The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Full Version)

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guitarristamadrid -> The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 8:41:27)

Everybody is trying to sound like someone else.

All the non-Spanish players want to sound like the gitanos.

All the gitanos want to sound like Paco.

Paco secretly wishes he was Stravinsky.

My personal answer after going deep into this rabbit hole? Play whatever YOU feel like playing, and who gives a **** what anyone else thinks.



Estevan -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 8:45:24)

quote:

Paco secretly wishes he was Stravinsky.

How do you know? Is it not a secret?


1. All the non-Spanish players want to sound like the gitanos.

2. All the gitanos want to sound like Paco.

3. Paco secretly wishes he was Stravinsky.


ergo: All the non-Spanish players want to be Stravinsky.

"That don't add up"



guitarristamadrid -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 8:47:02)

I am Stravinsky



stratos13 -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 8:51:03)

Interesting topic, strangely stated.[;)]



Estevan -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 8:57:54)

quote:

I am Stravinsky

Congratulations! You've surpassed Paco.



guitarristamadrid -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 9:10:14)

Surpassing others is surprisingly unsatisfying, as Paco himself discovered long ago



chapman_g -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 9:10:29)

quote:

I am Stravinsky.



Great, Congratulations, and Stravinsky certainly composed what he wanted, but just so you know Stravinsky did not know s***t about playing flamenco



edguerin -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 9:29:23)

quote:

1. All the non-Spanish players want to sound like the gitanos.

2. All the gitanos want to sound like Paco.

3. Paco secretly wishes he was Stravinsky.


ergo: All the non-Spanish players want to be Stravinsky.


Mind the difference between "want to sound like" and "want to be"
ergo: Stravinsky wants to sound like Paco (who's NOT a Gitano)[;)]

And: what does Paco sound like at the piano?



Alonte -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 9:33:28)

In response to the original post...Whether for fun or not... none of these makes sense. Very judgemental...But I feel your frustrations man.



NormanKliman -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 9:47:34)

The single biggest problem? I don't agree. Those are old issues coming around again with the latest cast of characters, and some of those issues might even be part of the process. IMO the biggest problem is failure to follow through. Going there, doing it, burning out and finding a way to rekindle the fire. Dealing with fatigue and saturation.

The way it normally works when we sit down to play is to go at it for a few minutes, stop for a bit and have another go, repeating the process until some kind of critical mass is reached. I think this represents the whole thing pretty well.

If you want to fill your glass you have to empty it first. If you want to express yourself, you have to listen.



guitarristamadrid -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 9:49:36)

quote:

Stravinsky did not know s***t about playing flamenco


Yup. He certainly didn't have one of these






Images are resized automatically to a maximum width of 800px



guitarristamadrid -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 10:07:29)

quote:

If you want to fill your glass you have to empty it first. If you want to express yourself, you have to listen.


Nice, I like it, sounds like the tao



yohan -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 10:45:07)

what is exactly your point?



Ron.M -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 10:53:49)

quote:

what is exactly your point?


I think guitarrista is pointing out that he is drinking of the fuente of pure Flamenco, while others here merely mark the perimeter... like moths around a candle?

Maybe I interpreted it incorrectly?

cheers,

Ron



marrow3 -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 12:56:31)

quote:


1. All the non-Spanish players want to sound like the gitanos.


not for me - but I want to be respectful in what I do play.

But IMO it is interesting why,or what causes you choose to do this.

cheers,
Richard



Guest -> [Deleted] (Apr. 9 2010 13:10:19)

[Deleted by Admins]



Estevan -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 13:12:19)

quote:

not for me - but I want to be respectful in what I do play.


Same here. The problem with the statement "All the non-Spanish players want to sound like the gitanos" is that it implies that all gitanos sound the same.



Doitsujin -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 13:32:06)

quote:

Everybody is trying to sound like someone else.


