Foro Flamenco
Posts Since Last Visit | Advanced Search | Home | Register | Login

Today's Posts | Inbox | Profile | Our Rules | Contact Admin | Log Out



Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.
This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvir, Philip John Lee and Craig Eros who went ahead of us too soon.
We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.





Felipe and Mariano making the same guitars?   You are logged in as Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >>Discussions >>General >> Page: [1] 2 3    >   >>
Login
Message<< Newer Topic  Older Topic >>
 
HolyEvil

Posts: 1239
Joined: Nov. 6 2008
From: Sydney, Australia

Felipe and Mariano making the same g... 

Are the brothers still making guitars together or buying the guitars from the same place?

http://www.flamencoguitarsforsale.net/en/flamenco-guitars/new-flamenco-guitars/f-conde-deposito-rosas-en.html

http://www.flamencoguitarsforsale.net/en/flamenco-guitars/new-flamenco-guitars/mariano-rosas-anton-2013-en.html

these guitars look exactly the same, except for the label, same rosette, bridge tie, bindings etc.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 22 2013 23:23:16

C. Vega

 

Posts: 379
Joined: Jan. 16 2004
 

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to HolyEvil

Now that's funny.
Are people really that stupid? (Not you, HolyEvil...them!)
The Conde smokescreen continues.

I suppose we could give los hermanos some credit for "originality". One guitar is listed as having a 650mm scale and the other is 665mm. And the photos do show different tuning machines.

And yet there are people who continue to believe that these clowns actually make these guitars themselves.
Sad.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 22 2013 23:38:01
 
aeolus

Posts: 765
Joined: Oct. 30 2009
From: Mier

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to C. Vega

I wonder if these guitars are made by Marlon Navarro. That first certainly sounds like my MN Conde copy. Could be...
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 12:40:18
 
tele

Posts: 1462
Joined: Aug. 17 2012
 

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to aeolus

I think they make guitars in both felipe conde and mariano conde shops(at least they seem to have tools and woods there), but I don't think they make them in address of felipe V at least these days. I also played a 9000euro conde from felipe V 2011 and man it sounded poor for the money and the top had wider grain than 500 euro guitar.

The felipe conde primera guitars cost over 10 000 euro on their website, if they make them in valencia or something like that then man that sucks.

_____________________________

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 12:47:35

C. Vega

 

Posts: 379
Joined: Jan. 16 2004
 

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to HolyEvil

I've been in numerous guitar shops in Spain that had wood and tools but there were no guitars actually made in them. It's all for show and visitors are, for the most part, largely clueless.
The Conde brothers didn't actually make their guitars in the shop at Felipe V either. It also had wood and tools but when asked they claimed that the workshop itself was located elsewhere (the proverbial "undisclosed location" I suppose). There was a small room in the rear of the shop, staged to look more or less like an actual workshop to the uninitiated, with wood, tools and a couple of unfinished guitars.
When someone would come in the shop one or both of the brothers, dressed up in their "work clothes", would go to one of the benches and make believe they were actually doing some work on a guitar. I made a few visits there over a period of several years and I would be willing to bet that the same two unfinished guitars were on those workbenches at each visit.
All part of the smokescreen.
According to friends in Madrid, one or both or the brothers were almost always in that little shop so it kinda makes one wonder just who was actually making the guitars.

There was another shop, now closed, on the Cuesta de Gomerez in Granada that was operated by a guy named Antonio Morales. He had a workbench, tools and a few other trappings one might expect to see in a guitar making shop. He tried to look the part by dressing up in a working costume.
I think that his father may have actually been a guitar maker of sorts (according to the Romanillos book he was actually a policeman by profession) but in talking to this guy it quickly became apparent to me that he himself had probably never made an instrument in his entire life.

I can name others.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 13:38:04
 
Ricardo

Posts: 13246
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to HolyEvil

they look the same. Probably sound and feel similar I would guess. Same look as the ones from Felipe V of the 90's. I dont' really care if they are made by head hunting cannibals in indonesia, these instruments are freakin awesome and only non playing idiots bad mouth em.

Ricardo

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 14:51:39
 
RobJe

 

Posts: 727
Joined: Dec. 16 2006
From: UK

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to tele

quote:

but I don't think they make them in address of felipe V


Felipe V No 2 is now a dancewear shop. They sell tights made in Valencia.

