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Help! anyone knows the answer for this?????   You are logged in as Guest
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gerundino63

Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

Help! anyone knows the answer for th... 
When I tune my 6th string down to D, and I forget to tune it back again, the next time I play, the D is out of tune. So far, normal.

BUT it is allways out of tune higher!
I have to put it down again, to get it in tune again.

First times, I was thinking I am getting old or something, but when I had it several times, I was prepering myself for a mental home....

This time I checked it with an electronic tuner, and indeed, after half a day, the D is out tune...... higher!

Can somebody pleas explain that to me, so I can get on with my live again????

A little freaked out and desparate Peter.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 2 2004 19:33:10
 
duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to gerundino63) 
Hi P
When you tune the string down it always go back up a little.You haven to pull the string a few times to get it right. If you leave it at D the tension off the neck might pull it up or if you keep the guitar at a place that´s too warm or cold.

That´s all i can say about this.I don´t really know a lot about the technical aspect of guitar construction and things like that.

Henrik
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 2 2004 20:06:53
 
gerundino63

Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to duende) 
Hi Henrik

Thanks for your reply, but I put the E in D, strech it, play on it, and hang the guitar away. few hours later, the normal D (4th string) is exactly the same, and the tuned down string is a little up agian. I don't think the heat or the humidity is cousing that...

SPOOKY!!

Peter.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 2 2004 22:41:58
 
Phil

Posts: 382
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Rota, Spain

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to gerundino63) 
Peter,
I'm sure someone with a better grasp of physics than I could explain this, but I thnk it has something to do with the string's 'memory'. If you put on a brand new string and never tuned above D, the phenomenon that you discribed would probably not occur, unless it's exposed to a colder temperature.
Phil
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 2 2004 23:17:54
 
gerundino63

Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Phil) 
Yes phil, you are on the right track I think, otherwise it would happen at the normal E tuning too.
But still strainge it tightens itself up...
Perhaps a moleculair thing?
Peter.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 2 2004 23:23:49
 
Phil

Posts: 382
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Rota, Spain

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to gerundino63) 
Peter said,
quote:

Perhaps a moleculair thing?

Absolutely! This is why it's so important to understand the the molecular structure of the strings you buy. That's why I recommend that all forum members inquire about the the molecular stability of the guitar strings they are going to buy. Knowing exactly where the nylon was manufactured as well as what alloys are mixed with nickel, is also very important.
Phil

PS. I apologize for the above post. I got confused and thought I was on the F-T forum.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 0:58:43
 
Thomas Whiteley

 

Posts: 786
Joined: Jul. 8 2003
From: San Francisco Bay Area

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Phil) 
quote:

PS. I apologize for the above post. I got confused and thought I was on the F-T forum.


I had the same thought!

_____________________________

Tom
http://home.comcast.net/~flamencoguitar/flamenco.html
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 3:04:02
 
Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to gerundino63) 
Strings! Strings! What kind of string do you like the most! Oh, wait, we're not on F-T? Never mind then...
I won't bring up random thoughts on the Conde either.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 15:14:56
 
Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Miguel de Maria) 
Yeah, I like Savarez LLST (Long Life Self Tuning) myself.
The windings are Depleted Uranium and the inner nylon is made from "smart fibre" which
"remembers" the pre-stressed tension, thus pitch, so never go out of tune.
Can be bought for different scale lengths, but are absolutely rubbish for open tunings.


Ron
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 16:08:35

Paco E.

Posts: 70
Joined: Nov. 16 2003
From: Wieringerwerf, Holland

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to gerundino63) 
Terwijl ome Ed zo dichbij is...........

Het heeft met de "boog"van de hals te maken.

Niks met snaarmoleculen
veel te ver gezocht.
Als je met bijv. 10 kilo trekt aan de hals, buigt hij bijv. 10 cm
met 5 kilo buigt hij geen 5 maar bijv 7.
De afstand van de boog punt, tot het "dode punt van de hals bepaalt het koppel.
De hals krijgt bij het terugdraaien een minder koppel en een wringmoment.
Dit wringmoment is er de oorzaak van.
Het zijn voor het oog geen zichtbare verschillen, doch met een lange lineaal en een schuifmaat is het te zien. het zijn tienden van mm's

groeten Ed
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 18:50:27
 
Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Paco E.) 
Ed,
I think I agree totally, but it's still a bit double Dutch to me.


Ron
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 20:19:57
 
Escribano

Posts: 6417
Joined: Jul. 6 2003
From: England, living in Italy

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Paco E.) 
Umm, something to do with bending the neck. 10 kilos bends 10cm but 5 kilos bends 7cm and the eye cannot see it etc. etc. It's all Dutch to me

_____________________________

Foro Flamenco founder and Admin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 20:21:00

Paco E.

Posts: 70
Joined: Nov. 16 2003
From: Wieringerwerf, Holland

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Escribano) 
Hi Simon,

The figure in cm, are examples to make it clear.
By the twisting of the neck on the lower E-string, (the neck erects a little) the strength which is nessacary (right spelling?) to bow the neck again must be greater.
Try it with a bamboo stick.
Stick upricht. string on the top. then try to bow the stick while you are pulling the string downwards.

Ed
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 20:27:32

Paco E.

Posts: 70
Joined: Nov. 16 2003
From: Wieringerwerf, Holland

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Escribano) 
By the way, compliments for understanding a dutch story

ed
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 20:28:39
 
Escribano

Posts: 6417
Joined: Jul. 6 2003
From: England, living in Italy

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Paco E.) 
geen probleem

_____________________________

Foro Flamenco founder and Admin
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 20:32:17

Paco E.

Posts: 70
Joined: Nov. 16 2003
From: Wieringerwerf, Holland

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Ron.M) 
Hi ron,

What's double dutch in this way:)

Ed(LOL)
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 21:18:58

Paco E.

Posts: 70
Joined: Nov. 16 2003
From: Wieringerwerf, Holland

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Paco E.) 
I have a new problem

A totaly freaked out brother in law.

Who can help me.

A totaly freaked out Ed.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 21:21:39
 
gerundino63

Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Paco E.) 
I am still freaked out, couse if that where the solution, the normal D 4th string,would be out of tune eather!
And that is not so, only the low E, set to D is higher!

Still SPOOKEY!

can not we make this a duch foro, so much easyer..............

Peter.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 22:17:14

Paco E.

Posts: 70
Joined: Nov. 16 2003
From: Wieringerwerf, Holland

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to gerundino63) 
SORRY, wrong conclusion

because the D string is more to the middle, the twisting of the neck, does it

ed
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 22:41:08
 
gerundino63

Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Paco E.) 
Well, sorry Ed, I still do not understand why it is higher with 12 hours.
greetings, peter.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 22:45:57

Paco E.

Posts: 70
Joined: Nov. 16 2003
From: Wieringerwerf, Holland

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to gerundino63) 
hmm, depends on the drinks perheps?

I will explane it when we meet.
It's rather complicated, in text.

see you

Ed
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 23:12:50
 
gerundino63

Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to Paco E.) 
O.K good night.
Peter.
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 23:14:39

Paco E.

Posts: 70
Joined: Nov. 16 2003
From: Wieringerwerf, Holland

RE: Help! anyone knows the answer fo... (in reply to gerundino63) 
peter , heb je mijn avontuur van vanavond al gelezen?

see Guitars!!!

Ed
  REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |  Date Jan. 3 2004 23:16:35
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