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RE: A QUESTION ??
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Ricardo
Posts: 14848
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC
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 RE: A QUESTION ?? (in reply to Miguel de Maria)
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Miguel, you are right on, it is a constant problem. Now imagine the other guys you talked about saying, "damn that guy Miguel just keeps wanting more volume, I don't get it". That is the way it goes. I want the rhythm guy 50% volume compared to lead, but some guys don't strum hard enough. It bugs me when the other guy does not cut back his rhythm volume after soloing. One guy I know, will push his on-board eq up for more volume after we set the stuff for soundcheck. Guaranteed distortion. Luckily, it is my gear so I just give myself more volume and cut his gain when he does that. It is a constant struggle. Honestly, if the rhythm guitar is not tight, I would rather it not be heard clearly. The ideal set up is one loud guy on lead, and the rhythm guy half that volume, and you just leave the levels set. It is always the lead trade offs that cause trouble. When I play through another guy's gear, I let him decide the levels and just deal with the level difference.
Flamenco show with dancers/singer: the dancer checks the floor with on toe, tap tap. The singer, a foot away from the the mic with speaking voice "test, test, louder please....test test, good". And the guitarist, a foot away plays a soft scale "louder please, cut the bass". That is the sound test.
Then the show starts. The singer eats the mic and screams, the dancer stomps and jumps, The guitarist puts the hole up to the mic and strums tresillos with the whole arm. It all sounds distorted until the sound guy turns it down, then everyone complains after the show " I could not hear myself!" 
Ricardo
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Date Jan. 25 2006 20:49:07
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Mark2
Posts: 1877
Joined: Jul. 12 2004
From: San Francisco
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RE: A QUESTION ?? (in reply to Miguel de Maria)
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Ha Ha! It's so true, everybody wants more of "ME" in the monitor. It's a sign of poor musicianship in many cases, although there are great players who overplay too. I really think a member of any ensemble should be listening at least with one ear, if not both, to the sound of the group, not concentrating only on what they are playing. Then the rhythm guitarist knows when the soloist is not projecting enough, the soloist knows when he is too loud, etc. Once I was leading a gig with a four piece, and I heard some low rumbling, so I turned around and told the bass player to turn it down. He says "I'm not playing" It was actually something feeding back. I was so embarrassed. I told the other guitarist what happened on the break. He smiled and said "Tell him to turn it down anyway!"
A strong leader really helps a group. The first pro group I ever played with was a ten piece show group in 1979. The leader charted everyone's parts and could hear everything. The keyboard player resisted playing a part as it was on the recording, and he told her "If you have to hate me to play this part right, then go ahead and hate me, but play the part right." I was having trouble with this little syncopated part on a Doobie brothers tune. It was an insignificant little rythem part, and I could barely hear it on the recording. For a week I faked it, and the guy called me on it. One night, I tore the part apart and got it. The next day, I played it right. The guy turned around and said "Congrats, you finally got that part right. " I really respected that guy's leadership and musicanship. Up until then playing music was for me about fellowship and good times-this guy didn't care what it took, he was going to try to make it sound right.
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Date Jan. 25 2006 22:19:03
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sorin popovici
Posts: 427
Joined: Jan. 7 2005
From: Iasi, Romania
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RE: A QUESTION ?? (in reply to Ron.M)
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I really dont think that the tendency to showoff is smth that have only bad musicians.
It's more like about recognition....usually they are young and want to be noticed ,just
like kids .All players have it usually ...in one form or the other,but the ability
to not listen to reason ...that's disturbing probably.But I guess everybody learns that
not everything should be a war ...when they lose one or they reach a certain age and
maturity where the fastest thing or loudest thing is not the goal anymore.But even if
u get to this conclusion ,trying to reach 240 bpm can teach u things .I agree that in the
process u should not offend anyone.
if u just compose relying on your music theory knowledge and ear ,maybe technique
is not that good..but for me I find that having a better technique than yesterday teaches
me things that I didnt know.For instance ....if u can play at 240bpm ,I guess that if u wanna squeeze a picado somewhere ..u got to be very exact and feel the rhytm good.
Sure maybe I'm imagining ..but I observed this cause I made a little progress in picado:
when hearing a fast run I feel like i hear it more clearly than I was before.
My point is that a lot of people learn music theory and do ear training without knowing
when they practice.For example I as beginner always treated accents poorly and not
beeing very aware of this problem but until I didnt spend some time doing a run
like C b a (8-7-5 on E string) and observing that because of i-m alternance i was
really doing one C b a and one measure of c B a ,I thought i was ok.Seeing Nunez in
his video was like ..."damn, that's why I sound like crap...my accents are wrong".
Now i'm at least aware of this....it will still take 10 years .
I've digressed ..what I was saying is that because of the whole "showoff" issue ,people
tend to say like "technique is not important,the music is important" and I wanted to say
that technique can teach u music and viceversa and sometimes doing stupid exercises
u can learn pretty things.Ofcourse if u are ear trained enough ,maybe u dont need it.
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Date Jan. 26 2006 0:56:16
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XXX
Posts: 4400
Joined: Apr. 14 2005
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RE: A QUESTION ?? (in reply to Ron.M)
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Paco is not a show off. Dont know whether I mentioned this 
Showing off CAN have something to do with the playing ability, but it doesnt HAVE TO.
Dont you know that kind of guys that can only play a Am-pentatonic and feel like they are kings on the guitar?
And even if lets say somebody has a good picado or can do one technique good, is that what you consider a complete guitarist/good player?
This is not a hyper-theoretical question, it happens everyday. Most of all, I didnt expect to argue about that, I thought it was obvious, and apart from that was only an observation.
I didnt also expect to talk on definitions what showing off means, 
If Paco is showing off, how r u going to seperate him from the "real" show offs, who are not at least interested in things of art, or flamenco, like benise or benice whatever his name was...
quote:
Its fun impressing people with technique. So what?
Nothing :)
PdL, Tomatito have great techniques. I hope in his next album Paco will put at least 10 long picado runs in every track, no joke.
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Фламенко
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Date Jan. 26 2006 20:44:21
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Miguel de Maria
Posts: 3532
Joined: Oct. 20 2003
From: Phoenix, AZ
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RE: A QUESTION ?? (in reply to XXX)
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Phrygus
Showing off CAN have something to do with the playing ability, but it doesnt HAVE TO.
Dont you know that kind of guys that can only play a Am-pentatonic and feel like they are kings on the guitar?
This is not a hyper-theoretical question, it happens everyday. Most of all, I didnt expect to argue about that, I thought it was obvious, and apart from that was only an observation.
Phrygus,
What I'm going to say will come off as confrontational. But you have a tendency to say rather ridiculous things and then defend it by saying that was you said was in no way controversial. And you seem to be surprised when anyone disagrees with what you say. In my opinion, your opinions about showing off are unprofessional, silly, and immature. Here you have Florian, Todd, Ron, and myself talking about technical display as a fun and legitimate form of performance, and it seems to go in one ear and not the other. Do you actually read what people write here?
Is there a language barrier we are contending with? Anyway, if you want to be taken seriously, it might be better to try to say something with some internal logic or examples rather than unsubstantiated and incoherent rambling!
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Arizona Wedding Music Guitar
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Date Jan. 26 2006 21:37:04
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I asked the same question on another forum a time ago and they also misunderstood it. 
and not just a litlle modest bit , i love it ALOT, i need to take it easy right know cause i gave myself an erect nail