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cathulu

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec. 15 2006
From: Vancouver, Canukistan

New Beginners Challenge? 

OK, so the big guns have the composition thing to play with, I think we need a new beginners challenge to keep moving us beginners forward.

I really liked Ron's bulerias falseta in the missionary position, I think that would make good challenge material. Here is the link. http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=116695&p=1&tmode=1&smode=1

So that we don't overlap with the composition challenge, we should close ours around Jan 31.

Yes, it is a little more than 3 months away, but that will give lots of time and prevent any challenge fatigue from overwhelming judges etc, with the potential danger of a bit a lethargy until the final few weeks. Especially with the upcoming holiday season, I think we will need all the time we can get!

So, is there anymore interest in something like this? We can sort out the rules etc if there is sufficient interest. Suffice to say you will have to perform against a compas track.

Anyone? I will be willing to organize this one.

Any thoughts much appreciated. Perhaps there is too much happening. However, I think we beginners are the ones that need all the help and motivation we can get.

Cheers Everyone.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 11 2009 18:49:59
 
minordjango

 

Posts: 918
Joined: Feb. 26 2005
 

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to cathulu

i think we mentioned that before amigo ..........excellent man youi remind all .

i think something like a few cycles of the bulerias compass with rons falsetta, then a closing compass, a short piece but yet a good intro to the bulerias for us beginners .

i still cant add up fee the beat on it !!

going to burn my guitar (a la hendrix !)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 12 2009 4:31:09
 
Louis_B

 

Posts: 71
Joined: Mar. 22 2009
 

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to cathulu

I would be very pleased to join in with this challenge.

quote:

Suffice to say you will have to perform against a compas track.

I promise to this time.

I really like Ron's falseta - would it be too greedy to suggest that another falseta is added to lengthen the piece and add to the challenge?

I have karate grading in November and classical guitar grading in December so Jan 31 is fine for me


Louis_B
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 12 2009 11:03:35
 
cathulu

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec. 15 2006
From: Vancouver, Canukistan

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Louis_B

OK, well Ron's performance is 50 seconds thereabouts. I don't think I will be able to play it his speed, so maybe it will be around 60 seconds.

Any ideas for another bulerias falseta to extend this piece to about two minutes?

I also think it would be nice to include some compas on the Bb chord with pull offs from f to e the high e string.

I will look around, but any suggestions greatly appreciated. We need to keep things relatively easy yet sounding good and in character with Ron's.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 12 2009 12:17:37
 
Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to cathulu

I'm in! It's a nice falseta Ron. I'd like to play something that's straightforward technically, so that I can work on getting the right sound, the groove. If I'm struggling with the technique, I can't even think about that.

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http://www.myspace.com/flamencojourney
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 12 2009 13:33:00
 
Gummy

Posts: 495
Joined: Nov. 27 2005
From: North Carolina, USA

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Louis_B

I don't want to make anyone mad here but I really don't think anything would be needed to be added to the Missionary piece. As it its, it would be a hell of a challenge for a beginner. Are you really beginners? Do you think you could play what is there with correct compas, feeling and dynamics? I think it sounds deceptively easy. Playing something short and well is better than playing lots not as well IMO.
There is an intermediate challenge underway that is SPB due to end later this month. Hopefully this doesn't come across as too harsh, I'm just talking.
Rod
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 12 2009 13:39:09
 
Ailsa

Posts: 2277
Joined: Apr. 17 2007
From: South East England

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Gummy

quote:

don't want to make anyone mad here but I really don't think anything would be needed to be added to the Missionary piece. As it its, it would be a hell of a challenge for a beginner. Are you really beginners?


Why would you make anyone mad Gummy?! That was a pretty mild-mannered post!

I guess most of us regulars in the beginners' challenges are not real beginners, as in the first year of playing. But are not yet ready to try anything as complex as the intermediate challenge, that's where I am anyway.

And 2 minutes recording without a mistake is pretty difficult for me! There's nearly always some sort of fumble-fingers bit I played a couple of pieces at the Pena in London last night. The Tarantas is about 5 minutes and had a few slips, though as it was Tarantas I could pretend they were intentional The Bulerias is about 3 minutes and there was one blip in that too!! Still, it was my first time of playing to an audience of about 100 people, so I forgave myself Also the good thing about a live performance is that when it's gone, it's gone, so you just have to live with what ever happened. With a recording on the other hand, you can do it again. And again. And again and again. Searching for that perfection which I will never reach before the deadline, if ever!!

