RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (Full Version)

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bernd -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (Mar. 5 2015 14:00:31)

@ Ramzi

In the video review it looks like your legs are hold together touching the knee. I never could sit like this while playing guitar. My legs are always spread with a distance of the width of my shoulders. If you sit down with the support holding the guitar like this, will it feel unconfortable in any way, e. g. like the strap could be a little bit too short?




ToddK -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (Mar. 5 2015 23:53:14)

quote:

In the video review it looks like your legs are hold together touching the knee. I never could sit like this while playing guitar. My legs are always spread with a distance of the width of my shoulders. If you sit down with the support holding the guitar like this, will it feel unconfortable in any way, e. g. like the strap could be a little bit too short?


@ bernd
You actually can attain the "Traditional Flamenco"
position with your legs out wide, using the flamenco loco support. Diego
shows you how to do this on the website.

Go to the De Oro site and check out the videos and pics. That's the cool thing about
this particular support, is that it uses the leather strap which allows many different
positions. The position we're talking about, you would attach both ends to the lower
bout.




rombsix -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (Mar. 6 2015 2:44:21)

quote:

In the video review it looks like your legs are hold together touching the knee. I never could sit like this while playing guitar. My legs are always spread with a distance of the width of my shoulders. If you sit down with the support holding the guitar like this, will it feel unconfortable in any way, e. g. like the strap could be a little bit too short?


As long as you are not doing the splits as you are sitting, you should be fine. You can ask for a longer strap...




Miguel de Maria -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 11 2015 17:07:24)

Recently, I've been having some problem with my GuitarRest. The issue was lack of lateral stability. The guitar would want to swing out and stability had been compromised. I believe this has occurred because the attachment of the suction cup to the stiff metal support weakened over time. An important point is that my support is actually a custom model, made to fit a very thin guitar (the Cordoba is less than 2.5" wide), and thus only uses one suction cup. Perhaps this doesn't occur in twin suction cup models.

I do believe I have solved the problem.

I attached the metal support to my belt, using a flexible pipe cleaner. It is not a permanent solution; I'll have to find something stronger and more elegant at some point. However, it keeps the guitar close, offering another point of support and far more security than I had currently had.




rombsix -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 11 2015 20:34:41)

Miguel - sounds like you lean the guitar forward quite a bit when you play? I'm not sure I understand what the issue is exactly. Perhaps a photo or a brief video to better illustrate?

Cheers!




Miguel de Maria -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 12 2015 4:22:06)

Here you go, Ramzi, thanks for taking a look.





ToddK -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 12 2015 21:44:47)

Miguel,

I think the thinner body allows the guitar to move more for one thing.

But the main thing that occurs to me is that you're saying, "the guitar is moving"
but of course what is happening is YOU are moving the guitar. The stability is
connected to the way you handle the guitar. If a player is only moving the
hands/arms to address the strings and the neck, the guitar should not move.

So i think what you need to do is take the support off, and sit with the guitar and
figure out what physical tendency is causing this. Strumming or plucking alone
will not cause the guitar to move. Fretting wont either. So you are applying
pressure somewhere, somehow other than what is needed to just play.

If it was the guitar or the support, we would all have to tie the guitar or the support
to our body somehow. Clearly thats not the case. I think you have some investigating to do.




rombsix -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 12 2015 21:52:14)

quote:

Here you go, Ramzi, thanks for taking a look.


Hey Miguel - great video. Really helps me understand the situation. If I were you, I would try the regular model which has two suction cups on one end, and a single one on the other end (your custom model has one suction cup on one end, and also one suction cup on the other end). I know that they will not fit on the guitar, however, each will partially cover the guitar's side (at least 50% for each suction cup). That will be enough (with FiniShield) to allow them to remain stuck, however, the two connection points rather than one connection point will solve the wobble problem. I have the same exact situation with my Stagg flamenco guitar (really narrow body also), and I use the usual contraption with two suction cups. They stick partly to the side and are partly "suspended in mid-air" on the outside halves of the guitar, but still the fact that there are two points of contact does not allow for any wobble to happen. It's definitely something that depends on how much movement you do during playing and whether you put more weight forward/backward on the guitar, I guess. I am a very light-weight player ( on all accounts [:D] ), and so I likely generate less force than you do. However, I think the regular two-suction-cup model is worth trying. I think you will benefit from discussing my above viewpoint with Diego and showing him your video. He always benefits from feedback. Perhaps he can give you more ideas, and he might be very generous and alter your contraption without much extra expense.

Cheers!




ToddK -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 12 2015 21:53:25)

So further thoughts on the Loco support.

Really love it. One great byproduct im finding is, my guitar sounds much better
and much louder now, due to the fact that its not being dampened by my body.

