Making Money from Flamenco

Costs are rising and times are tough.
Please consider a donation to keep this
place going.

Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.

This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva and Tom Blackshear who went ahead of us.

We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.

You are logged in as Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >>Discussions >>General >>

Page: [1]

Message

<< Newer Topic Older Topic >>

cathulu

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec. 15 2006
From: Vancouver, Canukistan

Making Money from Flamenco

Came across an interesting article in the June 2009 Chatelaine woman's magazine (Canadian Magazine)

They had a feature on Carmen Romero, a flamenco dancer / teacher from Toronto who has a dance studio.

Her annual declared income is $C70,000 - a decent amount so it sounds but really not too much if you live in a big city like Toronto. She is a single mom with a daughter, so if she had a partner her situation would probably be pretty decent.

Her biggest worry is health costs because dance takes a toll on the aging body and some stuff is not covered by her provincial health plan (e.g. massage therapy). She also has trouble finding reliable staff so wears too many hats when putting on a show.

The upshot is that she was recommended by a financial consultant to focus on what is making the money - the dance studio and therefore back-off on the shows and productions that are not as profitable. But I guess it is a catch 22, cause often a school puts on a show for the students to perform in (I am going to one such show tonight btw).

Anyways there you have one hard concrete example of someone making money in Flamenco. I wonder what the semi-pro flamenco guitarists on the foro are making? Probably less I would guess as they undoubtably have less students. It is a tough life to make a go of it as a performing artist, my hats off to those that are successful, and even more respect for those that are struggling to get by.

Any comments or similar money stories to share?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 26 2009 16:30:27

Andy Culpepper

Posts: 3023
Joined: Mar. 30 2009
From: NY, USA

RE: Making Money from Flamenco (in reply to cathulu)

I love that term "semi-professional"..even if I only make $500 a year off music I can still call myself that right?

In reality I probably make about 5k a year off students and gigs (mostly students)...combined with what I make part time as a carpenter I'm probably hovering somewhere around the poverty line

. That's cool with me though, I wouldn't have it any other way...obviously I want to make a living off music but I'm really happy in my life right now just with relationships with students and people I play music with, and my girl. I don't need much in the way of material goods.

I have the satisfaction of knowing that I have a life-long relationship with the guitar, something that will never leave me, and will only grow and get better over time.
I'm just going to keep at it, play out as much as I can, meet as many like-minded people as possible. And I'm sure better and better things will continue to happen.

That is just my story. Of course I think that in general, artists should be able to make a living, but it is ALWAYS a struggle.

_____________________________

Andy Culpepper, luthier
http://www.andyculpepper.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 26 2009 18:04:03

gj Michelob

Posts: 1531
Joined: Nov. 7 2008
From: New York City/San Francisco

RE: Making Money from Flamenco (in reply to cathulu)

quote:

(Cathulu) my hats off to those that are successful, and even more respect for those that are struggling to get by.

(Deteresa1) That's cool with me though, I wouldn't have it any other way...obviously I want to make a living off music but I'm really happy in my life right now just with relationships with students and people I play music with, and my girl. I don't need much in the way of material goods.

I have the satisfaction of knowing that I have a life-long relationship with the guitar, something that will never leave me, and will only grow and get better over time.
__________________

Back in the US and with reliable internet access, I was eager to read a few posts. I found these wonderfully inspiring words. It is great to be back.
gj

_____________________________

gj Michelob

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 26 2009 19:39:23

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: Making Money from Flamenco (in reply to cathulu)

that would be 45.000 €... thats what an engineer in Germany gets as loan. Thats not decent here, that is ALOT!

deteresas version is closer to the reality. I am a happy amateur, though i invest much time in it.

_____________________________

Фламенко

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 27 2009 1:08:50

val

Posts: 800
Joined: Apr. 4 2007

[Deleted]

Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Nov. 8 2010 12:53:19

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 27 2009 1:20:50

Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: Making Money from Flamenco (in reply to cathulu)

quote:

The upshot is that she was recommended by a financial consultant to focus on what is making the money - the dance studio and therefore back-off on the shows and productions that are not as profitable.

hope she ignores that...i mean thats how i messure succes...the quality of shows u do with the money u earn...thats why i wanna earn money...to one day put on shows the way i dream them...money for the sake of money means nothing

and also makes for good bussines anyway because its the good shows that inspires students and artists and brings more students and more commited level of artists and respect to your aart and your local scene...its absoluteley the biggest waiste to be the greatest earning flamenco school and do nothing with it, not enrich or give more oportunity or help your local flamenco scene...i think its a responsibilitie you have towards flamenco and students to create a litlle bit of a scene for them...something to inspire them and make them wanna practice and be proud, and bring in other artists and push your art...outside spain noone is ever going to help us..flamencos in each city, each country have to do it for themselfs...and they have been doing it for a long time...

