muscle knots in back

Costs are rising and times are tough.
Please consider a donation to keep this
place going.

Welcome to one of the most active flamenco sites on the Internet. Guests can read most posts but if you want to participate click here to register.

This site is dedicated to the memory of Paco de Lucía, Ron Mitchell, Guy Williams, Linda Elvira, Philip John Lee, Craig Eros, Ben Woods, David Serva and Tom Blackshear who went ahead of us.

We receive 12,200 visitors a month from 200 countries and 1.7 million page impressions a year. To advertise on this site please contact us.

You are logged in as Guest

Users viewing this topic: none

Printable Version

All Forums >>Discussions >>General >>

Page: [1]

Message

<< Newer Topic Older Topic >>

luke.park

Posts: 114
Joined: Dec. 29 2005

muscle knots in back

hi there,

i have been having this problem for a very long time now. i sit in a very popular flamenco way with right leg over left (completely) and guitar tucked in, as this is most comfortable for me. howver, i find that as i am twisting my back and spine to the right, i am get one side of knots to the left of my spine, due to the twisting. ths is a problem for me and i am going to undergo treatment for it.

the thing is, this is a short term solution for a long term problem and i have tried adapting my position when i play but i always slip bak as it is most comfortable (for some reason) and i often get worse problems in other positions. i play very relaxed so i dont think it can be stiffness wen i try other sitting positions.

does neone expereince similar if not the same problem? if so wud be good to hear how you counteract it!!
cheers,

luke

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 13 2006 19:16:05

Escribano

Posts: 6418
Joined: Jul. 6 2003
From: England, living in Italy

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to luke.park) 1 votes

quote:

does neone expereince similar if not the same problem? if so wud be good to hear how you counteract it!!

I go to a Pilates class twice a week. Lot's of stretching, abs and lower back work.

_____________________________

Foro Flamenco founder and Admin

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 13 2006 21:38:03

Miguel de Maria

Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to luke.park)

Luke,
I get tension-related injuries quite a bit, so I'm no one to give advice. You might do some searches here on playing position and such, because a lot of other people have given good advice on this type of issue.

_____________________________

Connect with me on Facebook, all the cool kids are doing it.
https://www.facebook.com/migueldemariaZ

Arizona Wedding Music Guitar

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 14 2006 15:01:38

seanm

Posts: 169
Joined: Apr. 5 2005
From: Halifax, Nova Scotia

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to luke.park)

Luke,

If you are sitting in a fully crossed leg position, you are probably leaning forward over the guitar when you play. You should make sure that you are sitting up right so that your upper torso is balanced above you hips and you do not need to use back muscles to support yourself. Try a foot stool or the now classic PDL poistion and sit tall. Check out Alexander technique (esp. the concept of a string holding you up from the top of your head) and the idea of centering your weight (something about making yourself feel really heavy).

Basically, as you probably know, your issue is most likely simply tension building up somewhere. I suspect back muscles combined with shoulder muscles which are so often the culprit. Try to become aware of what is tense when you play. Start by relaxing your whole body then play and concentrate on you back, shoulders, legs etc to see what is getting tense. Once you notice the problem area focus on relaxing. Eventually, you will loose the tension for good but it can take months of being this aware depending on how ingrained the tension is and how practice you are at relaxing muscles on command.

I recently switched from both feet on the ground in a very low chair to a higher chair and PDL style. For the first week my leg/foot would go to sleep and my hip would ache and I'd limp away after a 15 minute practice session. Now I don't even notice I'm sitting that way .. it feels very natural. Once I let my hip relax (the culprit! ... I was holding the position from my hip muscles!) everything relaxed and it feel completely natural now. Good luck.

Sean

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 14 2006 15:56:12

luke.park

Posts: 114
Joined: Dec. 29 2005

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to seanm)

hi guys,

thanks for the advice. seanm, my friend is a classical guitarist and shes training to be a teacher of the alexander technique. shes done the whole screwing my neck out of the shoulders thing and tsught me the basics. like you said, i just need to discipline myself to really pay attention to the most tense muscles. in the past ive tried the PDL position but my leg and hip has also hurt, making me limp away. i will try a persistence a you have done with this position as i feel that when i do try sitting like this i have a straighter back. thanks all.

luke

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 17 2006 16:39:22

John O.

Posts: 1723
Joined: Dec. 16 2005
From: Seeheim-Jugenheim, Germany

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to luke.park)

I have scoliosis and I can say although I play with the PDL position, it's the worst thing you can do for your lower back. Crossing the leg over horizontally will push the lower part of the spine outward while putting pressure from your upper body on top of it. It can also give you pain in your groin muscle, as I think you described.