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http://www.myspace.com/flamencojourney
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 12 2009 13:56:22
 
Gummy

Posts: 495
Joined: Nov. 27 2005
From: North Carolina, USA

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Ailsa

Thanks Ailsa. I am a beginner but I can stretch and play(not well) higher things. For example, I studied for the last buleria challenge of Oscar H stuff and it was coming together but not quite good enough(I thought) to record. I tried a couple times but deleted it.(I still practice it.) I also practiced the falsetta that Jason put out for his first big challenge. I could actually play it but not up to speed. So, if given enough time, I can play harder stuff but I think it lacks alot. I'm sure as I improve, the harder stuff I work on will sound lots better. At this point though, I would rather work the things that make a phrase flamenco instead of just trying to learn more notes.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 12 2009 14:43:23
 
cathulu

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec. 15 2006
From: Vancouver, Canukistan

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Gummy

Thanks Gummy for your thoughts. Let's think about things for a few days and see what other ideas may come up before we lock in on the final challenge material. Right now we are agreed that Ron's material will be a good challenge (and I understand we have his OK to use it also, so bonus).

If something else comes up we shall see about adding more. But if we just stay with Ron's material, plus maybe a couple of compas variations at the option of the contestant, that would be a good challenge. I know I will learn a lot from Ron's material. It will help thinking in sixes for the Bulerias.

Gummy, are you going to participate? I hope you will! This might be tough yes but you don't have to play at Ron's speed. A slow bulerias can sound just fantastic.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 12 2009 19:35:49
 
at_leo_87

Posts: 3055
Joined: Aug. 30 2008
From: Boston, MA, U.S.A

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to cathulu

i'll help tab it if someone doesn't beat me to it. my tabs are horrible though, be warned. i never notate the rhythms.

i'll help organize too if you need me although i think i read in another thread that kozz wanted to admin a challenge?

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 12 2009 20:29:01
 
kozz

Posts: 1766
Joined: Feb. 26 2009
From: Eindhoven NL

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Ailsa

quote:

I guess most of us regulars in the beginners' challenges are not real beginners, as in the first year of playing.



Just another few months and I´ll leave my first year of even touching a guitar....



quote:

i'll help organize too if you need me although i think i read in another thread that kozz wanted to admin a challenge?

Yes no probs.
I wont be participating the challenge anyway because I am still uncertain how my back will evolve and don´t want to put anymore pressure on myselves.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 13 2009 4:37:49
 
Gummy

Posts: 495
Joined: Nov. 27 2005
From: North Carolina, USA

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to cathulu

Well I'll definately practice the piece. If it comes together nicely enough to record I'll send it in.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 13 2009 5:25:40
 
Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Gummy

Hi Folks,

If you really want to use that falseta, personally I would begin with a few compas cycles of basic Jerez style strumming since the falseta is already a sort of "intro" anyway.
(Listen to Orson's version and also Henrik's Jerezana opening chords.)

Everybody could just choose their own strumming pattern intro, which would add more interest to the challenge, since you would have to do a bit of research and listening.

Oh...best way to pick it up is to practise the slow version as solidly and carefully as you can. Keep practising at this speed and tapping your foot, so the rhythm of the falseta really sinks in.
After that it is fairly easy to speed it up to anything you want.

(Oh..you could maybe use "Flamenco Master" at first, just to confirm to yourself which beats the salient notes are landing on if you are unsure.)

The F# note on the low E string is on the 12 beat.
That's the important one and the one you should be aiming at.
The first few notes are just "lead in" ones.

I actually play it a bit too fast, but that's because I was really getting annoyed with the recording program keeping freezing up and I just wanted to get it over with before it decided to hang up again ....it would probably sound better played a bit slower IMO.

Personally, I wouldn't over complicate the challenge by adding more falsetas, since the whole point of the exercise is to become more confident about Bulerias rhythm and feeling how a falseta fits in to the compás.

For learning, simple is always better. You learn much more IMO.

cheers,

Ron
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 13 2009 6:34:56
 
r0bbie

 

Posts: 160
Joined: Feb. 11 2007
From: Holland

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Ron.M

quote:

I actually play it a bit too fast, but that's because I was really getting annoyed with the recording program keeping freezing up and I just wanted to get it over with before it decided to hang up again ....it would probably sound better played a bit slower IMO


Mmmm... I just wanted to ask you if you could upload a slower version..

But I would like to try this as a beginner challenge.
Rob.

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 13 2009 11:49:52
 
Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to r0bbie

Hi R0bbie,

You mean even SLOWER than the slow version I already posted?

cheers,

Ron
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 13 2009 12:14:47
 
el ted

 

Posts: 466
Joined: Nov. 13 2003
 

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to cathulu

Jolly good stuff there Ron. Is it my poor eyesight or is there a piece of black string hanging down from your head?
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 13 2009 12:55:42
 
r0bbie

 

Posts: 160
Joined: Feb. 11 2007
From: Holland

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Ron.M

Oops! missed that one :-)

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 13 2009 13:23:20
 
cathulu

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec. 15 2006
From: Vancouver, Canukistan

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Ron.M

OK, Ron, I agree with you. Also, it is better to have things contained in one video rather than a couple of multiple sources.