everybody likes to know that there is an oportunity to do something with what you learn...not just learn it for the classroom

i cant complain about money lately ...getting enough to survive better then i ever had before..i could get more but i am not money driven i try to balance between what pays and what I wanna do..

i have been known to voluntarily offer my share of the gig pay away when we didnt have enough to bring in a singer or a cajon player just because i tought it would enrich the music experience and impact and it would be worth it, restaurant owners most of the time dont understand the effect or importance of a cajon player or a singer (outside spain) and never ask for it, allways having to convince them everytime..they all think that all you need is a guitar and a dancers thats it...so i sometimes sacrifice in order for them to feel the full impact and perhaps influence them to allow enough money in the future for us to be have all the elements of what makes flamenco good athmosphere possible, i am always pushing for the show to be as gooid as it can be rather then quick extra cash in my pocket...always got to keep an eye out on the big picture not just on the quick cash...and eventually it will pay off, or atleast you will have a blast and absoluteley love what you do.. IMO...sometimes a litlle sacrifice its what is required ...noone else will do it for you ...

dont get me wrong...i like to get paid, i get paid..but i am very flexible sometimes around flamenco friends for the sake of the kind of show that i know it would be worth it
so to me money is irrelevant as long as i get to balance it with doing shows that are presented the way i think they should be

i get fustrated at some people who dont see the big picture and think they are entitled to take home 70% of the pay...and dont care that you could have a better show with more artists if you were a litlle more flexible ...and u would gain with more work and better shows as a result..

i like working with people who share the same vision...would sacrifice the last cent if they tought it would make a better show..

sorry i am dragging on and orfourse not suggesting anything about the lady in your city just talking in general terms...

lol but its a good topic..something that i have had to think about a bitt recently...whats more important more quick cash in one guys pocket VS better shows and more oportunity for everyone and more professional appearence flamenco in your city regardless on available funds...nothing ever changes if some dont sacrifice a litlle to show it for what it could be and not what it is, i dont allow unaware, tight restaurant or club owners dictate the way we present what we do, sometimes its inevitable...but i am never satisfied, always pushing for more...just because we dont have the same oportunities...thats no excuse, u find a way to make them yourself..it never just magically appears

_____________________________

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 27 2009 4:29:10

cathulu

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec. 15 2006
From: Vancouver, Canukistan

RE: Making Money from Flamenco (in reply to val)

I should say that while I don't have the article in front of me now, that I interjected the "delared" part. So if there is an insinuation of income under the table, that was all mine and an error! I don't know one way or the other. She lives more than 3000 km from me, I live in Vancouver, she is in "Tarana" as they say back east.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 27 2009 11:05:46

cathulu

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec. 15 2006
From: Vancouver, Canukistan

RE: Making Money from Flamenco (in reply to Florian)

Good thoughts their Flo.

Sounds like you are getting on pretty decent, but as you get older, a settled lifestyle with adequate "kaching" becomes more important. If you suffer long enough at your art, you should be eventually rewarded but unfortunately life holds no guarantees. So if one day you choose the path of maximum return for your artistic effort I won't hold it against you! Just let me download your music for free, OK?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 27 2009 11:17:41

Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: Making Money from Flamenco (in reply to cathulu)

quote:

Her annual declared income is $C70,000 - a decent amount so it sounds but really not too much if you live in a big city like Toronto. She is a single mom with a daughter,

That's an absolute scandal.
Here in the UK, low paid workers like her with children can get financial help from the government... which is good IMO.

I doubt if an office cleaner or hospital porter over here would even bother getting up in the morning for that kinda rubbish bucks...

Just shows you how important music and stuff is in society.

Jeez... Boris Johnson gets £250,000 p.a. just for writing a newspaper column on a part-time basis and most MPs here would regard that amount just to barely cover their expenses on a petty cash basis.

Sheesh!.....Glad I never went to Canada!

cheers,

Ron

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 27 2009 11:24:45

cathulu

Posts: 950
Joined: Dec. 15 2006
From: Vancouver, Canukistan

RE: Making Money from Flamenco (in reply to Ron.M)

Bwahahaha good one Ron!

I'll have you know that here in Canada she could go on welfare with one child and earn about $17,000 woohoo. Easy Street!!!!!!

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 27 2009 11:45:41

Florian

Posts: 9282
Joined: Jul. 14 2003
From: Adelaide/Australia

RE: Making Money from Flamenco (in reply to cathulu)

quote:

Sounds like you are getting on pretty decent, but as you get older, a settled lifestyle with adequate "kaching" becomes more important

i should probably clarifie

i am not rich or anything, not even close..but i am doing better then i was 2 years ago..getting more consistant work and earning more with the guitar..and every now and then even get nice money...when i mean i am doing ok .,its just ok relative to me and how i was doing before.....i am not loaded...once in the blue moon i get a really nice payment from a festival or something speciall and i blow it just as fast as i get it

_____________________________

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 27 2009 12:17:36