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turnermoran

Posts: 391
Joined: Feb. 6 2010
 

palmas/foot question 

The other day I took a workshop with someone who stated that as a matter of practice, the foot is always involved in palmas, and marks the basic compás.

In bulerias, he had foot on 12-3-7-8-10.

In tangos, foot on 1.

Palmas filled in remaining beats, contras, with various patterns that were shown.

Granted, this was a basic palmas workshop, but my question is:

1) would you guys agree?
2) is it any different when you have cajon or drums, etc? (is there no more point since the foot sound is lost next to the much louder other percussion instruments)

Any discussion on your experiences with how the foot is involved when performing palmas appreciated.
(lastly, I should mention, this fella did not say the purpose of the foot is to help the palmero from getting lost, but rather to provide an audible sound that marks compás and is key to the over all sound a palmero would be trying to create)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 14 2012 18:02:02
 
xirdneH_imiJ

Posts: 1922
Joined: Dec. 2 2006
From: Budapest, now in Southampton

RE: palmas/foot question (in reply to turnermoran

if you're doing palmas in a fiesta, the foot becomes double important...but basically you have to mark the main beat, which most often is silent palmas-wise in flamenco...like in bulerías you mark the 12 with the foot, then clap the rest until 6 comes, you mark again...and 1 in tangos (sometimes 3 too)

but be aware that accenting the 6-8-10 or 7-8-10 in bulerías will only work in certain cases, when all parties are aware of the accents, in most fiesta like situations that will not work, in fact it will screw up the whole party...it can be very-very frustrating for dancer and guitarist alike...in fact it's always the first thing i say to dancers...
the basic and most versatile rhythm for bulerías is repeating the 12-1-2-3-4-5 over and over, marking 12 with the foot, clapping the rest (12) 1and 2 3 4 5

maybe Ricardo will give his opinion as he's more experienced, but i wouldn't think it should change anything when you have percussive instruments around...in fact then the palmas should stay just basic and you give more freedom for the cajón player...
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 14 2012 19:14:58
 
turnermoran

Posts: 391
Joined: Feb. 6 2010
 

RE: palmas/foot question (in reply to xirdneH_imiJ

Thanks Jimi.
That's kinda what I thought.
The flexible palmas pattern for bulerias is well documented here, and while maybe the most useful or common, it wasn't discussed at the workshop. But I think that was because the guy assumed many of the participants where totally unfamiliar w/ 12 beat compas and wanted to get everyone feeling that
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 14 2012 19:36:50
 
xirdneH_imiJ

Posts: 1922
Joined: Dec. 2 2006
From: Budapest, now in Southampton

RE: palmas/foot question (in reply to turnermoran

that's a common problem, i have no clue why that is...2x6 is much simpler and gives a more solid base which you can later build on, like accenting the 7-8 or 6-8...just make sure you're good at that before you start varying things...

it's also important to learn Jaleo style palmas because they very often start out with that - 12 1and 2 3and 4 5 (1 and 3 are not clapped only the contras)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 14 2012 19:49:32
 
veet

 

Posts: 231
Joined: Nov. 29 2004
From: L.A.

RE: palmas/foot question (in reply to turnermoran

While it is not "incorrect" to do bulerias foot 12,3,7-8,10, watch performances of palmeros and guitarists: The feet are most often just doing twos, 12,2,4,6,8,10 as if walking. The accents are provided by the palmas in between.
Jerez bulerias are clapped in sixes, accent on 3 and 9.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 14 2012 20:50:43
 
Ricardo

Posts: 15030
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: palmas/foot question (in reply to veet

quote:

ORIGINAL: veet

While it is not "incorrect" to do bulerias foot 12,3,7-8,10, watch performances of palmeros and guitarists: The feet are most often just doing twos, 12,2,4,6,8,10 as if walking. The accents are provided by the palmas in between.
Jerez bulerias are clapped in sixes, accent on 3 and 9.


I concur.

_____________________________

CD's and transcriptions available here:
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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Nov. 15 2012 12:17:28
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