I was using the across the lap style position, but now i have it on the left leg
using the classical position. I never thought i would be comfortable with this
position, but the more i do it, the better it gets.
I have it adjusted so the neck is very high. An interesting thing thats happening is
that the right hand has an ideal angle for picado. My wrist can be more flat,
and unbent. In the traditional position, i have to raise my right arm quite a bit
to get that angle, and its uncomfortable to practice for a long time like that. So the great byproduct of this has been my picado has improved greatly in a short time.

anyhoo, i'm still discovering great things about using a support. I highly suggest everybody try it at some point. It has helped be play better, so... pretty awesome stuff.
TK




rombsix -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 2:00:55)

Hey Todd,

I'm glad you're enjoying the support.

I agree with you about the sound of the guitar improving. It's amazing how much dampening the body can produce and suck out of the sound. That's one reason why I can get away with playing crappy guitars. [:D]

I agree about the classical position on the left leg being great for picado. In fact, the Professor has advocated for that along with other people, and I had to agree it really is more comfortable. When I try that position though, I find the right hand/arm becomes relatively lower and further away from the sweet spot on the strings (between sound hole and bridge), which produces the comfortable position for picado that you mention. However, it also makes it a bit less comfortable for me while playing most other techniques (pulgar, arpeggio, rasgueado, etc.). Do you feel the same way? I've seen people practice ONLY PICADO in that position, but then they switch to the across the lap position when going back to practicing other techniques or playing all-round material in general. What are your thoughts?

One last thing - can you post a short video showing what you look like with the left-leg classical position and show us what your right hand/wrist look like for picado, and then perhaps (if that is what you're doing), show us other techniques & shifting between techniques also in the left-leg classical position?

Cheers!




Dudnote -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 3:19:06)

These supports look great, I'm very tempted. The website warns against using suction cups on nitrocellulose finishes, I was wonderring if a static vinyl sheet between the suckers and the nitro would work. Any ideas?




rombsix -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 3:24:47)

quote:

These supports look great, I'm very tempted. The website warns against using suction cups on nitrocellulose finishes, I was wonderring if a static vinyl sheet between the suckers and the nitro would work. Any ideas?






Dudnote -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 3:51:58)

Thanks Ramzi, so he says right at the end not for nitrocellulose. I might still get the support for playing my basher though to vary up the postures a bit.




Miguel de Maria -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 4:14:30)

Ramzi, thanks for the advice. I'll get in touch with Diego and see what he thinks.

Todd, thanks for your words of wisdom. Yes, I think I've always had a problem holding the guitar. Sometimes I am afflicted with rather painful fatigue in one or the other shoulder (duende said I have an "anti-guitar body"). I have played in most of the standard positions and used quite a few different supports. My favorite was the classical position using a footstool, but I didn't like it twisted my back, and after several years of this, it also seemed my left shoulder was getting tired of holding up the arm in a higher position. I have the ErgoPlay and the NeckUp, and am now am using the GuitaRest.

Long story short, there probably is something wrong about how I hold it. I do not like the feeling I am using any force to hold up the right arm. So there is maybe a decent amount of pressure on the guitar. I also use a piece of suede on the top bout, where some people put an armrest. This extra friction helps me hold the guitar. However, perhaps it is part of the problem of the guitar moving around. That being said, I think the looseness of the support is causing a lot of this wobble. Consider that the support essentially takes the place of the solid guitar bottom pressing against the solid thing, but my support has a few inches of play with very little pressure.




rombsix -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 4:34:43)

quote:

Thanks Ramzi, so he says right at the end not for nitrocellulose. I might still get the support for playing my basher though to vary up the postures a bit.


Oh, I missed that part. [:D] Contact Diego directly, and ask him if he has any work-arounds. You might be pleasantly surprised...

Miguel - yup, you won't lose much by keeping lines of communication open with him and the rest of us here. You might benefit though. [:)]

Good luck!




ToddK -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 5:05:25)

quote:

Hey Todd,

I'm glad you're enjoying the support.

I agree with you about the sound of the guitar improving. It's amazing how much dampening the body can produce and suck out of the sound. That's one reason why I can get away with playing crappy guitars.

I agree about the classical position on the left leg being great for picado. In fact, the Professor has advocated for that along with other people, and I had to agree it really is more comfortable. When I try that position though, I find the right hand/arm becomes relatively lower and further away from the sweet spot on the strings (between sound hole and bridge), which produces the comfortable position for picado that you mention. However, it also makes it a bit less comfortable for me while playing most other techniques (pulgar, arpeggio, rasgueado, etc.). Do you feel the same way? I've seen people practice ONLY PICADO in that position, but then they switch to the across the lap position when going back to practicing other techniques or playing all-round material in general. What are your thoughts?

One last thing - can you post a short video showing what you look like with the left-leg classical position and show us what your right hand/wrist look like for picado, and then perhaps (if that is what you're doing), show us other techniques & shifting between techniques also in the left-leg classical position?

Cheers!