Well,.. as amateur and aficionado...My main interest lays in playing the music I love so much in the way I love it so much. And that is composed by others in the style of others. Why inventing the wheel again? I mean as amateur? I see no need in that.
When one is professional...one should look for his own style. yep. But not as aficionado as me i.e.. [;)]



Ailsa -> [Deleted] (Apr. 9 2010 15:12:22)

Post has been moved to the Recycle Bin at Apr. 9 2010 15:13:41



KMMI77 -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 17:14:55)

You sound very frustrated guitarrista madrid.

Your freedom to express yourself with music is something you already have, yet you seem focused on gaining approval for that freedom.

If you have your freedom, There should be no problems with the flamenco community? Perhaps honestly identifying what you are trying to achieve, experience and gain by playing music will help.



Doitsujin -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 9 2010 23:36:45)

quote:

Yup. He certainly didn't have one of these


I printed out mine some mins ago. Nowadays you dont need to go to spain and take these clases... you just need photoshop and a good printer. [8|] Well,.. I wonder why they didnt just give you a chocolate-medal for participation.. the certificate is useless anyway. But you could eat the chocolate.



Ron.M -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 10 2010 2:03:02)

quote:

I'm not too sure why you took it upon yourself to have him prove his "flamenco pedigree"??


nealf,

I wasn't asking Evan to prove anything.

I just was interested in hearing how he played Flamenco after attending El Entri's cañoroto school as I'm sure many here would be too.
His webpage just contained non-Flamenco stuff.

After all, this IS a dedicated Flamenco forum, not a GENERAL guitar forum, so it's not unreasonable to think that most members are interested in Flamenco.

cheers,

Ron



Kate -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 10 2010 5:40:32)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ron.M

After all, this IS a dedicated Flamenco forum, not a GENERAL guitar forum.



And flamenco is not just guitar [;)]



bursche -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 10 2010 5:42:10)

I want to sound like a potato.



Alonte -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 10 2010 7:53:24)

I want to sound like a tomate. A small one :)



Estevan -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 10 2010 9:40:43)

quote:

And flamenco is not just guitar

OMG Kate, have you gone mad?! "Not just guitar!" ?!
What could there possibly be beyond a plethora of prestidigitational picado permutations?
Sheesh, next you'll be telling us it's "a way of life" or something equally outrageous.
[;)]



minordjango -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 10 2010 11:27:07)

quote:

I want to sound like a potato.


thats a classic (quote from tomatito or sabicas? ok i sound like a lemon, and its gone orf!.

i like guitarista idea, keep it going Guitar man, i liked your myspace stuff it was reminded me of pink floyd and getting 2 colors on the rubics cube (that can only be good!).
[:D]



Kate -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 10 2010 11:41:46)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Estevan

quote:

And flamenco is not just guitar

OMG Kate, have you gone mad?! "Not just guitar!" ?!
What could there possibly be beyond a plethora of prestidigitational picado permutations?
Sheesh, next you'll be telling us it's "a way of life" or something equally outrageous.
[;)]


Very funny Esteban !! Not long now before you join our way of life in the Sacromonte [:D]

Actually I was thinking this does not just apply to guitar I have heard people say that Carmen Linares sounds ridiculous as she mimics Gypsy singing, a bit like if Charlotte Church decided to sing with Mick Jagger's fake cockney accent [8D]



ToddK -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 10 2010 11:46:45)

Im not exactly a tiny tomato, but i have been a vegetable for the past 2 weeks.[8D]

I like Stravinsky, but i prefer Paco de Lucia.



Pimientito -> RE: The single biggest problem with the flamenco community (Apr. 10 2010 11:56:41)

quote:

All the non-Spanish players want to sound like the gitanos


You mean play on an out of tune Admira with 5 strings and a beer mat for a golpe plate. Don't get me wrong, the gypsy artists are great but for every great gypsy artist you have to put up 20 noise makers who think they are artists just because "its in their blood"
(Rant over now...just had to put up with a lot of BS this afternoon)



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