OK, I made the last bit up.

quote:

There was another shop, now closed, on the Cuesta de Gomerez in Granada that was operated by a guy named Antonio Morales. He had a workbench, tools and a few other trappings one might expect to see in a guitar making shop. He also liked to dress up in a working costume.


Yeah - I visited this shop and the guy got annoyed when I indicated (politely) that I didn't like a guitar (the best they could offer apparently).

I guess we all hate the lies but some guitarists apparently like the Conde guitars!

Rob
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 14:52:12
 
tri7/5

 

Posts: 547
Joined: May 5 2012
 

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to HolyEvil

If you check Mariano Conde's website, he's definitely trying to show that he's a shop and guitars are being made there with all the tops and necks laying around. Who knows the truth though.

Here's another little gem, if you check Dan Zeff's website there is an Atocha Conde and Felipe V conde that basically look exactly alike from the 90's. Both Conde orange. Even the rosette is pretty much the same. Either they were copying each others rosettes and style, buying pre-made rosettes, or they were built in the same place.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 15:15:21
 
Arash

Posts: 4433
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to HolyEvil

ahhh the never ending conde subject..
got to visit Jordi in Terrassa soon .... some yummy yummy Condes in their inventory..

here is one of my favourites , 90s Conde from Carlos de Jacoba
but i bet it will be sold soon


_____________________________

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 16:32:22
 
keith

Posts: 1108
Joined: Sep. 29 2009
From: Land of Daniel Boone

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to Arash

arash, i am at work which means my foro time is filtered, hence no videos (gee i wonder why the i.t. dept. did that?). missed the banana and orange video from last friday. yeah, the conde saga continues. to throw in a wrench into this, there are conde estudios floating around (they actually say estudio). i had one many years ago--great beach guitar. i believe there is one for sale at the bay and the seller is trying to get low end (estudios without the word estudio on the label) prices.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 16:45:51
 
Arash

Posts: 4433
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to keith

quote:

ORIGINAL: keith

arash, i am at work which means my foro time is filtered, hence no videos (gee i wonder why the i.t. dept. did that?). missed the banana and orange video from last friday. yeah, the conde saga continues. to throw in a wrench into this, there are conde estudios floating around (they actually say estudio). i had one many years ago--great beach guitar. i believe there is one for sale at the bay and the seller is trying to get low end (estudios without the word estudio on the label) prices.


maybe its a "conde filter" in your work place.
you should develop a game theory solution for "the conde dilemma" soon.

yeah there is this guy trying to sell a student conde atocha 53 for 8K or something since a long time ...

_____________________________

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 17:16:56
 
orsonw

Posts: 1498
Joined: Jul. 4 2009
From: London

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to Arash

quote:

got to visit Jordi in Terrassa soon .... some yummy yummy Condes in their inventory..

here is one of my favourites , 90s Conde from Carlos de Jacoba


I've met Jordi a few times, my experience of him personally and as a dealer is very good.

I have played that 1990 Conde, in my opinion it is very good but not quite as good as Jose Maria Bandera's 1984 Conde!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 17:20:53
 
Arash

Posts: 4433
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to orsonw

quote:

ORIGINAL: orsonw

quote:

got to visit Jordi in Terrassa soon .... some yummy yummy Condes in their inventory..

here is one of my favourites , 90s Conde from Carlos de Jacoba


I've met Jordi a few times, my experience of him personally and as a dealer is very good.

I have played that 1990 Conde, in my opinion it is very good but not quite as good as Jose Maria Bandera's 1984 Conde!


That one is "reserved"
http://www.flamencoguitarsforsale.net/en/flamenco-guitars/used-flamenco-guitars/conde84-bandera-en.html

_____________________________

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 17:37:34
 
keith

Posts: 1108
Joined: Sep. 29 2009
From: Land of Daniel Boone

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to Arash

a conde that actually says estudio but priced about twice, if not more, than what it is worth :


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Conde-Hermanos-Guitar-Madrid-Spain-Classical-Flamenco-Wonderful-Sustain-/190929431431?pt=Guitar&hash=item2c7447eb87
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 18:01:53
 
aeolus

Posts: 765
Joined: Oct. 30 2009
From: Mier

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to C. Vega

This is to inform you, C. Vega, that a fatwa has been issued on you due to your heretical postings.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 18:10:41
 
krichards

Posts: 597
Joined: Jan. 14 2007
From: York, England

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to C. Vega

quote:

There was another shop, now closed, on the Cuesta de Gomerez in Granada that was operated by a guy named Antonio Morales. He had a workbench, tools and a few other trappings one might expect to see in a guitar making shop. He tried to look the part by dressing up in a working costume.
I think that his father may have actually been a guitar maker of sorts (according to the Romanillos book he was actually a policeman by profession) but in talking to this guy it quickly became apparent to me that he himself had probably never made an instrument in his entire life.


