RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for...

Costs are rising and times are tough.
Please consider a donation to keep this
place going.

Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.

This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva and Tom Blackshear who went ahead of us.

We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.

You are logged in as Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >>Discussions >>General >>

Page: << < 1 [2]

Message

<< Newer Topic Older Topic >>

ToddK

Posts: 2961
Joined: Dec. 6 2004

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to Exitao)

Javier plays that Granaina wonderfully.

But did you see the Zapateado en Re video right next to it?

The picado is there, but he needs help with rhythm and phrasing.

I wonder how old he is now. He's so excellent, wow.

How 'bout those A M I arps!?!? Jeeeezz...

_____________________________

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 0:25:10

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to Exitao)

Haha! I thought, or i used to think, gorgeous would mean something like cool, good, great... sorry my english unfortunately is influenced by "motion pictures"

_____________________________

Фламенко

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 0:26:04

ykabban

Posts: 251
Joined: Jan. 11 2006

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

I bought a guitar from Javier's father, and I told him how talented I thought his son was, and this is what he had to say:

Gracias por las palabras dedicadas a mi hijo. Sí, tiene una condiciones algo especial(habilidad, talento, etc), para esto de la guitarra, pero solo es el 2% el 98% es trabajo. Muchos ejercicios desde que tenía 4 años.

Very true, talent will only get you so far. I believe he is 17 now; absolutely amazing.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 0:39:00

nickeyg

Posts: 56
Joined: Jun. 16 2005

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

Is that his own piece? Nick

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 0:57:58

TANúñez

Posts: 2559
Joined: Jul. 10 2003
From: TEXAS

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ykabban)

quote:

Very true, talent will only get you so far. I believe he is 17 now; absolutely amazing.

You said it! Look at Paco. He wasn't born like that. He studied his tail off.

_____________________________

Tom Núñez
www.instagram.com/tanunezguitars

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 1:16:08

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to TANúñez)

Yes, before anyone whines about not having talent, do "muchos ejercicios" for 10 years and then you can evaluate your amount of talent.

_____________________________

Connect with me on Facebook, all the cool kids are doing it.
https://www.facebook.com/migueldemariaZ

Arizona Wedding Music Guitar

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 1:23:06

ToddK

Posts: 2961
Joined: Dec. 6 2004

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

Thats true for the technical end of things.

But imo, not true regarding musicianship.

There's definately a certain "lilt"/and or "Life" in one's phrasing and sound, that
imho cant be learned or practiced. Its either there or its not.
Sorry, i know the nature vs nurture argument is old and boring at this point.

Just felt like re-stating my view i guess.

_____________________________

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 1:35:46

nickeyg

Posts: 56
Joined: Jun. 16 2005

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

When watching the videos from his site a while back he definitely had the technique but lacked the musicality which I now think he is tapping in to more.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 1:41:04

ykabban

Posts: 251
Joined: Jan. 11 2006

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

Exactly Todd, that's the 2%. He posseses an intellectual maturity that cannot be excercised.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 1:50:41

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ToddK

There's definately a certain "lilt"/and or "Life" in one's phrasing and sound, that
imho cant be learned or practiced.

Todd, not to go after you, but it may be that what you are talking about is actually a separate issue. The ability to play expressively may have little to do with playing, but actually a lot more with the ability to express oneself. And that can be learned.

_____________________________

Connect with me on Facebook, all the cool kids are doing it.
https://www.facebook.com/migueldemariaZ

Arizona Wedding Music Guitar

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 2:45:21

Exitao

Posts: 907
Joined: Mar. 13 2006
From: Vancouver, Canada

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

'Musicianship' can be more than techniqe and expression. Part of it is also showmanship. Knowing how to please an audience is not really 'expression' is it?

There are tremendous artists who can play and create music that transcends, yet to see them play live is little better than listening to their CD.

There are artists who lack technique and yet put on a hell of a show. It coud be expression, it could just be a knack for pleasing a crowd.

Then there are people who have incredible technique but their 'expressiveness' is only measurable by very high level musicians and teachers (I mean the acadaemia of music).
Maybe these people become concert musicians or join symphonies.

My guess is that whatever your 'talent' for these kinds of muscianship and whatever your goals, that 10 years of intense practise certainly makes a difference.