Kozz, if you want to help and you said you wanted to, you can be the guy that receives and uploads the contestants audio and the judges scores. How does that sound? It would be good that a non-participant handles this stuff.

As GJ said recently, judges scores should be held back and released all together so no one is influenced. Also, right now I don't think we should rush finding judges, we should wait for the New Year so people can confirm they can do it, and so the recent judging fiasco is well behind us :^)

at_leo_87, if you want to prepare the tablature, and you are up to it, then please do! If you can't be bothered no worries either.

I will post an official thread with rules etc in a day or so.

So far we have confirmed participants in order of appearance

Cathulu
Minordjango
Louis_B
Ailsa
Gummy
Robbie

More are welcome of course! I will send reminders to past participants also.

Cheers everyone
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 13 2009 18:39:04
 
Djreisat

 

Posts: 28
Joined: Sep. 21 2009
From: Wilmington, NC

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Gummy

Hey Gummy where in NC you from? If you don't mind my asking
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 13 2009 18:50:33
 
Gummy

Posts: 495
Joined: Nov. 27 2005
From: North Carolina, USA

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Djreisat

Hi Danny,
I'm living in Jacksonville now. I lived in Wilmington a couple years ago. I had a house in Hampstead near Porters Neck and I had a condo above the mall at Mayfaire.
I haven't heard of much Flamenco in the area. THis is the only guy I know about. http://www.pacostrickland.com/ I have not seen him.
Rod
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 14 2009 8:03:20
 
fevictor

Posts: 377
Joined: Nov. 22 2005
From: Quepos / Manuel Antonio, Costa Rica

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to cathulu

Hello everyone. Cathulu, I would like to be included in this challenge please. It sounds like fun and I like the idea. Thanks Ron for the falseta, I haven't been able to hear it yet since I'm at work, but Ill upload that bad boy tonight!

Vic
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 14 2009 9:11:20
 
fasola

 

Posts: 2
Joined: Jan. 28 2009
 

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to cathulu

Hi everyone -

This is my first time posting anything on this site. I have a little space up on youtube under the name "pinkfedora" where I upload things I've tried to teach myself over the past couple years. Some folks there (henrikduende and xirdneHRicsi) have recommended that I check out your forum, so finally here I am!

I have very much to learn and would be interested in participating in a challenge like this one. Is this possible???
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 14 2009 10:59:13
 
Gummy

Posts: 495
Joined: Nov. 27 2005
From: North Carolina, USA

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to fasola

Welcome to the forum! You can definately enter the challenge. You will receive valuable and maybe even harsh and humbling feedback that will help you along the road to learning Flamenco. You are starting down a road that will consume more time and attention than you have ever imagined.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 14 2009 13:56:22
 
xirdneH_imiJ

Posts: 1790
Joined: Dec. 2 2006
From: Budapest, now in Southampton

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to fasola

welcome Fasola!
honestly, i think you're at least intermediate level, your playing is excellent!
you should join the composition challenge too, it's gonna be fun!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 14 2009 14:10:37
 
Gummy

Posts: 495
Joined: Nov. 27 2005
From: North Carolina, USA

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to fasola

OOPs! I hadn't seen your videos yet. Yeah, this might be too easy for you. Still, there are always new challenges starting up and you will enjoy the forum. Also, you can upload at any time to get advice etc. Welcome again.
Rod
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 15 2009 5:14:09
 
at_leo_87

Posts: 3055
Joined: Aug. 30 2008
From: Boston, MA, U.S.A

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to cathulu

Ron, your guitar is not up to standard pitch!

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 15 2009 10:29:25
 
Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to at_leo_87

quote:

Ron, your guitar is not up to standard pitch!


Anthony,

I'm not up to standard pitch either.

So that makes two of us.

I never bother checking that stuff.
I dunno.
I just take it out the case and play around then put it back in again when I'm finished.

cheers,

Ron
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 15 2009 10:44:57
 
cathulu

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec. 15 2006
From: Vancouver, Canukistan

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to fevictor

Of course you are welcome fevictor!

Fasola, you are too good for this challenge girl! Stick around though and enter a challenge once you got your feet wet here a bit, and welcome!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 15 2009 15:26:04
 
at_leo_87

Posts: 3055
Joined: Aug. 30 2008
From: Boston, MA, U.S.A

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to Ron.M

quote:


Anthony,

I'm not up to standard pitch either.

So that makes two of us.


No need for explanations. I was just being grouchy. Had a rough week

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  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 15 2009 15:58:46
 
fasola

 

Posts: 2
Joined: Jan. 28 2009
 

RE: New Beginners Challenge? (in reply to xirdneH_imiJ

Thanks Gummy, xirdneH_imiJ, and Cathulu!

I don't think I can handle an original composition challenge just yet, but I'll definitely stick around for an intermediate challenge similar to this one. Hopefully, I can listen to the submissions for both challenges in the meantime. Much luck to everyone!
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Oct. 16 2009 12:33:12
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