I have a Morales in my workshop, waiting for some tlc. Its not signed and the label is stuck on top of another label. Obviously bought in.
I was going to make a post to find out more about this guy, but you've saved me the trouble. thanks.

_____________________________

Kevin Richards

http://www.facebook.com/#!/kevin.richards.1048554
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 18:29:31
 
HolyEvil

Posts: 1239
Joined: Nov. 6 2008
From: Sydney, Australia

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to C. Vega

quote:

ORIGINAL: C. Vega

Now that's funny.
Are people really that stupid? (Not you, HolyEvil...them!)
The Conde smokescreen continues.

I suppose we could give los hermanos some credit for "originality". One guitar is listed as having a 650mm scale and the other is 665mm. And the photos do show different tuning machines.



lol i didn't mean physically building, I meant still in business together, but outwardly, they look like they split.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 22:15:08
 
bernd

 

Posts: 680
Joined: Feb. 15 2004
 

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to HolyEvil

A good friend of mine told me that Felipe and Mariano had a struggle that endet up in a hard fight of flying fists. Subject was Mariano´s rejection against Felipe´s intention to let some guitars produce in China.

_____________________________

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 22:18:01
 
HolyEvil

Posts: 1239
Joined: Nov. 6 2008
From: Sydney, Australia

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to HolyEvil

btw.. does the conde brothers actually know how to make guitars and are they guitars they physically make any good at all?
I'll never buy conde unless it's priced really low.. never know what we'll get.
I played a conde priced at 14k here in sydney and it's deader than a yamaha.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 22:20:33
Guest

[Deleted] (in reply to Ricardo

[Deleted by Admins]
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 23 2013 23:45:27
 
Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006
 

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to aeolus

quote:

This is to inform you, C. Vega, that a fatwa has been issued on you due to your heretical postings.


I think you should explain what you mean with this.
If its a joke, I dont find it to be funny at all.

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2013 7:03:05
 
Arash

Posts: 4433
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to Guest

quote:

ORIGINAL: nealf

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ricardo
these instruments are freakin awesome and only non playing idiots bad mouth em.

Ricardo


Only idiots call other people idiots.
Grow up Ricardo, or has all the adulation on the foro gone to your head and inflated your ego??


come on nealf,
how many threads did we have about this and how many times were those who somehow like these guitars called stupid one way or another? one example is right here in this thread. So that seams to be totally ok since its general consensus in the internet world, but first time in years ol Richard giving tit for tat, instead of his usual rational posts makes you wanne make him look like an arrogant ****? ... be fair.

There is this quite remarkable discrepancy between the internet coffee klatch world where everybody seam to know what Felipes wife was doing in her
kitchen and which type of underwear Mariano prefers in his fake workshop and how Felipes son kicked Marianos son in to his balls, etc. and the real world where actually almost all good players play one of these axes and some a Reyes and some both and other players some other makers, and nobody gives a damn about any other irrelevant subject other than picking up a guitar, play it, like or dislike it and buy it or leave it.

I was one of those who disliked these guitars because (1) I couldn't play (I still can't, but at least passed the level where I understand why most players prefer these guitars) , and (2) because everybody on internet were saying these guitars are crap and plastic toys, so i simply believed everything and repeated what I heard from others, until repeated first hand experience with better technical skills and understanding than few years ago.

Thiese conde threads are always almost like political threads.
Better to simply keep out of them from now on, since people always end up as a friend or foe, nothing inbetween

_____________________________

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2013 7:45:52
 
tele

Posts: 1462
Joined: Aug. 17 2012
 

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to Arash

Conde's are a bit like wine the older the better I think, in the end we have a domingo esteso

_____________________________

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2013 11:36:21
 
keith

Posts: 1108
Joined: Sep. 29 2009
From: Land of Daniel Boone

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to HolyEvil

maybe delineating conde the guitar from conde the business practice might resolve some issues.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2013 12:24:24
 
avimuno

 

Posts: 598
Joined: Feb. 9 2007
From: Paris, France

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to HolyEvil

Just my 2 cents... I visited Felipe's shop a few years back, Mariano and him had just spit up then. I walked in and was greeted by a very nice guy who was in fact doing some luthier work in the shop itself. He was glueing the fretboards on the necks, and had about eight necks and fretboards lying around ready to be glued. He was really nice, offered me a cup of coffee and invited me to sit and watch him work whilst I waited for Felipe Conde to arrive.