At least I have to hope so otherwise I'll always suck.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 3:09:15

duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

The ability to express one self can be taught AND changed thru time.
BUt takes LISTENING. Im not talking about CD even if thats important to, but to listen to and to get qritique from other players that are better or equaly advanced.
Every school i ever went to has lesson in witch the whole point of the lesson is the play infront of other srudents ,ONLY the other guitarists. The after every piece no matter what genre one talks about the preformance both technique and expression and phrasings.

But then theres this microscopic diffrencs in timeing and feel that seperates Good players from Great or "becoming greats" and thats a bit harder to learn unless you have "IT"

Henrik

_____________________________

This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 5:44:20

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

For all the technic-fans, watch the video! He does a great picado without the paco handholding. He does it like the classic position without bending the fingers.
And he does a strange arpegiotechnic, but it works fine.
This is another example that every guitarrist have to find his own holding and way of doing technics. If you only try to imitate the anatomy of paco or others, I could break you down. Good video.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 7:32:02

PacoPaella

Posts: 163
Joined: Nov. 7 2004

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

Hm i have the impression that i saw him in San Fernando. I recall him (or at least some accompanying guitarist who would look very very similar) play in front of a huge crowd for different singers in the cante competition. It was a technically and musically perfect show and thats when i thought how outside spain, we try to mimic the top guitarist there, congratulate the more successful ones among us and think they are up there with the very top and then comes a bunch of these guys you never heard off and makes everyone else look like a beginner...

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 12:46:59

XXX

Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to Exitao)

Camaron - Como el agua:

At first i really thought hes playing alone!

Just visited Javier Condes website...:

quote:

Javier started playing the guitar when he was 4 years old under the supervision of his father Jose Antonio Conde, a proffesional guitarist...born 1988

I mean 4 years! That explains some things...
Regarding the arpegios, he has this sound of the g-string that im always trying to hit.

_____________________________

Фламенко

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 14:36:33

Ron.M

Posts: 7051
Joined: Jul. 7 2003
From: Scotland

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to nickeyg)

quote:

When watching the videos from his site a while back he definitely had the technique but lacked the musicality which I now think he is tapping in to more.

Definitely!

I saw some video material by him about 3 years ago and though it was quite amazing technically, wasn't greatly satifying musically.
That was a great Granainas, very mature, great development and pacing.
He's definitely one of the future Flamenco stars without a doubt.

While watching the video, I was reminded of something somebody told me a long time ago that..
"Unless you can actually close your eyes and picture yourself doing something..and actually imagine it as a credible reality...then you'll never do it!"
(Not just guitar but anything in life really)

When I watch or listen to stuff, I can sometimes feel my right hand sort of behaving sympathetically to what I'm hearing...

But THAT?!!...

I think only folk like Grisha can physically empathise with what's going on there!

To me..it's a foreign land..
I have no idea how it must physically feel to play at that level.

And I think that's when the "WOW" factor kicks in...
When it just takes more than your brain can process adequately in the time.
Your mind just boggles out and all you can think is..."for F*ck's Sake!!"

I hear it in Grisha's playing as well.

I don't care how much of a music lover or Flamenco lover you are...
IMO...you've really got to be a guitar player yourself in order to get that kick.

cheers

Ron

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 20:36:39

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

Yes, it's kind of like watching the guy hold his breath for 8 minutes. WTF as they say!

_____________________________

Connect with me on Facebook, all the cool kids are doing it.
https://www.facebook.com/migueldemariaZ

Arizona Wedding Music Guitar

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 14 2006 21:57:37

Grisha

Posts: 1263
Joined: Mar. 17 2005

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

Wow wow wow! Did you hear that run in the middle of Zapateado? My brain has trouble processing the notes at the end of it! It only happens to me when I listen to some of Paco's old recordings. Javier is that fast...

_____________________________

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 15 2006 15:38:02

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: I tube, Youtube, we all tube for... (in reply to ToddK)

Grisha,
sounds like you better start working out your pinky and go for the 4-finger picado! :)

_____________________________

Connect with me on Facebook, all the cool kids are doing it.
https://www.facebook.com/migueldemariaZ

Arizona Wedding Music Guitar

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jul. 16 2006 16:04:11