I perform cross legged but practise in the classical position without a foot stool. When you practise cross legged for hours a day, most of the time you won't be concentrating on keeping your back straight. If you have an office job as well then you're not far off from a slipped disk.

This is only based on my experience, I have a very bad back to begin with.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 21 2006 20:40:52

Doitsujin

Posts: 5078
Joined: Apr. 10 2005

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to luke.park)

I allways had problems with my back in past too when I played in the classical position. In the PDL position my right leg allways strarts sleeping. I tested Sabicas position, but thats only possible for yogafraeks I think. It hurt very much.
At the end I sit there very natural I think. The left leg, you put 45degrees to the left. The right one goes streight ahead. You put the guitar on the right leg. Manolo Sanlucar plays in a similar position, just a bit different. I think thats the best for your back.
In general, if something hurts, there is something wrong. So dont force it.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 22 2006 9:12:32

duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to luke.park)

i have some pain in my ring finger. the 3rd on my left hand. Probably some minor infection in the tendon, I play sort of 20-40min a day now. trying to give it some rest
now im going away for a few days. i won´t bring my guitar.
Guess i need 3-4 day off.

but it sucks cause staying away from the guitar gives me a huge amount of inspiration so i realy suffer! ay ay ay
you know, it must be like trying to stop smokeing, i don´t smoke but i imageing the abstinence beign the same.
I go crazy, when i can´t play.

_____________________________

This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 22 2006 10:13:55

John O.

Posts: 1723
Joined: Dec. 16 2005
From: Seeheim-Jugenheim, Germany

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to duende)

I know exactly what you mean. It's funny though, when I'm on vacation with my guitar, I'm majorly stressed whenever I can't play. When I'm on vacation without my guitar and come to grips with the fact that I won't be playing, I can relax...

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 22 2006 11:45:32

Exitao

Posts: 907
Joined: Mar. 13 2006
From: Vancouver, Canada

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to duende)

quote:

i have some pain in my ring finger. the 3rd on my left hand. Probably some minor infection in the tendon,

Raise your arms straight out
then bring your hands back inward and touch the backs of them flat together so that your upper arms are parallel to the floor, with your elbows almost at right angles with the fingers pointing down.

Does the finger tingle when you do this?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 22 2006 15:55:33

duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to Exitao)

nope. no tingling

_____________________________

This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 22 2006 15:57:52

Exitao

Posts: 907
Joined: Mar. 13 2006
From: Vancouver, Canada

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to luke.park)

Good. If there had been tingling that would have indicated a Repetitive Stress Injury.

An RSI would be terrible in your case.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 22 2006 16:03:07

duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to Exitao)

i always worrie about injurys.
it´s not funny. If it´s not tinitus its the fingers or the back or the shoulders.

It would be comforting to know all the injurys the pros have.
In one interwie in flamenco worl Paco had real PAIN in his pinky.
Im sure his back hurt to.

if one plays long enough there will be some strain on the body no matter how relaxed you are.

_____________________________

This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 22 2006 16:17:23

duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to luke.park)

hm..my finger stopped hurting. it´s been hurting for over a week and just now it stopped. hope it stays away and i won´t bring the guitar with me anyway.

im gona go and pluck me some mushrooms. mmm nice long walks.
play with my cats.
it can only do my inspiration good.

plucking mushrooms is realy good. 2-3 hrs in the woods under complete silence.
think, focusing on mushrooms. frying them in butter at , with a nice beer. it´s well worht the "hunt"

_____________________________

This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 22 2006 16:41:54

Exitao

Posts: 907
Joined: Mar. 13 2006
From: Vancouver, Canada

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to luke.park)

Inspirational mushrooms?

Are they legal?

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 23 2006 2:02:39

duende

Posts: 3053
Joined: Dec. 15 2003
From: Sweden

RE: muscle knots in back (in reply to Exitao)

well mushrooms grow in the woods.
the ones im looking for are yellow and goes by the name kantarell (in swedish)
very tasty maybe it´s called cantrell in english

i wouldn´t know.
another yummy mushroom is "carl-Johan" don´t know the english name for that one either.

Didn´t find any yesterday. Not enough rain. but the sesson starts now so in a week maybe.

Im out on an island enjoying island living away from the guitar. But im listening the my mp3 all the time or i´ll go nuts Manuel morao is a hot one. his "siguiriyas" cd.
diffrent singers from Jerez do sigiuriyas.

cheerio!

_____________________________

This is hard stuff!
Don't give up...
And don't make it a race.
Enjoy the ray of sunshine that comes with every new step in knowledge.

RON

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Jun. 24 2006 9:21:44