamenco players dont' do the same of course, it is just part of the genre.
I have started digging through my collection. I have already found a couple of additions. Here is my dining table so far!
Paul....Im not sure I want to relive that Paco research again but if you want to make a list of material in a similar format to the Paco discography; Solo albums, Singles and EPs, With Mario Escudero, Cante collaborations, appearences in movies etc. I will be happy to add as many additions as I can. I feel you may probably be the most qualified person on the forum to compile Sabicas' Discography.
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Posts: 1811
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
quote:
I feel you may probably be the most qualified person on the forum to compile Sabicas' Discography.
Possibly; but, frankly, I have neither the energy nor the inclination to do an exhaustive study of every edition as you did — especially since I’ve already done a lot of it on Amazon.
And mislabelled reissues are like Space Invaders: the more you shoot down, the faster they come at you.
What would be nice to do — asymptotically, anyway — is to try to nail down every recording.
I’d missed La Guitarra de Sabicas (which is on your table). So that’s added now. All the others in the photograph are, I think, included.
I’ll have a root around and see what else I can find.
Posts: 1811
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
quote:
There are so many cante colaborations both as Sabicas and "El Niño de las Habicas" out there too.
I’m extremely sceptical about all the stuff that’s currently being passed off as Sabas’s early recordings. Concierto, Año 1940-50, for instance, is largely Flamenco Fantasy, from 1960; and Recital Vol. 2, supposedly recorded in 1930–40, is double-tracked! Vol.3, ditto, is simply Sabicas Vol. 2 (1958).
If anyone has questions about specifics, I’ll try to reply.
Probably he means rehashing or revamping the same falsetas....which he did a lot quite honestly.
more or less, yeah, that's what I meant, but having shot my mouth off about it and been challenged I doubt myself until I go back and listen again to see what gave me that impression in the first place and if I can back it up (which is no bad thing in itself).
Posts: 1811
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
Some of the old singers that Sabas accompanied on record:
Angelillo Calderas de Salamanca El Carbonerillo (Manuel Vega) El Chato de Las Ventas El Pena Hijo (José Muñoz Martín) Estrellito Castro Juanito Valderrama Niña de La Puebla Niño de La Calzada Niño de Utrera Rafael Farina Ramón de Cádiz Simón Serrano
What would be nice to do — asymptotically, anyway — is to try to nail down every recording.
You mean list every track rather than every edition and reissue. That would certainly be a very useful resource.
My experience has been that in order to find all the stray tracks you have to sift through an enormous quantity of recordings.
How many albums then from your original list would you say are completely different from each other..ie not reissues of earlier tracks? I reckon we are talking at least 30 albums of original material right?
Posts: 1811
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
quote:
My experience has been that in order to find all the stray tracks you have to sift through an enormous quantity of recordings.
Yes indeed.
quote:
How many albums then from your original list would you say are completely different from each other..ie not reissues of earlier tracks?
All of them, at least nominally*: that was the point. The only exception I can think of right now is a few pieces that he explicitly recorded several times. e.g. Zapateado en Re, Lecuona’s Malagueña and Guadalquivir (aka Capricho andaluz).
Incidentally, I’ve now replaced the discography on Wikipedia (which was very partial), and added a link to Thrashdeathbanger’s discography.
*Except Sixteen Immortal Performances and Flamenco Passions, obviously.
Posts: 1811
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
quote:
u mean list every track rather than every edition and reissue. That would certainly be a very useful resource.
It seems, however, to be a bit like the task of Sisyphus. All kinds of obscure things come out when you start rooting around.
For instance, had you heard of Anita Sevilla? She's listed as accompanied by Sabicas on a compilation called Cantes, Cantos y Músicas de la Segunda República Española, and the date of the recording is given as 1942!
But Sabas was touring South America with Carmen Amaya then, right? Right: it seems that she was with Carmen’s company.
