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RobF -> RE: Scale length with zero fret (Nov. 15 2025 3:21:07)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Ricardo
quote:
I said Ramzi's guitar has no compensation because that's what he measured. -Robj
Ramzi measured from the Zero fret to 12 and doubled it. The zero fret is a compensation for the scale, inherent to the measurement. Compensation can be spread out across the frets' positions or added to the position of the bridge, all in relation to the string length. Your statement implies to me that "hurray there is no EXTRA compensation" because the 12th fret 2x= the same number as the bridge position. If it was different, as in plus a mm or so, that would be compensated additional to the already compensated scale via the zero fret ahead of the nut. To me compensation on top of compensation was hilarious. Maybe it is not to others, sorry.
Ahhh...I just reread this and somehow I had missed what you were saying. Probably because I was upset. Now I understand why you found it hilarious.
I just want to clarify something. Mainly because it seems you have the impression that a zero fret is a form of compensation of sorts. I guess it could be, but generally it isn't. The nut is moved back to make room for it and the zero fret removes the nut from the equation and takes the position of the edge of the nut.
A zero to twelfth measurement really is a measure of exactly one half of the true scale length. I say this because the twelfth fret placement is derived from the scale length and it, by definition, sits directly at the midpoint. It has to, unless, as you say, the fret placement itself has some form of compensation built in. Could happen, I sometimes wonder about the use of the rule of 18, but that's about the extent of it, I've never gone much deeper than wondering. Modern placements rely on using a more accurate divisor than 18 and that number is chosen to place the twelfth fret at the exact midpoint.
If the zero fret placement were to be compensated it would impact the distance to the first fret. Kinda like I was explaining about fretting templates and also why I kept clarifying that the 0-12th was a true measure but not necessarily the nut to 12th. But it wouldn't make sense to do this as one of the impacts (and likely intents) of the use of a zero fret is the reduction of the deformation/stretch of the string when it is fretted at the first. So, if anything, it could be said the purpose of a zero fret is to reduce the need for compensation at the nut, not to add it.
Also, and you can call me Robj on this one, when Ramzi told me he had measured following my 0-12 suggestion and then from nut to saddle and the results were the same it had not yet been revealed that he had used his wife's sewing tape. Sure, tape stretch could account for missing the compensation, and likely does, but we'll never know. My statement about no compensation was made prior to that revelation and I guess it's on me for not being more rigorous in questioning his methods. Mind you, at that point WWIII had not yet broken out and I thought we were still living in a time of peace.
Any rate, I've said what I've had to say. This whole episode has left me feeling rotten.
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