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Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

Perfect set-up? 
I'm having a guitar made and I wondered what the best string height down at the bridge should be? (clear space from top to under side of strings).
My Ramirez is about 8mm and this feels just perfect, but sometimes playing picado, I play through the strings and hit the soundboard, but I guess that's why the golpeador runs right through below the strings. Any views?
Cheers
Jim.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 28 2003 18:45:52
 
gerundino63

Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Jim Opfer) 
Hi Jim!

I have found some nice articles about guitarbuilding, and when you scroll down, under
"playability"you will see something about string hights.

greetings Peter.

p.s. Just to be curious, where do you let it build, and what kind of wood?

http://www.fernandezmusic.com/Judging%20guitar%20quality.html

greetings again!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 28 2003 19:15:21
 
Thomas Whiteley

 

Posts: 786
Joined: Jul. 8 2003
From: San Francisco Bay Area

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Jim Opfer) 
Jim;

I have seen many guitars that had golpeador’s installed when they were two pieces. Beneath the strings the guitar was not protected. Some guitars which are today priceless, had most of the wood clawed out between the strings. I thought it was bears! But it was just a flamenco guitarist at work! Who needs wood when you are having fun?

The newer one piece golpeador’s protect guitars from bears and flamenco guitarists.

_____________________________

Tom
http://home.comcast.net/~flamencoguitar/flamenco.html
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 29 2003 0:53:14
 
Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to gerundino63) 
Hi Peter,
It will be a blanca with spruce top and I've had it on order from Stephen Hill, www.flamencoguitar.co.uk for over a year now, she's due to arrive sometime later this year.
Measure your Gerundino for me and let me know the dimension, my Gerundino was higher.
Cheers
Jim.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 29 2003 7:05:47
 
Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Thomas Whiteley) 
Hi Tom,
Ooch..! Bears?
No, it's to do with havind a low action and the damage is just a fact of life.
What height are the strings on your guitar? I'd be interested to know and what maker?
Cheers
Jim.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 29 2003 7:10:07
 
gerundino63

Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Jim Opfer) 
Hi Jim,

well, that looks like nice guitars!
The wood is beauliful, nice silk patterns!
I measured my gerundino, although I don't have the proper tools, I measured
at the 12th fret about 3.4 for the 1e string and 3.6 for the 6e string.
It is a little higher than discribed in the article, but on a 660 scale you have more
amplitude? ( I think so , but I am not sure of it)

Annyway, it buzzes when I want, and it do not when I don't want.

Your guitar comes later this year, so you are seeing a wunderful winter in front of you then!

Greetings, Peter.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 29 2003 9:56:25
 
Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to gerundino63) 
Hi Peter,
Yes, Stephen Hill guitars are great.
I was thinking more about the height of the strings above the soundboard down at the bridge saddle. In flamencos, this dimension is low compared to classical guitars and if you ever look at an old guitar and it's not clear if it was made as a classical or a flamenco, then the height of the strings at the bridge is a good way of knowing as it never varies.
To measure, take a piece of paper, stand it up from the sound board just at the bridge and mark a line to equal the height of the strings and then measure the distance in mm.
I'd be interested to know what it is on your Gerundino. the height might be different between 1st and 6th. Don't need to be too accurate.
Cheers
Jim.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 30 2003 9:33:00
 
gerundino63

Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Jim Opfer) 
Hi Jim.

I measured 8mm at the bridge, at the 6th string.

greetings, Peter.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 30 2003 10:30:12
 
Paul Bruhns

 

Posts: 77
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
 

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Jim Opfer) 
Jim:

No way! you have got to be joking, man! I have found no way is it possible to hit the top between the strings when playing a picado. I am trying as hard as I can to stick my fingers down between the strings between picado strokes, and the angle of attack makes it impossible to do this.

Your fingers should rest on the next lower string, if you do it correctly. IF your fingers were to hit the top (between the strings) during picado... your picado would be OVER! LOL

Tell me you are kidding!

Paul
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 30 2003 23:25:44
 
Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Jim Opfer) 
There are some brutal players out there, huh Paul? I would never treat my guitar like that!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 31 2003 1:18:49
 
Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Paul Bruhns) 
No serious Paul,
For a time my Ramirez set up was 7mm and that was just too low, now it's 8mm and I'm through to the top only now and again.
The strings on a guitar would have to be pretty high if you never did this or your picado technique must have an element of tirando!
I'd like to know the dimension on your guitar.
Cheers
Jim.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 31 2003 16:23:53
 
Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to gerundino63) 
There you are Peter, a perfect set-up on your Gerundino.
Cheers
Jim.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 31 2003 16:25:33
 
Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Miguel de Maria) 
Hay Michael,
'Brutal' that's a wee bit strong, it dosen't happen all the time and you have to remember that your guitar is only a vehicle for you to use!
Cheers
Jim.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 31 2003 16:30:06
 
Paul Bruhns

 

Posts: 77
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
 

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Jim Opfer) 
Jim:

I've heard samples of your playing, so I know you are are very competent guitarist! I will gladly post the set-up on my guitars just as soon as I can go out and purchase a micrometer. I have a Gerundino Blanca, a Conde Hermanos AF-25, a Jose Lopez Bellido FC-1a (Brazilian), and a Pedro Contreras Valbuena "cebra" (Brazilian and Flamed Maple in a stripe pattern) which is a cross between a Flamenco and a Classical.

Coincidentally, the Jose Bellido has a wider string spacing at the bridge (at least it feels that way) and I can feel my fingers going deeper between the strings on picado as compared to the other guitars. I think that dimension might be the critical one.

Also, as a point of interest (to me anyway :-)) is that Pedro Contreras Valbuena was a foreman at Ramirez, during the Ramirez III era. His action is high for Flamenco, and there is very little buzzing, and I hesitate to lower it because the guitar is so resonant as it is. It's not a "bulerias" guitar if you know what I mean, but I play flamenco, so to me it's a flamenco guitar!!!

Cheers, Jim

Paul
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Aug. 31 2003 19:29:43
 
Jim Opfer

Posts: 1876
Joined: Jul. 19 2003
From: Glasgow, Scotland.

RE: Perfect set-up? (in reply to Paul Bruhns) 
Hi Paul,
That's a nice brace of guitars you have there.
One of my guitars is a Montero y Bellido (Manuel not Jose). It's signed by Antonio Marin Montero, it's dated 1968, the one year the two makers shared a shop and a lable.
It's a flamenco negra with Rio back and sides. This guitar has a wide string spacing a bit like your Jose Bellido and measures 63mm accross the strings at the bridge. The extra 3mm makes a big difference and the guitar takes a wee bit of getting used too.
How does 63mm compare to Jose's?
Cheers
Jim.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Sep. 1 2003 0:41:18
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