technique question: arpeggio

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Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

technique question: arpeggio

Dear fellow forum members,

I have a question about arpeggio. Say I want to play a double arpeggio (up and down) with p on the bass string and ima on the top 3 strings (GBE) as you do a lot in Solea.

The problem I have when playing arpeggio fast is as follows: the forward arpeggio goes well, however when I subsequently play the backward arpeggio, my m finger misses the string (the B string). I think the problem is caused by the m finger being to much displaced from the B string after the forward arpeggio.

What I try to do now is play the backward arpeggio slowly and plant my m finger on the B string.

Anyone else has this problem and/or exercises to prevent it?

Thanks and happy flamenco playing to you all,

Jurriaan

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Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 23 2014 10:45:04

Dudnote

Posts: 1805
Joined: Nov. 13 2007

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Jurriaan)

Is this just when you play fast? Play it slow 10000 times and you should be all set up.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 23 2014 11:52:22

eitanfar

Posts: 68
Joined: Oct. 16 2014

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Jurriaan)

I had the same problem.
I could do the pima really fast, as well as the pami, but the pimami was presenting a problem.
I also tried methods such as you're attempting, but they didn't really work for me.
The only thing that worked for me, alas, was practicing the pimami extremely slowly a long time until I gained the needed speed (and I still have a lot of room for improvement on that).

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 23 2014 12:23:11

Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Jurriaan)

Thanks for your replies. I was afraid of your answer: I am just playing to fast. I find this frustrating about flamenco: many techniques only start to sound good at reasonable speed, but you have to practice long slowly to reach it...

_____________________________

Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 23 2014 12:27:00

Ricardo

Posts: 14828
Joined: Dec. 14 2004
From: Washington DC

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Jurriaan)

http://www.foroflamenco.com/tm.asp?m=17801&appid=&p=&mpage=1&key=

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CD's and transcriptions available here:
www.ricardomarlow.com

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 23 2014 14:57:14

Dudnote

Posts: 1805
Joined: Nov. 13 2007

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Dudnote)

When my up-down arpegios start falling apart I often go back to playing basic escobilla from alegrias. There are a few advantages. First, it is good to be able to keep doing these argegios as an escobilla starts to get faster e.g. when playing with dancers. Second, you can mix it up with all your other techniques to avoid the repetitive strain that probably would come about if you did nothing but arpegios for 30 minutes.

Another freeee option is to play some tarantas and then start improvising base note melodies whilst keeping your up down arpegios going on open strings - once feeling confortable start playing with some non-open string fingerings and get inventive with chord shapes - who knows, you might hit on some melody line you could then turn into a falseta. Mix it up and have fun with it.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 24 2014 1:08:18

Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Jurriaan)

All great advice (also in that pre-existing thread there you posted Ricardo), thanks. In a way I find it reassuring that this is apparently a common problem experienced by flamenco players. Like Dudnote, I always try to incorporate technique exercise into a nice chord progression to make it less boring.

Best wishes for the holidays,

jurriaan

_____________________________

Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 24 2014 16:45:24

Cervantes

Posts: 503
Joined: Jun. 14 2014
From: Encinitas, CA USA

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Jurriaan)

My teacher has worked a lot with me on this.
As others have mentioned play it slowly at first.
Also make sure your nails are in good shape and one isn't longer / shorter than the other.
When you are going backwards (a-m-i) pluck the a finger then immediately plant the m finger on the B string but don't play it, just plant it, then play it. Repeat for the i finger. Make sure your fingers stay close to the strings at all times, mine were moving away from the strings at times. Also when you pluck the string think of the tip of your finger as moving inward toward your palm, this is another area I had a problem with. This will give you better tone and prevent striking the next string. Hope this helps, it did for me.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 24 2014 19:40:27

Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Cervantes)

Thanks Cervantes. Well, with all this expert advice, my arpeggio's are bound to improve.

Happy Newtonmas to you all.

Jurriaan

_____________________________

Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 25 2014 9:20:00

revendel

Posts: 97
Joined: Dec. 27 2013

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Jurriaan)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jurriaan

Thanks for your replies. I was afraid of your answer: I am just playing to fast. I find this frustrating about flamenco: many techniques only start to sound good at reasonable speed, but you have to practice long slowly to reach it...

Put metronome on 150. Play staccato only.
Raise 10 BPM every 15minutes.
You will see instant results after 2 hours of playing.
Do everyday for permanent results.

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 26 2014 7:45:34

Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to revendel)

Now we are getting serious, wow 2 hours only arpeggio training... I thought I was disciplined but I can not compete with that Revendel (I have 1 hour a day available for flamenco) ;-)

_____________________________

Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 27 2014 22:22:36

gerundino63

Posts: 1743
Joined: Jul. 11 2003
From: The Netherlands

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Jurriaan)

If you repeat something the same for two hours, and that is the way to train yourself, one day in your guitar live you will get an injury. Probably tendonitis.
It is much better to train something for at most 5 minuters ultra slow. That way you train your brain instead of your hand.
Your hand is allready prepared to execute everything on guitar. It is not the hand that need exersice. It is your brain.

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REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 27 2014 23:28:10

Jurriaan

Posts: 48
Joined: Dec. 14 2011
From: Netherlands

RE: technique question: arpeggio (in reply to Jurriaan)

Hmm, yes I suspect that in the relationship between the duration of continuous practice and improvement, there is a law of diminishing return: the amount of improvement will reduce with longer intervals. Also, the psychology of learning (say lists of words) suggests that more frequent shorter intervals of practice give more results that longer less frequent intervals.

_____________________________

Playing music is not difficult - you just have to play the right note at the right time (J.S. Bach)

REPORT THIS POST AS INAPPROPRIATE | Date Dec. 28 2014 22:02:11