There was also a lot of wood lying around (I recognized some rosewood and cypress) like in a real guitar making workshop, so I thought that they probably made some guitars there itself. But I am in no way an expert, so it could all just be some of the basic building processes that were being handled there.

I tried some of the guitars they had on display, and a couple from a stash Felipe kept in a corner... all good guitars, and an exceptional one he was keeping for Daniel Caseres.

I also wanted to visit Mariano, but did not have enough time unfortunately.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2013 12:36:20
 
Arash

Posts: 4433
Joined: Aug. 9 2006
From: Iran (living in Germany)

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to avimuno

quote:

ORIGINAL: avimuno
I tried some of the guitars they had on display, and a couple from a stash Felipe kept in a corner... all good guitars, and an exceptional one he was keeping for Daniel Caseres.

I also wanted to visit Mariano, but did not have enough time unfortunately.


I played these guitars in this video, my fav. was the orange blanca



and to keep this thread kicking, here you can see the actual builders of these guitars sitting together and planning the next evil steps .. muaaaaahahahahahaa




anyway, I yet have to play Mariano's... I assume they are not much different.

_____________________________

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2013 13:36:33
 
aeolus

Posts: 765
Joined: Oct. 30 2009
From: Mier

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to Anders Eliasson

quote:

I think you should explain what you mean with this.
If its a joke, I dont find it to be funny at all.


I can't imagine how anyone might think I was describing an actual fatwa
and that C.Vega like Rushdie would have to go into seclusion to avoid being murdered for what he wrote.
On the other hand if you were offended by what you might consider a slighting of Islam, I couldn't care less as any religion that would issue such a thing as a fatwa doesn't deserve respect.

.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2013 14:56:13
 
gj Michelob

Posts: 1531
Joined: Nov. 7 2008
From: New York City/San Francisco

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to Ricardo

quote:

these instruments are freakin awesome and only non playing idiots bad mouth em.
Ricardo


Amen....

And Merry Christmas, y'all.

_____________________________

gj Michelob
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2013 15:25:02
 
Anders Eliasson

Posts: 5780
Joined: Oct. 18 2006
 

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to aeolus

aeolus
Thanks for comming back and explaining.
I hope you can understand that sometimes language can be an issue on a foro like this. And culture is always an issue. Culture can be very difficult to understand and sometimes even impossible.
In the country where I was born and lived most of my life some dude trying to be funny made some sarcastical muhammed drawings and the reactions were very violent, so I take these kind of things serious and I dont find them to be funny.

_____________________________

Blog: http://news-from-the-workshop.blogspot.com/
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2013 15:33:03
 
mark indigo

 

Posts: 3324
Joined: Dec. 5 2007
 

RE: Felipe and Mariano making the sa... (in reply to HolyEvil

quote:

I'll never buy conde unless it's priced really low.. never know what we'll get.


I don't understand comments like this. Unless you're going to buy a guitar without trying it first. I don't understand why anyone would do that....

when you try a guitar and it sounds great and plays easy then what is the problem?

I had the great fortune to buy a great conde earlier this year. The best guitar I have owned.

I saw it advertised and assumed it would sell real fast so I didn't bother to respond.

A few weeks later it was still for sale so I assumed it was maybe no good.

A few weeks later it was still there so I decided I had to at least go check it out. I took my girlfriend and she was amazed at how good it sounded. It played beautifully, really easy to play.
I had to buy it really, as it was mint condition at a realistic (ie. less than half new) price.
I don't really care who actually made it, or where.
It is a beautiful top quality flamenco guitar, and a dream to play every single day.

Maybe these loony conde-hate threads contributed to the fact that this media luna had been advertised for sale for weeks on end and I was the only person to even go and look at it....

Thank you Conde-haters. Just keep talking 'em down and maybe soon I will be able to pick up another spectacular bargain!

_____________________________

  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Dec. 24 2013 16:27:21
Page:   [1] 2 3    >   >>
All Forums >>Discussions >>General >> Page: [1] 2 3    >   >>
Jump to:

New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software powered by ASP Playground Advanced Edition 2.0.5
Copyright © 2000 - 2003 ASPPlayground.NET

0.0625 secs.