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Top Five Traditional Flamenco CDs (USA)
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Fulcanelli
Posts: 18
Joined: Sep. 2 2006
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 RE: Top Five Traditional Flamenco CD... (in reply to Fulcanelli)
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Ah...thanks for the clarification. And yes, you were right about how I was using the term, 'neuvo flamenco.'
What do you call the sort of flamenco that stays largely within the traditional format but borrows chords and melodies from the jazz idiom? Paco de Lucia, where does he fit in, regarding categories?
I've had a disk for years called "The Young Flamencos," published by Hannibal Records/Rykodisk. When I listen to this, I hear a lot of modern influences (especially the electric bass) but the guitar playing still 'feels' flamenco. Ottmar, well, that's a different story for me. I don't mean to offend anybody who likes his music but it's a far cry from flamenco. I have been listening to this type of music before Ottmar became the darling of all the New Age restaurants in my area.
I think I know what you mean about the reclassification. I have another disk, "Neuvo Flamenco" published by Music Club, with performances by Ketama, Songhai, Rafael Riqueni, Aurora, Tomatito, and "many more" (as the cover states.) This sounds more like pop music to me and I can't listen to it for very long.
I have another disk, Barrio Negro" by Tomatito, and I have no problems listening that it. IT still has a flamenco feel to me.
Now that I'm aware that I speak a different language here, I'll pay more attention and try to get with the program. 
BTW, I have a few Nunez CDs and love his playing. "Jucal" is one I've given as a gift to a few different people.
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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE |
Date Sep. 5 2006 17:36:24
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JBASHORUN
Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005
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RE: Top Five Traditional Flamenco CD... (in reply to Fulcanelli)
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quote:
I have another disk, "Neuvo Flamenco" published by Music Club, with performances by Ketama, Songhai, Rafael Riqueni, Aurora, Tomatito, and "many more" (as the cover states.) This sounds more like pop music to me and I can't listen to it for very long.
I have this CD too! I actually quite liked Aurora's song on that album, and also Ray Heredia's. But whether you like them or not, I'd agree that they are more like "Spanish pop/rock" than Flamenco. That said, there is some Tomatito on that album, and he is usually considered "modern Flamenco". So its really a mix, intended for "outsiders".
Paco De Lucia, well... his stuff with Al Di Meola and John McLaughlin isn't really Flamenco. Some people call it "Neuvo Flamenco", but even Nuevo Flamenco doesn't usually use steel-string Ovation guitars, so perhaps it fits better into the "Jazz" catagory.
I'm told that (apart from the cante) Flamenco is based on compas, so if your work uses the traditional Flamenco palos (rhythm structures), its likely to be considered "Flamenco". Rumbas (4/4 timing) are included in that, but they are the simplest form, and I feel that many aficionados consider them inferior to the other palos.
Most of the rest of Paco's solo work fits into either the "traditional solo Flamenco guitar" catagory, or the "Modern solo Flamenco guitar" catagory. But I don't think even his most modern stuff is as modern as some of the other Flamenco guitarists out there.
Paco also has a few "Flamenco puro with cante" albums.
Jb
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Date Sep. 5 2006 17:54:47
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JBASHORUN
Posts: 1839
Joined: Jan. 23 2005
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RE: Top Five Traditional Flamenco CD... (in reply to Fulcanelli)
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quote:
Hmmm...I wonder if we are listening to the same disks? Both have some of the same performers, but the settings sound very different to me. There is a good 5-6 years between both releases. "The Young Flamencos" has a ton of rasgueados accompaniment and most of the singing sounds much like traditional flamenco song. The rhythm is hand clapping mostly. On "Nuevo Flamenco," there are strings, drums, tons of maj7 chords, 'smooth jazz' style singing, especially on the first few tracks. I find them to sound and feel VERY different.
Well, I don't have the "Young Flamencos" album, so I can't comment on it. But Ray Heredia and Aurora only released one album each. I know because I own both of those albums. I would say that both albums are 90% "easy-listening", albeit with a Latin feel. And Ketama are known for a similar brand of music.
It may just be that the "Young Flamencos" CD has picked the least commercial of their songs. But if its "modern Flamenco" WITHOUT CANTE you're after, I'd still recommend Vicente Amigo and Tomatito. Or try Estrella Morente or Pitingo if you want some modern cante.
Jb
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Date Sep. 5 2006 22:01:27
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Ricardo
Posts: 14837
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
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RE: Top Five Traditional Flamenco CD... (in reply to Fulcanelli)
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Fulcanelli, "young flamencos" was a compilation of artists who were young and hopefull in the 80's. 20 years later, they are not so young and the music has changed a lot. Careful with compilations, they are not always the best representation of an artist. They are a way for the record company to get names out and make some extra off certain tracks. The tracks are not always chosen by aficionados.
Paco de lucia has released a lot of CD's. Each solo guitar CD was pretty much a trend setter when it was released. The evolution of flamenco guitar can be traced through his successive recordings. The older the CD, the more traditional. The mid point of trad/modern flamenco guitar is Fuene y Caudal/Almoraima, although debateable. The trend started at that time to include other instruments, and continues today. The 2 CDs recomended above "Fantasia Flamenca", and "Siroco" are good to compare traditional vs modern style flamenco guitar. But he also has recorded classical music, world music, jazz fusion, and even Brazillian latin american, etc totally non flamenco music.
Tomatito and Gerardo Nunez are both heavily influenced by Paco's work, and considered modern flamenco. Paco Pena is a contemporary guitarist of Paco de lucia, who's playing is still considered traditional.
Rather than give you a history of flamenco, it would be easier to give you specific info on CD's you may select to buy. So make a list of some things you are curious about and we can help you.
Ricardo
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Date Sep. 6 2006 8:25:33
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