Listen to this! The recording’s rough, but the picados (especially) sound like Sabas to me…
Then there’s Niño de Orellana, whom I’m still trying to chase down…
All kinds of obscure things come out when you start rooting around
Thats how it starts...an Mp3 here, an obscure reference there, a mention on an old recording....and before you know it you have the largest collection of Sabicas recordings on the planet !!
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
Ok...i had a good look through my shelves and boxes. I found 6 more albums. You already listed "Furioso" and "El Rey del Flamenco"
My LP of furioso is credited as Anita Ramos and not Dolores Vargas as you have listed. The original recording is on the DECCA label. My version shown here is a re-issue on the BRUNSWICK Label from 1964.
My version of El Rey del Flamenco is on the HISPAVOX label and dated 1967.
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RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
"Sabicas y su Guitarra Flamenca" 1970 appears to be a compilation of earlier tracks on the MONTILLA label. EDIT- I have just seen you identified it as Sabicas Vol.1.
"Tres Guitarras tiene Sabicas" from 1969 is already on your list.
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RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
You have "la historia del flamenco" from 1969 on your list. I think I have the vinyl version here. Its a double LP simply called Sabicas. It has 18 tracks including a fandangos with Camaron "Entre Valverde y Huelva" and a bunch of other cante tracks with Juan Cantero, Manuel Soto, Rafael Romero etc. The back of the LP says it was produced in 1969 on RCA records. This version is from 1990 on the BMG ARIOLA label.
The last LP I found is a Japanese Edition on the HISPAVOX label. M. Torroba/ Sabicas -Concierto Flamenco Recital de Guitarra por Sabicas
The credits on the reverse are all in Japanese so I cant give you any more information on this recording.
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Posts: 1811
Joined: Nov. 8 2010
From: London (living in the Bay Area)
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
quote:
My LP of furioso is credited as Anita Ramos and not Dolores Vargas as you have listed. The original recording is on the DECCA label. My version shown here is a re-issue on the BRUNSWICK Label from 1964.
It’s a different album (more record-company imbecility: the guitarist on the cover is neither Sabas nor Mario, and the girl is not Anita).
It’s a compilation from their Fantastic Guitars, and Mario’s Viva Flamenco!, right?
Your discography does a pretty good job of listing all the albums but to make it more complete I thought I would have a go at listing the 7 inch EPs of Sabicas over the Christmas holidays. Discogs lists 13 EPs but this is not a complete list. I started off by identifying these recordings.
La Guitarra De Sabicas (7"EP) 1964 BRUNSWICK 10 728 EPB
Homenaje A Carmen Amaya / El Bohio / Los Puertos / Nostalgia Gitana (7"EP) 1969 RCA VICTOR 3-21089
Angelillo, Niño Sabicas* - "Canta Un Preso" / "Por La Mañana Rosío" / "Y Ví Mi Madre Llorando" (Shellac, 10") PARLAPHON, Parlophon B. 26.646-I, B. 26.646-II
Flamenco Fantasy (7"EP) MGM Records EPF mgm 93
Sabicas, Dolores Vargas And Los Compañeros Del Flamenco - Furioso! (7" EP) POLYDOR 21 558 EPH
Guitarra De Fuego (7", EP) MONTILLA, Barclay 27.013
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We already listed Flamenco Virtuoso Vol.4. I found copies of volumes 1 and 2. the index number to volume 3 is also listed on the backs of the EPs. The correct date is 1960 for all 4 volumes.
RE: Sabicas — Discography (in reply to Pimientito)
Here are 2 more EPs. The first is an unlisted French edition of flamenco puro. (from volumes 1 and 2) It contains the tracks Ecos Jerezanos, Campina Andaluza, Duelo de Campanas and Brisas del la Caleta.
The second EP (also French) is listed and comprises of Classical works by Monti, Lecuona, Rimsky-Korsakoff and Tarrega. Both are undated.
Flamenco Pur (7" EP) HISPAVOX 27 508 (FRANCE)
Guitarra de Fuego (7" EP) BARCLAY-MONTILLA 27 013 (FRANCE)
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