Yes to your question about practicing picado in the classical position and then moving
back to traditional position for other techniques. It is easier on the right shoulder.
In addition though, I think that you learn some things about your right hand when playing in classical position that you can take with you when returning to traditional position.
For instance, playing with the support in classical position actually precipitated a big
breakthrough for me regarding how i address the strings in picado, and that is i realized that i my hand/fingers were turning in (left) and think this came from mixing classical and flamenco, because for classical, i need that inward turn to create the tone i need for classical. This was bleeding into my picado, and i didnt even realize it. This was causing major friction when trying to do fast powerful picado. My fingers would get hung up. Remember that i just dropped the pick and started playing conventional technique around 5 years ago. So i am still very much in development stages.

Anyway, so i leveled my hand out and immediately things were faster and more powerful. Then i took a step further, and now i am turning my hand slightly outward (right) and playing more off the far side (right) of the nail. Then things really took off. That side of the nail does not hang up at all, at least for me. Its a bit ironic because when i file, i hardly touch that side at all, and only for length, i dont attempt to shape it at all. Its very square, unlike the left side of my nail, which is ramped. Well, it used to be more ramped, but i am now playing exclusively flamenco, so they are getting more flat and square now. We've heard Ricardo speak about that quite a bit here. As usual he is right on the money.

Now when i do picado, it feels like my fingers move totally freely through the string, no hang ups at all. I can dig in much harder now too. So my problem was not accuracy, which is what i thought it was, it was actually friction from using the wrong angle.

Anyway, i will see if i can make a quick video this week.
Thanks again Romb, if it were not for your review, i would probably not have
gotten a support and would not have made all the improvements in my playing, so
i owe you bigtime! Thanks!




rombsix -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 5:59:43)

Thanks for the insight, Todd. I'm happy this review helped. [:)]




Blondie#2 -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 8:13:02)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rombsix
When I try that position though, I find the right hand/arm becomes relatively lower and further away from the sweet spot on the strings (between sound hole and bridge), which produces the comfortable position for picado that you mention. However, it also makes it a bit less comfortable for me while playing most other techniques (pulgar, arpeggio, rasgueado, etc.). Do you feel the same way?


Yes except arps Sorry, I know that question wasn't for me but thought I'd chime in. I use the Diego support on a crossed right leg (not high cross like Paco, normal crossed leg position). It lifts the guitar into a nice centered position in between old school and modern. For me the classical position is great for classical but tricky for flamenco pulgar and rasgueado. However, my current position is not great for picado and involves too much of a bent wrist.




Blondie#2 -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 8:16:49)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ToddK
because for classical, i need that inward turn to create the tone i need for classical. This was bleeding into my picado, and i didnt even realize it. This was causing major friction when trying to do fast powerful picado. My fingers would get hung up.


Yeah that is a BIG issue[:(]

I play both flamenco and classical, from the same position, but my default is exactly the inward turn your describe, = nice thick tone for classical, wrong tone and string catching for flamenco.




rombsix -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 10:20:29)

quote:

I use the Diego support on a crossed right leg (not high cross like Paco, normal crossed leg position). It lifts the guitar into a nice centered position in between old school and modern.


Feedback is always welcome. [:)] Thanks! I agree - I think arpeggios are OK as well in classical position. Pulgar and rajeos are more difficult/awkward. I concur.

Post a brief video or image to show your sitting position quoted above. I think I know what you mean, but it would be nice to see what it looks like.

Olé! [;)]




Miguel de Maria -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (May 13 2015 14:50:42)

It's weird, I lean or turn my hand to the left to help me get through the strings. But my picado technique is problematic...




Blondie#2 -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (Jun. 13 2015 8:17:55)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rombsix
Post a brief video or image to show your sitting position quoted above. I think I know what you mean, but it would be nice to see what it looks like.


Here you go. I have had various video problems for a while now (finding free video editing software that edits the .mov output from my Logitech camera that actually works, doesn't crash, and then outputting to Youtube without problems).

At last I have a solution that seems to work, though I used the webcam mic for the recording and the audio is a bit LOUD [:D] - when I start playing its distorted. Would be nice to upload some falsetas in the Foro so I'll work on the audio.





rombsix -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (Jun. 13 2015 13:52:46)

quote:

Here you go. I have had various video problems for a while now (finding free video editing software that edits the .mov output from my Logitech camera that actually works, doesn't crash, and then outputting to Youtube without problems).

At last I have a solution that seems to work, though I used the webcam mic for the recording and the audio is a bit LOUD - when I start playing its distorted. Would be nice to upload some falsetas in the Foro so I'll work on the audio.


Wonderful, my friend! I'm glad you're enjoying the support. Please post more videos of your playing! [:)]




hamia -> RE: Video review - "GuitaRest Trio" (Custom size) Guitar Support (Jun. 16 2015 9:46:24)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ToddK

@ bernd
You actually can attain the "Traditional Flamenco"
position with your legs out wide, using the flamenco loco support. Diego
shows you how to do this on the website.

Go to the De Oro site and check out the videos and pics. That's the cool thing about
this particular support, is that it uses the leather strap which allows many different
positions. The position we're talking about, you would attach both ends to the lower
bout.


leather strap ... check
suction cups ... check
test driven by ToddK ... check

so far it's ticking all the right boxes




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